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Old 04-21-2012, 01:13 AM   #1
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Default Education With A Dose of Kindness

I wanted to post this to try and make some understand how people feel who come here and read about what they should and should not of done when purchasing their new puppy after the fact. I will state my experience hope it helps. When I was younger we had poms for pets and were very fortunate to have been sent to a show breeder who pampered them to get our babies...later many years later, I lost my father, closed my salon and all in a few months time and I was very lonely. My children suggested a yorkie and we started looking and asking. Noone we talked to could recommend anyone so there was sigh,,, the internet. That is how we found Laddy. I had never experienced a puppy mill before but when we drove 3 hours to pick him up I knew where he was raised was just wrongggggg. That being said I held this tiny sickly little guy in my arms and my hubby said he wasnt sure we should take him as he looked weak but I just knew he would die if I didnt. Some of you will say this was "enabling " the puppy mill owners and maybe it was to save his life but it was done from my heart. Fast forward....we bring Laddy home and the first night he won't eat or drink and is lethargic. You can find my paniced threads on here after I searched and searched on what to do for him and found YT. Thankfully back then people were not so judgemental and helped me get him over the hump and to a beautiful healthy dog. I did try to put a stop to the place who sold him to me but nothing worked as they are still in business. And yes laddy was only 9 weeks old when I brought him home I had no idea he should be older. I have said all this to say that if had been treated bad when I asked for help I dont know if I would of ever came back to YT again. I thoroughly enjoy all I learn here and that would of been a shame. Yes we all want honesty but sometimes a dose of kindness with it goes a very long way . Anyway all my YT friends I love this place and just had to get this off my chest as I have gotten a couple pms from new people who thanked me for being kind and were very hurt at the responses they had recieved from others. Not to say I have always been kind, i have reread some of my responses and have spanked myself over the way I worded them also. God bless everyone hope this helps us all to try to educate with kindness.
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Old 04-21-2012, 02:04 AM   #2
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This was well put. I am fairly new to YT myself and have been shocked at some of the slap downs people have received especially when they have already gotten the pup and are looking to make things better for it.
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Old 04-21-2012, 03:05 AM   #3
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You put that wonderfully!!! Thanks for saying it...
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Old 04-21-2012, 03:06 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by nanahas3 View Post
I had never experienced a puppy mill before but when we drove 3 hours to pick him up I knew where he was raised was just wrongggggg. That being said I held this tiny sickly little guy in my arms and my hubby said he wasnt sure we should take him as he looked weak but I just knew he would die if I didnt. Some of you will say this was "enabling " the puppy mill owners and maybe it was to save his life but it was done from my heart.
And that's where the problem lies...

The money you handed over for your puppy supports all the other dogs continuing to exist in those conditions that you recognized as being wrong...so you directly supported a puppy mill.

While some posts may seem harsh (and without doubt, some are unnecessarily so...), remember that ALL posts are not only directed to the OP, but are also part of the YT library of threads for future people to come along and read.
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Old 04-21-2012, 03:32 AM   #5
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Charlene,I think many many people would be so greatful to come here and have their questions awnsered without being judged
Im not new to yorke forums (not even this one)..I got my first yorkie (Lady) 8 years ago and thats when I joined a few different ones to educate myself on the breed.

Lady was T I N Y.She was under 2lbs at 8 years old,so you can imagine what she was like at 6 weeks old when I brought her home.I had owned a dog before her,so I wasnt worried about her age,but I had never owned a yorkie,so I was concerned about her size.I joined a forum and asked how big people thought she´d be and wow...NO ONE helped me.Infact,the only awnsers I got were "you shouldent have that puppy!!" or "what kinf breeder doesthat!?"..I even got acused of getting her from a puppymill..I mean come on! I live on a TINY island dedicated to tourism..we barely have room for living space,let alone puppymills! lol.
It wasnt just a one of thing either.Later,I got Jess and Chicco and the exact same thing happened.It didnt matter what I wanted to know or what worries I had,infact,people didnt even comment when I posted pictures,because aparantly,I was a bad person for having such a young puppy,so people ignored me.
There was only one forum back then that trully helped me,and although that place disapeered,I still have those amazing women on my facebook even today Villette (a veteran on here) is one of those women.

