Yorkie-poo's... Yay or Nay

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by Jemma

Mutts are supposedly called mutts because parentage is unkown. Shorkies, morkies whatever are crossbreds, but the parents are known.

Generally speaking, that depends on who's definition you are referring to. If people are basing that off their own definition of the word, then "mutt" can be whatever you want it to mean. If it's being based of an actual definition from a dictionary, then a mutt can be any combination of breeds, in which case, the term is being used correctly.

From Webster's Online Dictionary:
Main Entry: mutt
Pronunciation: \ˈmət\
Function: noun
Etymology: short for muttonhead dull-witted person
2 : a mongrel dog : cur
Main Entry: mon·grel
Pronunciation: \ˈmäŋ-grəl, ˈməŋ-\
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, probably from mong mixture, short for ymong, from Old English gemong crowd — more at among
Date: 15th century
1: an individual resulting from the interbreeding of diverse breeds or strains ; especially : one of unknown ancestry
2: a cross between types of persons or things

Originally Posted by Jemma

Who is to say that someday a Shorkie won't be recognized by the AKC? After all it took 2 or more different breeds to develop our pure breeds today.

I own a Shorkie, which their is also a Shorkie Club of America

You are right...all breeds originated as the results of various breeds cross bred, Yorkies included. However, it was done with a purpose, with dogs being carefully selected and bred to enhance traits desireable for a specific role...not just to create more cute dogs. There was a standard developed and breeders made a coordinated effort to adhere to it...there was a set, goal 'type' they were trying to produce. That is not being done with the cross bred dogs that are being mass produced today.

[hugz4all4]

Originally Posted by cj125

Technically, only your cats are rescues. Getting one from a breeder and one from a friend isn't what people consider rescues... or else "saving" a puppy from a petstore would be one, too!

Thanks for correcting me..

[hugz4all4]

Originally Posted by phfgkl

LOL see, this is the way it should be. We can all disagree, but, should still continue to like eachother. kind of like my marriage

whats the point in arguing about something that is just going to go nowhere??

[phfgkl]

Originally Posted by hugz4all4

whats the point in arguing about something that is just going to go nowhere??

That's right.

[cj125]

Originally Posted by hugz4all4

Thanks for correcting me..

No problem!

[QuickSilver]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

You are right...all breeds originated as the results of various breeds cross bred, Yorkies included. However, it was done with a purpose, with dogs being carefully selected and bred to enhance traits desireable for a specific role...not just to create more cute dogs. There was a standard developed and breeders made a coordinated effort to adhere to it...there was a set, goal 'type' they were trying to produce. That is not being done with the cross bred dogs that are being mass produced today.

However, the large majority of dogs now serve as companions today. Most dogs do not serve their original function. What's wrong with breeding dogs that are sweet, cute, smart, and good with families?

The best argument I've seen for breed standards is that you know what to expect when the puppy is grown (though you could do this pretty easily anyway, say, adopt an adult dog). There are a lot of good arguments *against* maintaining standard, primarily that you reduce the robustness of the gene pool. Imagine if instead of coat color, the primary characteristic of a yorkie was long life. I wonder if these little guys would have such marked problems with LP, liver shunt, hypoglycemia, etc.

Anyway, if you have healthy dogs that can mix well, such as poodles, malteses, yorkies, and s**tzus, I say, let 'em rip. Responsibly, of course.

[Britster]

Originally Posted by QuickSilver

However, the large majority of dogs now serve as companions today. Most dogs do not serve their original function. What's wrong with breeding dogs that are sweet, cute, smart, and good with families?

The best argument I've seen for breed standards is that you know what to expect when the puppy is grown (though you could do this pretty easily anyway, say, adopt an adult dog). There are a lot of good arguments *against* maintaining standard, primarily that you reduce the robustness of the gene pool. Imagine if instead of coat color, the primary characteristic of a yorkie was long life. I wonder if these little guys would have such marked problems with LP, liver shunt, hypoglycemia, etc.

Anyway, if you have healthy dogs that can mix well, such as poodles, malteses, yorkies, and s**tzus, I say, let 'em rip. Responsibly, of course.

Great post!

[RIPMyLittleCase]

I have a YorkiePoo and love him to the nth degree but I don't agree with breeding mixes "just because" or "for spits and giggles". My little one was born missing the toes on one of his back feet. I doubt that is going to stop the breeder where he was born from breeding either or both of his parents.

