Here we go again, and again...

[Britster]

Originally Posted by Lil Sis

Sorry my friend.. but I find this post very offensive!!

Just like Pit Bull owners probably feel when people who DESPISE and HATE their family dog and want them KILLED? Just sayin'. There was a point in time when the "Pit Bull" was the American family dog. Every decade we go through this with a new breed... in the 80s, I believe it was Doberman's, and in the 90's, it was Rottweilers.

To be clear: I don't own a Pit Bull and I don't think I ever would. They're just not my breed type. They are not even a favorite breed of mine, but I feel it's important to stand up for them as a dog lover. They have their faults, just like every dog breed. But I don't think it's necessarily right for the govt. to be have control over our dogs.

Yes, I do think SOMETHING has to be done. But I just don't think BSL is the answer. The sad thing about these BSL laws is the only people it is going really get hurt are the honest people who do care for their dogs. It's not going to hurt the ones who have them chained in their backyard and just throws them some kibble every now and then. They're just going to break the law anyways.... and could care less if their dog gets taken and PTS.

[yorkietalkjilly]

But when owners and breeders don't step up, control their dogs,ruin good breeds, that is one job only government can do when the public is being harmed in this way. I don't blame you for not blaming the dog - it is sure not their fault. They are completely vulnerable to humans who can't or won't do better. It breaks your heart to realize what is happening.

[chachi]

I think government controls enough if they banned pitbulls what breed would be next?

[Britster]

Originally Posted by chachi

I think government controls enough if they banned pitbulls what breed would be next?

Exactly.

By saying "OK, let's ban all Pit Bulls" we're also saying it's okay for them to suddenly decide "Oh, now we will ban all Golden Retrievers" because they are moving up higher on the bite list. Then what breed will they ban next?

[Wylie's Mom]

Originally Posted by Ellie May

So to those who think that we should ban "pit bulls", exactly what breeds are you wanting banned?

Indeed .

Originally Posted by Deuce

(partial quote)
Punish the deed, not the breed!

Originally Posted by chachi

I think government controls enough if they banned pitbulls what breed would be next?

Exactly. Ban one breed today, and we should expect that ALL breeds can now be banned. "Pit Bulls" one day, yorkies another day.

I've always been 100% against BSL.

{Just a Mod comment: let's not get our panties in a bundle over Brit's analogy...we're all mature enough to understand the intent}

[Britster]

Originally Posted by Wylie's Mom

Indeed .







Exactly. Ban one breed today, and we should expect that ALL breeds can now be banned. "Pit Bulls" one day, yorkies another day.

I've always been 100% against BSL.

{Just a Mod comment: let's not get our panties in a bundle over Brit's analogy...we're all mature enough to understand the intent}

Thanks -- and btw, *I* didn't personally write it. I said I read it on another forum and agreed with it.

[Wylie's Mom]

Originally Posted by Britster

Thanks -- and btw, *I* didn't personally write it. I said I read it on another forum and agreed with it.

Ack, I did know you found it elsewhere...and that wasn't clear in what I wrote in my post . Sorry about that.

I should have written "let's not get our panties in a bundle over the analogy Brit quoted from another site" (or something like that).

[Ellie May]

Originally Posted by FlDebra

By the way -- you omitted "BY MUCH" after "hasn't cut dog bites." in the quote. The number of dog bites has gone down, just not as much as desired! It takes a while. Remember Ontario did not move all the pit bulls out! The ones already there were supposed to be spayed & neutered and muzzled. But they ARE still there! So, the first 5 years are NOT going to show a huge reduction. But as they start enforcing the spay & neuter, the number of pit bulls will slowly go down and so will the number of serious dog bites.

Remember what I said about statistics showing about anything you want them to? This is an example. sure the numbers have not gone down much yet -- but NEITHER has the actual pit bull population. You have to give the law time to really make a difference in the numbers of pit bulls walking around! Another question would be just how much enforcement has gone along with the law change?