In different countries,there are obviously different rules,different habbits etc,and some people may not understand or agree with how things work..but EVERYONE deserves to be welcomed and helped no matter what.
No one should be given the cold shoulder just because they are uneduacted or because in their country,you can bring home a 6 week old puppy (my case).Someone is uneducated? Well that´s what this place is for right? They have a 6 week old puppy? Well,ok..it may not be ideal in many peoples eyes,but why not help so that the person does a good job raising his/her puppy instead of going on and on about how they shouldent have it yet?

Thankfully,I am plenty used to being told that I shouldent have my puppys yet,and asked why I do,so I wasnt surprised when I came back here and the same thing happened AGAIN..Its kinda getting old now lol.
This is why I always try to jump in and help those in my same situation and I will never judge anyone because I have no idea where they are coming from.Im very glad you started this post..Newbies join to be helped and to share their exitement,so help them and celebrate is all I´ll ever do
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Old 04-21-2012, 03:54 AM   #6
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Old 04-21-2012, 04:06 AM   #7
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Most people on here are concerned about the pups, the pups come first on YT, thats what its all about, ADVOCATING FOR THE PUPS. Harsh advise and or admonishment is doled out in attempts to educate you and others who may come along and read the thread. There are many people here who are professionals, many people who are wonderful breeders and many people like myself who are simply experienced Yorkie owners, mods and admin, we are all here for the pups.

I can't count how many times someone comes on here and says I've been reading here a long time and just got my first Yorkie...then go on to complain that their dog is "too big", sickly, and describe all the red flags that were present... but purchased the pup anyway, all the things that had they read here, they should have known.

I wish I had known about Yorkie Talk before I purchased my Miss Mini from a Pet Store, as much as I love her, as much as I know I rescued her, as much as I have spent financially and emotionally, as much as I will miss her when shes gone, I WOULD NOT have purchased her.

Collectively, almost everyone on here is giving advice in order to better you as a Yorkie owner,so that your Yorkie is well cared for, and help aid anyone else who is reading to make good decisions. Some folks don't like to hear the truth because the truth is sometimes hard to hear.

People get heated up sometimes, because we are all passionate about the Yorkies, this is why we are here. Taking it personal? I remember I did a thread once when I was very very ill about canceling my pups appt at the vets. I got slammed, over and over again, I didn't get angry I thought "wow these people really care about these pups", I defended myself because I realized they didn't understand what I was trying to say, often the written word doesn't convey whats really going on. None the less, I did go to the vet!!!

Please don't expect true YT'ers to sit back and say "oh its ok you bought a teacup" "oh its ok you bought a puppy mill dog" "oh its ok you want to breed your great dane with your yorkie" etc., its not going to happen.

Most people see what the real intentions of the folks here are, we take our lumps cuz we know we deserve them, and because we respect those who have come before us!!! We stick around, like you because we know the true spirit of YT and although we sometimes have to take breaks, we come back because we all genuinely CARE AND WANT TO ADVOCATE FOR THE PUPS.
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Last edited by lynzy420; 04-21-2012 at 04:08 AM.
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Old 04-21-2012, 04:12 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by KazzyK810 View Post
And that's where the problem lies...

The money you handed over for your puppy supports all the other dogs continuing to exist in those conditions that you recognized as being wrong...so you directly supported a puppy mill.

While some posts may seem harsh (and without doubt, some are unnecessarily so...), remember that ALL posts are not only directed to the OP, but are also part of the YT library of threads for future people to come along and read.
x100