No matter how any of us feels, the OP is going to do what she wants to. That is her perogative and we may never find out what happens. I just hope that her furbabies do not get hurt in the process or worse, Just my opinion though.

[JoshieBoy]

Originally Posted by FlDebra

Just read through her past posts. Everything I wrote was true. When a forum gets this big, sometimes it is easy to not put all the pieces together when someone asks for opinions here and there. But when someone asks about breeding, I am going to click on "Find other posts from this member" and see what they have been doing with their Yorkies or other pets before I comment. Whether a person should mix breeds always gets two sides going. But even putting that issue aside, there are plenty of red flags why this person should not be breeding these dogs. I have no idea where the original mother and father to the litter she reported here on YT came from either. She said she bought them but paid less without papers, she said she doesn't remember who she bought them from, then in another post she says one of them is a rescue.

She may have felt like people were criticizing her, but I think it is a matter of people being critical of her practices which obviously are not those of a professional dog breeder.

I do have an opinion, you're right, but most of what I wrote was putting the information she has posted together in one place so people can see a little more of what is and is not going on here. I too wish the best for her dogs, all of them, wherever they may be now and all of her cats too.

I commend you for taking the breeding of dogs seriously, and I think everybody should to take the breeding of dogs seriously to stop our overpopulation of dogs. I am a person that likes to read everything I read before saying the information given is true. I was not questioning your detective work, because I was agreeing with everything you posted. She just posted so many threads that I do not have time or interest to read them. Thank you for sharing the information with the rest of Yorkie Talk members.

[JoshieBoy]

I do have an opinion, you're right, but most of what I wrote was putting the information she has posted together in one place so people can see a little more of what is and is not going on here. I too wish the best for her dogs, all of them, wherever they may be now and all of her cats too. (FlDebra Quote)

The opinion comment was geared towards the OP. I thought she felt bad, because she got a lot of negative criticism about breeding her dogs. I did not want the OP to think the opinions were a personal attack. I was trying to tell her not to take the comments personal, because they are just opinions. We all have our beliefs about what is right or wrong. She has to make the decision based on all the information she gathered on the subject. I am glad that we all want the best for the animals and the breeder.

[jexxie]

I'm only going to say this one more time. I wasn't going to breed the pups to see what they looked like. And I wasn't breeding them to sell. I was thinking of breeding them because they are both wonderful dogs with great temperaments. Yes, I have a post about my dogs leg making a sound. So what? I came here for knowledge. Since someone keeps tracking down my old posts then you should know that I also said that if he has a LP, I definitely wouldn't want to pass it down to any other dog. I really feel sorry for the person that has enough time to trace down my old posts, repost them for everyone to see, and then criticize me because I came to a yorkie site for adivice on my yorkies!!! Not everyone knows it all like you. Some of us have to eat our pride and ask questions. Yes, I had a female that had social issues and potty training issues. Yes, I had a litter of pups and didn't know how long it would take to find them good homes. One of the reasons for that is, since I was told by almost everyone to keep the pups til they were 12 wks old, no one wanted them anymore because they weren't tiny pups. BUT that was fine. I waited to find them perfect homes all of which are close to me and they all still keep in touch with me and let me know how the pups were doing. I made them sign a spay/neuter contract, sent then with puppy care guides, food, toys, collars, leashes, pet taxis,etc.. Not bad for a "backyard breeder", eh? THey went to WONDERFUL homes and I have no doubt in my mind that they will all be spoiled rotten and taken care of excellently. And as far as shelter dogs, I never said you couldn't find a good dog at a shelter. NEVER said that. I said that alot of times shelter dogs have issues.. THats a big reason why they end up in the shelter to begin with. Puppy mill raids, etc. And around here, no yorkie stays at the shelter long. The rescues are another story. Has anyon e ever got a dog from puppyfind. com or kijiji.com or any of those sights? if so, congratulations!!You probably just supported a puppy mill. Not all breeders are puppy mills on there, but I know of 3 of them that are right down the road. They have 200 + dogs living in wire cages, but since they have a USDA license, that somehow makes it ok. It's those people that you need to watch out for, not me. And I have never cussed anyone on here.... And as far as my breeder friends on YT, although they may not condone mixing breeds, they would never act like children about it. You all don't know me and you don't know anything about my personal life. You have no room to judge. You can say that you think it's a bad idea to breed mixes all day long... that's one thing, but for you to call me a backyard breeder and this n that is totally uncalled for. Every single time anyone says something you don't like or don't agree with , you start in with your hateful comments and it's totally ridiculous. And if breeding is a "privledge" and you have to be some kind of GOD to do it, who determines this? who says who can breed and who can't??? I said before and I will say it again.. just because you can copy articles and paste them on a thread doesn't mean you know what you're talking about. I live in Nebraska, not LA.. There aren't dozens of rep. breeders around here to mentor me. That's why I come to this site... to talk to people who know the process.. and the sad part is, i'd say about 80% of all the replies I get are just people ranting and raving .. Nothing useful.. 10% of the replies aren't even about the subject at hand.. Now we're talking about Biewers.. Oh well, it gets you off my back for a while. I truely do appreciate most advice I get on here.. But what I don't appreciate is the bad mouthing, and the stalking of my previous posts. Don't you have anything better to do? Like take care of your dogs??? It seems like people spend more time talking on here about their dogs then actually spending time with them.. How sad. I've seen it time and time again when people come here for a friend, or some encouragement and get totally shot down and it really does break my heart. I see people come here with an emergency... like there dog is sick or in labor and instead of someone saying "you need to do this" people say " you're not responsible.. you should have never bred.." .. "take your dog to a vet".. You need to understand that there are real people behind these keyboards that have feelings.. And when they come here in the middle of a crisis or they need some good advice, having so many people just start degrading them doesn't help the situation. Next time I will take my questions to the breeder section. They are way more helpful and not nearly as judgemental, from my experience. So, you all have a good day.. If you get a moment of free time and you don't have anything else to do, like play with fido, you can feel free to search all of my past threads and decide what to put me down for next. God Bless...