Dog Attack Deaths and Maimings, U.S. & Canada, September 1982 to June 25, 2010 - By Merritt Clifton - DogsBite.org

Here is the link posted earlier from this thread.
It's a compilation of "press accounts".
By compiling U.S. and Canadian press accounts between 1982 and 2010,1 Merritt Clifton, editor of Animal People, shows the breeds most responsible for serious injury and death.

Press accounts mean next to nothing. There is obvious bias against bully breeds. The press chooses what they do and do not report. That is not an accurate tally of injuries from dogs. It's a tally of injuries from dogs that the press felt like reporting.

Sine pit bulls bites seem to always make the news, that number isn't all that high. It looks like less than 100 a year? More kids drown in swimming pools yearly than that... There are double the # of drowning in the US in one year than injury from pit bulls in 20 years if we go by that site.

And there is absolutely no way they can do a % of pit bull population estimate. There are hundreds of thousands + more dogs that aren't registered. It is impossible to estimate.

[kjc]

Originally Posted by Lil Sis

this is the problem... nothing is cut and dry, black or white there are so many areas of gray.
Me, personally, do not like pit bulls or mixes. I am scared of them and have seen too many bad things. My BIL had one many years ago that was very sweet. I think that the Pitt bulls that are making the bad press have been breed to be aggressive - not even the same dog as my bil's molly.

I used to sort of feel that way about dobies, but I have a friend who breeds dobies and I see that (if breed correctly) they are a great dogs. I let them play with my guys with supervision (very close supervision) because you just never know. She has a very hard time selling her pup (used to get $3000 per dog-- show quality) because many people don't want the added expense of the extra home owners insurance and other issue of having a dog that is perceived as aggressive

I had a neighbor who had a dobie puppy and she had it trained to be an attack dog. The stupid lady used to say things like "I told my son (a 7 year old kid) not to play attack with his dog" really lady??? I told her, if her dog ever attacked anyone I would be a witness that she had him trained and knew the dangers. They moved.
I also had a neighbor (different) who had German Shepards, what a great dog. Now... if I was out and saw either breed running toward me off leash.. well heart attack!!

I watched a show on pitt bull rescue on tv-- they were talking about a gene that makes the pitt bulls very aggressive (if I remember correctly it showed up in blue markings?) so it is a breeding problem. And like already said-- the wrong people breed the wrong type of dog for the wrong reasons and we all suffer and the wrong dogs suffer.

Razor's Edge is one line I've seen here in Baltimore alot. Blue nose or red nose, old school looking dogs. UKC- Purple Ribbon- a joke. If three generations are UKC registered, they award you a Purple Ribbon distinction or PR next to the name. Kind of like Teacup in Yorkieland! (but by no means small)

[hugz4all4]

I agree too that they shouldnt be banned, but something needs to be done. I will admit that the breed its self does scare me some, but at the same time I do know that under the right ownership they can be like any other pet out there. Any breed of dog can "attack"..unfortunatly some"pittbulls" do it to kill.
Good friends of ours owned a purebred American Stafford Terrier (i think thats right? ) and she looked very similar to pitt so I can see how different breeds of bully's can be confusing and all grouped into one breed. She was a wonderful family dog.
Here is a clear example of someone who shouldnt be owning a pitty..
My sister in law has a pittbull mix pup (8ish months old) and I cant stand the dog.(and it takes alot for me to say that) She is exteremely hyper, has no manners, doesnt obey simply commands and is in need of some major training. Even though she isnt aggressive, I can def. see where it can become an issue in the future if the owners dont get a handle on the dog. I generally wont go to my in laws if she is around. My son only wieghs 48 pounds, (at almost 8 years old) and she can knock him over with one leap on to his chest...

[yorkietalkjilly]

I don't think we have to worry about banning any breed that is not a danger to the public health. Government was started just to keep the public safe - used to be its main mission. Unless we start having Yorkies and Chi's and Irish Wolfhounds doing a lot of human damage, I think those breeds and all others like them are safe from government. Remember, government workers are dog lovers, too.