Oh and by the way 7 years later I am helping to establish laws with legislators who are actively trying to close the place I purchased my pup from, I go in and talk to customers, I continue to try to educate others in my shoes, I picket the store and am now joined by several others....Its all about the Yorkies!
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Old 04-21-2012, 05:43 AM   #9
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The thing is these are typed words and you can never tell how they are said. Also people will see these threads who might not have gotten there puppy and will see 8 weeks is not good and buying from a puppy mill is not good. I think some people will take a post of just straight info and see it as a nasty negative post when its not. After getting the 8 week old puppy or buying from a puppy mill or breeding your dog when you should have you still need to understand why its not good so you know in the future. The people here care for yorkies greatly and yorkies don't have a voice so we have to be there voice. I know I will never go oh awesome puppy it was so great you bought them from a puppy mill and there 8 weeks old oh and your gonna breed them that super. I have a puppy mill pup with many problems and I feel its my job to speak out and let others know about what I have been through with my yorkie no I would never change her but people need to know the terrible side of these puppy mills and the issues dogs can have from buying one from a puppy mill. Your not just informing the poster with your reply your informing everyone who reads it.
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Old 04-21-2012, 05:50 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by lynzy420 View Post
Most people on here are concerned about the pups, the pups come first on YT, thats what its all about, ADVOCATING FOR THE PUPS. Harsh advise and or admonishment is doled out in attempts to educate you and others who may come along and read the thread. There are many people here who are professionals, many people who are wonderful breeders and many people like myself who are simply experienced Yorkie owners, mods and admin, we are all here for the pups.

I can't count how many times someone comes on here and says I've been reading here a long time and just got my first Yorkie...then go on to complain that their dog is "too big", sickly, and describe all the red flags that were present... but purchased the pup anyway, all the things that had they read here, they should have known.

I wish I had known about Yorkie Talk before I purchased my Miss Mini from a Pet Store, as much as I love her, as much as I know I rescued her, as much as I have spent financially and emotionally, as much as I will miss her when shes gone, I WOULD NOT have purchased her.

Collectively, almost everyone on here is giving advice in order to better you as a Yorkie owner,so that your Yorkie is well cared for, and help aid anyone else who is reading to make good decisions. Some folks don't like to hear the truth because the truth is sometimes hard to hear.

People get heated up sometimes, because we are all passionate about the Yorkies, this is why we are here. Taking it personal? I remember I did a thread once when I was very very ill about canceling my pups appt at the vets. I got slammed, over and over again, I didn't get angry I thought "wow these people really care about these pups", I defended myself because I realized they didn't understand what I was trying to say, often the written word doesn't convey whats really going on. None the less, I did go to the vet!!!

Please don't expect true YT'ers to sit back and say "oh its ok you bought a teacup" "oh its ok you bought a puppy mill dog" "oh its ok you want to breed your great dane with your yorkie" etc., its not going to happen.

Most people see what the real intentions of the folks here are, we take our lumps cuz we know we deserve them, and because we respect those who have come before us!!! We stick around, like you because we know the true spirit of YT and although we sometimes have to take breaks, we come back because we all genuinely CARE AND WANT TO ADVOCATE FOR THE PUPS.
Good advice is always welcome-ALWAYS.
But alot of the time,whilst some people think that they are educating others and being helpful,what they´re doing is being judgemental and basiclly calling them idiots (beleive me,this is how it comes across)
Anyone who has seen a video or read about BYB,puppyills etc is NEVER going to support that kind of thing-NEVER,so coming down on a new owner like a ton of bricks because they have made a mistake that stems from inocent ignorance is not fair.Infact,most of the time,these people feel offended and insulted and they dont come back,so where do they go for help now? kwim?
Example..lets say a person joins and seems to have purchaised puppy from a breeder with a bad reputation.She joins,asks a few questions,mentions the background of her puppy and then BAM,suddenly she´s being attacked and acused of aiding puppymills and supporting BYB...
What exactly do we expect of this person? To give her puppy back? Leave? Take the judging and finger pointing with a pinch of salt? Shall we make her stand in a corner?
Lets face it,once she has her puppy,has fallen inlove with it,lets give her the advice she needs shall we? She made a mistake? Yes! Should we explain why? Yes.But that doesnt mean she has to face post after post of people telling her that she should of done her homework,that she did a terrible thing etc..Im sorry but I dont think thats OK.
There are many ways to get a message across without making someone feel so unwelcome
You (in general) care and want to advocate for the puppies,but remember,people who buy a yorkie do it because they love the breed too

We all love and advocate for the puppies..everyone who is already here and those who join-All of us.No one buys a puppy and doesnt care.Some people dont start reading about their pup until they buy it,that´s all,and we cant exactly shoot them down for that.I have three kids and I´ve never picked up a book..yet here they are (15,12 and 3 years old)..go figure

To the bolded part fo your post,I asure you that no one comes onto a forum like this expecting everyone else to applaud their desitions,but I dont think they expect to be so harshly judged either,and I hate to think they leave and havent gotten the advice or help they needed to make their puppys life more comfortable kwim?
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Old 04-21-2012, 05:57 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by KazzyK810 View Post
And that's where the problem lies...

