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09-14-2009, 03:39 AM | #151 | |
Donating YT 10K Club Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Alabama
Posts: 17,674
| Quote:
I choose not to read the plethora of stuff that you link because there is no way to verify the data. Although I do recognize that the AHA does good, I also recognize that the organization has radicals that come up with some really crazy ideas. I don't need any group to tell me what to think or what works for me. I am able to discern between healthy training and abuse. I am also intuned enough with my cirtters to know when they are stressed - and when I should push through and when I need to back off. | |
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09-14-2009, 03:48 AM | #152 |
Donating YT 10K Club Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Alabama
Posts: 17,674
| One last comment before I get some shut eye ..... I don't want anyone to get the idea that I think I am a better trainer than the next dog owner. I read as much as I can about different training techniques and glean from each. It just so happens that I particularly like many of the ideas gleaned from Cesar. You cannot/do not have any knowledge of the level of training my dogs have achieved using Cesar techniques. Nor do you know the state of mind of my dogs. So, let it be known that I like Cesar (note, I didn't say LOVE, but like) use many ideas gleaned from reading his books and have merged it with ideas from other trainers as well to come up with something that works for me. |
09-14-2009, 03:53 AM | #153 | |
YT 1000 Club Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: North
Posts: 1,324
| Quote:
In james ohears stuff there is data. In overalls stuff there is dats. I need no group either this is leg work and understanding why dogs work the way they do and it is not any where near what Cm say. Pushing animal through something again if not wired right will bit you. So why go there. It is not crazy stuff when this is world wide any more then the guy who first said the world was round and got beat on for it. If one is to scared to go see to open once mind to learning from reputable organizations like vets and other drs I fine with that but accusing me of being closed minded is like the pot calling the kettle black. If one can not look past what one thinks one knows to the facts cause one is to afraid than that is closed minded. And accusing reputable groups if organization like the ABVS is laughable. JL
__________________ "The truth about an animal is far more beautiful than all the myths woven about it." Konrad Loranz | |
09-14-2009, 04:00 AM | #154 | |
YT 1000 Club Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: North
Posts: 1,324
| Quote:
That many do look at CM as the, oh can not say that, end all and be all of dog training and do not have a good start point to their learning about dogs he is not that start point. We get dogs into big trouble. There are many a trainer and behaviourist working on the messes that those people have done working his methods. You can go on that it is not his fault but if he puts it out there and he is selling it it is. When there are viable safe slow gentle methods that hurt aton less then slamming a dog to the ground laying on top of it until it stops fighting. No dog gets up from a roll and goes lets do it again. The postive way he does try hard and want to learn. I want learning not learned helplessness. JL
__________________ "The truth about an animal is far more beautiful than all the myths woven about it." Konrad Loranz Last edited by YorkieMother; 09-14-2009 at 04:03 AM. | |
09-14-2009, 04:20 AM | #155 | |
YT 1000 Club Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: North
Posts: 1,324
| Quote:
IAABC (behaviorists) AHA (American Humane Assoc) ACVB (behaviorists)AVSAB (vets) AVSAB leafletAVSAB 2 Debra F. Horwitz (and Millan video) Alexandra Semyonova Jolanta BenalJ ean Donaldson Lee Charles KelleyNew York TimesSan Francisco Chronicle Nancy Freedman-Smith Lisa Mullinax Barry Eaton Mary Harvelik Andrew Luescher Nicola Wilde Steve Dale Dr Patricia Khuly Marina Kvicke rLisa Laney Bristol University University of Pennsylvania AnimalBehaviorAssociates.com LA Times comments board Janis Bradley Vyolet Michaels Dr Suzanne Hetts Dr Nicholas Dodman Dr Ian dunbar. Dr Sophi Yin Dr Pat McConnell Any or all of these groups and people be more than willing to back up any or all I have stated. They are not all radicals nor crazy and I would think they therefore would at least some who would take exepction to being called such. Defaming goes both ways. You can not back that they are all radicals or crazy. JL
__________________ "The truth about an animal is far more beautiful than all the myths woven about it." Konrad Loranz Last edited by YorkieMother; 09-14-2009 at 04:25 AM. | |
09-14-2009, 06:25 AM | #156 | |
Donating YT 10K Club Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Alabama
Posts: 17,674
| Quote:
Hummm, I don't know any of the above. As far as I know they could be crazies. Having Dr. in front of your name doesn't automatically make you an expert. I will continue to use my tried and true methods and have happy dogs who are submissive, i.e. who yield to my authority. I will leave the alpha roll to those who believe in it and leave undisciplined dogs who wish to deal with results of owners who do not correct bad behavior. | |
09-14-2009, 06:54 AM | #157 | |
YT 1000 Club Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: North
Posts: 1,324
| Quote:
I have meet I would say at least one personally and no having a Dr on your does not make you an expert in all things some have to specialize but then again I am going to a Dr to get my gall bladder out over the guy on the cornor that says he can do it cause he done it lots. No it does not make you an expert if you are but you have still not walked out Cm actually cradentials and the science behind it to prove anything. These guys can on both sides of that fence pro and con and I have heard one do it in person. or should I say they can trot out the jusifications on the flip side of thier coins cause they know it. Sudmission is not happy it is learn helplessness. And all aggression is not caused by owners that do not correct thier dogs behaviour some as I have repeated is genetic an chemically based and is managable at the best of times. Oh dear I lied I know more then one on the list if you add members of the One group.. sorry forgot that gaggle of fun loving drs... humm one there no two humm best go read the members again... JL
__________________ "The truth about an animal is far more beautiful than all the myths woven about it." Konrad Loranz Last edited by YorkieMother; 09-14-2009 at 06:57 AM. | |
09-14-2009, 07:03 AM | #158 |
YT 1000 Club Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: North
Posts: 1,324
| Sorry double post again. that I think comes from the spell check. JL
__________________ "The truth about an animal is far more beautiful than all the myths woven about it." Konrad Loranz Last edited by YorkieMother; 09-14-2009 at 07:05 AM. |
09-14-2009, 07:14 AM | #159 | |
No Longer A Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: NEW YORK
Posts: 16,218
| Quote:
Your absoluety right Chachi. Actually I have read other posts she has made on the training threads and it appears only her way is the way to go. Everyone else has no idea what they are doing and she does not give an inch! It's a lost cause to have a conversation with her. She doesn't listen she just disagree's with everything unless it's her way. | |
09-14-2009, 07:19 AM | #160 |
Phantom Queen Morrigan Donating Member | you know, i just read through this entire thread and it went absolutely no where. All that talk you did last night and all that sleep you lost was totally wasted because nothing was accomplished. I wish the questions asked were answered because then this conversation would have went somewhere but sadly they were not. its a shame.
__________________ Kellie and Morgan |
09-14-2009, 07:54 AM | #161 | |
I ♥ Joey & Ralphie! Donating Member | Quote:
Cesar does not promote dogs fighting it out, and for you to suggest this is wrong. This is another example of you giving false statements to back of your claims on why Cesar is bad. I'm don't believe you have a true understanding of his concepts. When you joined Yorkietalk you told me you had never seen any of Cesar's programs, and your strong dislike for him was because you were going to dog training school, and your instructor disliked him. Well now it seems you have seen some of his programs, but your mind was fully made up before you watched it, so now you are looking for evidence of his abuse. If you don't like him that's ok with me, but lets not say he advocates things that he clearly does not advocate. May I ask which school you are attending to become a trainer?
__________________ NancyJoey Proud members of the CrAzYcLuB and YAP! ** Just Say No to Puppymills – Join YAP! Yorkshire Terrier Club of America – Breeder Referrals | |
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