[Nancy1999]

Since it's easiest to place a purebred that meets standard, and, of course, is healthy, I believe in only breeding purebreds, who meet standard, and have been health screened for genetic diseases. We are killing millions of dogs each year, and I won't ever support breeders who are contributing to the problem. Joey's breeder will take back at any time, all the offspring her dogs produce, and find it a new home. I have no doubt in my mind she will do this. All breeders should do this, and if they aren't willing to do this, they shouldn't be breeding. There are thousands of wonderful mixed breeds available, why would there be a need to produce more, or yeah, because it's easier to sell a puppy, all puppies are cute.

[jexxie]

And to FLDEBRA.. Since I don't have all day to examine your postings, I did find one that just happened to land on the first page.. This is a posting that you made. You say right here you are not experienced either. You have no idea what you're even doing..Haha... I guess you're a backyard breeder too.. And here you are with the nerve to talk about me?? And you're selling your dogs with full registration?? I think that is a RED FLAG... It's people like you that are responsible for pet overpopulation.. and not to mention you are encouraging people to breed.. Practice what you preach, sister..

I have 5 beautiful puppies that are 5 weeks old right now. I have not advertised them just yet as I think 6 weeks is early enough to start taking deposits. By that age you can get a better idea of how they will look, size, and personality.

I am not an experienced professional breeder. I was hoping to become one, starting out with two adorable AKC yorkies that have been part of our family. Jury is out on that decision moving forward as I lost my sweet Sadie (momma Yorkie) on the 3rd day after the puppies were born. I did my homework and think I was well-prepared for everything except for the harsh reality of the risk I was taking of losing my little girl by breeding her.

They have been bottle fed since their 3rd day of life, and just this past week started eating from a dish well. I let them eat as much as they want. I own the father too, he is 4.5 pounds and Sadie was 6-6.5 pounds. These puppies are looking to be on the small-med. side, the growth charts are guesstimating @4 pounds for them. There are 3 females and 2 males. The puppy pictures are in the Nursery forum Quints Are Thriving and Ben and Sadie's pictures are in my album http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/album.php?u=13764.

I paid $1500 for Sadie, and $1200 for Ben. (I can provide pictures of the grandparents too.) Since I am so new at this, I am asking $1000 ea. with a 10% YorkieTalk discount and full registration. I will have a lot of questions for prospective adopters and will need a reference. I will give a one year health guarantee for any hereditary disease or affliction. Puppies will be current on puppy vaccines and 2 wormings before ready to leave no earlier than 12 weeks of age. I won't ship but if someone wants to buy me an airline ticket I will fly them to you. I am in NW Florida so maybe within driving distance?