Right now victims of dog attacks are definitely an under-represented minority in this country with little sympathy for their plight compared to us dog lovers' fears of seeing a whole breed or genre of dog done away with or banned from a state. Hopefully, our lawmakers/police can go after irresponsible fight-dog breeders and bad owners and put them on the hotseat for what they are doing to man's best friend and their victims. If gov gets tough enough on the humans behind the dog-attack problem, maybe we can see some improvement - and my Tibbe won't get banned.

[Gatord]

Originally Posted by hugz4all4

I agree too that they shouldnt be banned, but something needs to be done. I will admit that the breed its self does scare me some, but at the same time I do know that under the right ownership they can be like any other pet out there. Any breed of dog can "attack"..unfortunatly some"pittbulls" do it to kill.

Me too (in red) .

I seen a pick-up truck yesterday with a dog box on back. A pit was in the box and another on top. I was so mad. The one on top was chained to the box and the poor guy (pit) was holding on with his front paws on front of dog box. I tried to catch up with the guy to get tag number I was going to call it in. You could see the terror in the dogs face. I wanted to put that driver on a chain on top of the box and haul butt and see if he could hold on. So sad. My next thought was do you any kids?

[yorkietalkjilly]

Originally Posted by Gatord

Me too (in red) .

I seen a pick-up truck yesterday with a dog box on back. A pit was in the box and another on top. I was so mad. The one on top was chained to the box and the poor guy (pit) was holding on with his front paws on front of dog box. I tried to catch up with the guy to get tag number I was going to call it in. You could see the terror in the dogs face. I wanted to put that driver on a chain on top of the box and haul butt and see if he could hold on. So sad. My next thought was do you any kids?

Poor babies! I wonder what all these pits go through on a daily basis with some of the jerks who own them! I'll bet their lives are H_ _ _!!! Oh, how I would like to stop this sickening trend of clueless dodo's buying these poor living creatures and treating them like they are macho/gangsta/redneck/security status symbols rather than a helpless dog just wanting some love and a decent life being a regular dog.

[moshes_human]

Originally Posted by yorkietalkjilly

Oh, how I would like to stop this sickening trend of clueless dodo's buying these poor living creatures and treating them like they are macho/gangsta/redneck/security status symbols rather than a helpless dog just wanting some love and a decent life being a regular dog.

Agree

[gemy]

I"d like to see mandatory chipping instituted by all registries in North America. All litters must be chipped, and then when sold the microchip info is transferred to new owner.
Then I'd like to see mandatory reporting, using a chip scanner that then identifies the breed, the bite, the person bit by age and sex, the emergency care given, and a short narrative of incidence description. A standard form that must be filled out by the health care or emt that attends to the person.
In my opinion on all these dog bites stats, we have "garbage in" and therefor no reliable stats out.
I'd also like to see mandatory reporting of health stats that are collected by vets, entered into a OFA like database, sorted by chip number by breed, etc.
I'd like to see that city dog licensing requires a universally identifiable chip, that will help to identify the crossbreeds or mutts.

In terms of public awareness of how to greet or at least to be safe around strange dogs, its almost totally lacking.

Last summer at Kelso a favourite park we swim the dogs in. Magic was on lead with my husband and they were walking down to the water. A little girl perhaps no more than six, came running from across the parking lot, yelling oh doggy doggy doggy, brandishing her cute little baton as she ran. I move to intercept her twice, first time she veered away from me, cause I was blocking her path to Magic; second time I crouched and held out my arms and said Stop sweetie. She did. Where were her parents? Still across the parking lot, sauntering towards us, smiling. Anyhow, I talked with her, she was doggy crazy, and I said to her, that is not the way you want to meet a dog. So we talked some about how to meet strange dogs. By this time, Magic was doing his favourite thing of retreive the toy in the water. Her parents finally arrived, and we chatted. The little girl begged me and her parents to meet Magic. I said honey, you are going to get wet, cause he is all wet now. She didn't care. So she had a grand time meeting Magic, and even, throwing the ball into the water for him.

The only place I've been so far, that seems generally speaking to get dogs, was up north in Lake Superior and environs. What a relief it was to actually be in public with folks that knew to ask before petting, that walked up calmly and spoke with the owners first, and that included most kids too. Made a huge difference.