The money you handed over for your puppy supports all the other dogs continuing to exist in those conditions that you recognized as being wrong...so you directly supported a puppy mill.

While some posts may seem harsh (and without doubt, some are unnecessarily so...), remember that ALL posts are not only directed to the OP, but are also part of the YT library of threads for future people to come along and read.


I really agree with this. I have often seen very harsh posts on here, and yes itt does chase people away, BUT i truelly believe ALOT of the members on here try to educate in a nice way. I really think the site has gotten a whole lot better. I do also think the information on here is vital to those still looking fir breeders. Like with me, I got my puppy and he was sick, there was nothing i could do about it then, but i am so grateful to those who showed me the red flags (after i had gotten Ziggy). Now I am better educated and do pass that info along when asked. And it has come in very handy now that I am looking to add to my family.

Those that are rude are in the minority, I believe... And I hope people will stick around and not be chased away or hurt by these few..
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Old 04-21-2012, 06:04 AM   #12
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I have been a member of YT for over one year now. I primarily choose to read only, why cause many times this forum becomes a soap box for certain members to rant about puppy mills and back yard breeders. Certainly we all would like to stop puppy mills, but most people have to learn life lessons at their own pace. I have had the opportunity in my life to have always owned show quality dogs of many breeds. Except for my Standard Poodle, which came from England they have all had problems. So purchasing any dog, there can be problems. I purposely bought my Keno as a larger yorkie. I had hoped for him to weigh around 10 lbs. Well he is pushing 15 lbs and has lp in both back legs. He was purchased as pet quality and I saw both parents. He is akc registered and neutered, at the age of 6 months. Now I have had over 45 years of experience owning show dogs and pet quality akc dogs. Some from show breeders and some from backyard breeders. I can not say that there was that much difference in health of the dogs. The current trend of super small dogs in many of the toy breeds concerns me more than backyard breeders. Just my opinion.
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Old 04-21-2012, 07:35 AM   #13
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the prolem is what one person sees as rude another sees as direct. I am a direct person and it comes accross in my postings and it could e misconsude as rude when I dont mean it in a rude way. You cant read tone in written posts. I see people called rude just cause they arent aggreeing with the op or they are direct. You can e in disagrieance with someone and not e rude. We are not all going to aggree on here nor should we. This is a forum with alot of different personalities and opinons
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Old 04-21-2012, 07:51 AM   #14
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I purposely bought my Keno as a larger yorkie. <snip> The current trend of super small dogs in many of the toy breeds concerns me
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Old 04-21-2012, 07:53 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KazzyK810 View Post
And that's where the problem lies...

The money you handed over for your puppy supports all the other dogs continuing to exist in those conditions that you recognized as being wrong...so you directly supported a puppy mill.

While some posts may seem harsh (and without doubt, some are unnecessarily so...), remember that ALL posts are not only directed to the OP, but are also part of the YT library of threads for future people to come along and read.
Believe me I understand this now but when I got Laddy I was totally uninformed as many who come here are. I felt horrible after finding this site and realizing this but the act was already done. I knew Laddy was sick and I needed help, yes I agree that if you haven't purchased a puppy yet, or like me have, you do need to be informed but not "judged". I just feel that being to critical will cause lots to just not come back and it is not helping at all to have them become upset and decide to ignore the advice given. I fight puppy mills now with all that is in me. My second little girl was a rescue and I have been involved every way I know how in shutting them down here in Missouri but there is only so much I can do. That is what I mean though, people were nice to me here not judging me and it helped me understand the real situtation behind puppy mills.
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