Being hand-fed, I do not think you will ever see more loving puppies. They truly think they are little people. They love to be held, already play with toys or your fingers, and LOVE giving puppy kisses. The vet says they are doing fantastic. They are doing well about moving from their sleeping area to the pee pads to do their business already but are still a long way from house-trained, of course. Hope I covered everything. I need to think about making a For Sale ad here on YT. I think I am procrastinating because it almost does not seem right to be listing my babies in an ad like that. The first time we had puppies they all went to family and a friend. So, this will be a new experience, actually letting the little ones go off on their own. I am so tempted to just keep them all, but know that is not realistic. To the right family, they will truly be a blessing!
__________________

[QuickSilver]

Yep, this thread is off the rails, and I'm enjoying the ride!

Nancy1999, I have lots of respect for your knowledge, so I don't mean this as an attack. Here, you say that you think only purebreds should be bred because they are easiest to place. However, later on, you say it shouldn't matter if mixed breeds are easier to sell because "all puppies are cute". Isn't this a contradiction? What if someone said that there are lots of wonderful yorkies out there, so we don't need any more?

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

Since it's easiest to place a purebred that meets standard, and, of course, is healthy, I believe in only breeding purebreds, who meet standard, and have been health screened for genetic diseases. We are killing millions of dogs each year, and I won't ever support breeders who are contributing to the problem. Joey's breeder will take back at any time, all the offspring her dogs produce, and find it a new home. I have no doubt in my mind she will do this. All breeders should do this, and if they aren't willing to do this, they shouldn't be breeding. There are thousands of wonderful mixed breeds available, why would there be a need to produce more, or yeah, because it's easier to sell a puppy, all puppies are cute.

[FlDebra]

Jexxie -- Yes, For $1000 that person CAN get full registration. But it is NOT a given. Lots and lots of questions and references, as stated. I have not advertised them that way to just anyone. I am not perpetuating unregistered dogs either. They are quality AKC, in breed standard. I had the mother and father checked out ahead of time and got experienced breeder input about my two. I am honest about just starting out -- how is that a negative? A negative would be to do like you did and say that I am experienced when I am just starting. A negative would be to alternately claim puppies are CKC registered, then that the parents did not have papers because they cost more, then that one was a rescue. That gets confusing to type!

How did you get the "practice what you preach" out of my post? I have AKC registered, pedigrees available, pictures of parents and grandparents, puppies to sell. You are talking about having dogs without papers just long enough to put out a litter, selling them for $175 to someone who immediately had another mixed breed, and now talking about breeding one of those puppies with another breed when you don't know the background or health history of the dogs. That is a LOT different. I don't get why you do not see that. I don't think there is anyone against all breeding of quality in standard AKC yorkies, is there?

You keep being so nasty and when I say cussing people, it is the name calling and the hostile words you use that I am talking about. I asked you several questions in that post but you sure did not answer any of them. Instead you want to sling insults. Stick to facts. That is why I tried to quote you several times, so you would realize I was only talking about exactly what you had posted. You have made conflicting statements. Do you want to clear them up?

See you casually ask people's opinion if you should breed these dogs. Do you really think people should just off the cuff say, yes, breed them? Instead, shouldn't a person do a little background work before they say that? I think so, and that is why I made one click of a button where it says "List other posts from this member" and they all come up. It takes about 2 seconds. Not difficult, not time consuming, and an easy way to see what else a person is posting about. Did it all with a puppy in my lap.

You can do anything you want with your dogs, but when you ask people's opinion -- be ready to get it. And don't bite their heads off if they don't all think you are doing it all right. I am just starting, but there is no way that you can say I don't know what I am talking about. I spent 2 years studying what I was going to do before I did it. I asked a million questions BEFORE I let dogs breed. I would never just arbitrarily get rid of my adult dogs because the breeding did not work out either. They are mine to love and be cared for. You can say you really care about your dogs and that they are a member of your family, but when you have a male and female and get rid of both of them in about 6 months time (just long enough to give you a litter) and then on to another dog, well....actions speak much louder than typed words.