Cesar debate thread - Page 4 - YorkieTalk.com Forums

YorkieMother · 08-06-2009, 07:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ARCHIE

P.S. You can't train a vicious dog during a commercial break!
IMO

Actually what you seeing is a cooking show for dogs. It takes more then one day to do what he does it is edited down to a 1/2 hour show that makes it look simple and easy.

As for working and living with an aggressive dog how does 7 years of living with an aggressive dog work for you.
I have one that is as bad if not worse then many Ceaser deals with as it is genetic based and chemially made worse aggression and can not be worked in the manner at all that Ceaser does it as she would be dead.

7 Years or hard work with a dog that should have been put down and that methods just like ceasers made far worse.
When I speak training it is from the point of view of keeping a very aggressive fearful anixety dog alive and proventing what happened to her happen to another.
Oh and before you come back and go well it is only one there are others I have helped over the years as well.
I play with the ones that will bite... 5 time biter before the age of a year in one dog. So please do not try and say i do not have a clue.

JL

YorkieMother · 08-06-2009, 07:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Britster

Wait, are you saying that you have a dog that sleeps all day in a kennel, and stays in that kennel to eat, play, etc? If that's what you're saying, I'm sorry, but that's terrible. A dog cannot be kept in a kennel. I don't care how anxious or fearful she is, you have to get her to experience the world and get over that fear. Just like a depressed person who stays in their house all day... it makes them worse. That is NO life for a dog and if I'm understanding you correctly and that is what you're doing to a dog, that is way worse than what you're claiming Cesar apparently does to his dogs. If you're a trainer, why would you not train her to NOT pick a fight with the neighbors dog or a gopher? You're going to keep her secluded from the world instead?!

No not saying that at all.... she running around here right now free as a bird but when I leave to go anywhere she is kenneled. When she goes outside to play soccer or fetch or just sniff she is with me. That is when she is not along for the ride in weather conditions that allows her to join me.

More times than not free to go where she wants as she got an amazing recall.
But when left unattended she is kenneled in a manner that allows her a ton of freedom to move and to play just not jump out and panic.

JL

ch774 · 08-06-2009, 07:30 AM

I love him and have tried some of his methods and they have worked. I get encouraged by his love for animals. I watch him everyday.

Love Him and his work

Cheryl

Britster · 08-06-2009, 07:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YorkieMother

No not saying that at all.... she running around here right now free as a bird but when I leave to go anywhere she is kenneled. When she goes outside to play soccer or fetch or just sniff she is with me.

More times than not free to go where she wants as she got an amazing recall.
But when left unattended she is kenneled in a manner that allows her a ton of freedom to move and to play just not jump out and panic.

JL

Okay, I misunderstood. I thought you meant she was kenneled all day.

Britster · 08-06-2009, 07:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YorkieMother

Actually what you seeing is a cooking show for dogs. It takes more then one day to do what he does it is edited down to a 1/2 hour show that makes it look simple and easy.

JL

I think most people know and understand that they can't show everything in a 1 hour long show. Every television show is edited. Cesar states many, many times that the dog will not be rehabilitated if the owner does not continue to work with the dog. He never claims to be like magic and change the dog within a matter of 10 minutes! He just shows them how it can be done, and gives them tips, and they always usually show a home video from months after Cesar was at their house and updates on how the dogs are currently doing and what the owners have been doing.

YorkieMother · 08-06-2009, 07:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ch774

I love him and have tried some of his methods and they have worked. I get encouraged by his love for animals. I watch him everyday.

Love Him and his work

Cheryl

i am glad you like him. Want to learn more from him. Turn the volume down.

Watch the dogs. count the lip licks, head turns, eye blinks, yanws, shake offs.. as in like a dog shaking off water. Once you have a total have a look at Turid Rugrass book On talking terms with dogs and find out what those mean.

Then come back and tell us all what you have learned. Should be that Ceasers got thos dogs under so much sttress that they are pleading for him to stop. There is very little that the dog is learning to do but to give up and give in.

JL

ARCHIE · 08-06-2009, 07:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YorkieMother

Actually what you seeing is a cooking show for dogs. It takes more then one day to do what he does it is edited down to a 1/2 hour show that makes it look simple and easy.

As for working and living with an aggressive dog how does 7 years of living with an aggressive dog work for you.
I have one that is as bad if not worse then many Ceaser deals with as it is genetic based and chemially made worse aggression and can not be worked in the manner at all that Ceaser does it as she would be dead.

7 Years or hard work with a dog that should have been put down and that methods just like ceasers made far worse.
When I speak training it is from the point of view of keeping a very aggressive fearful anixety dog alive and proventing what happened to her happen to another.
Oh and before you come back and go well it is only one there are others I have helped over the years as well.
I play with the ones that will bite... 5 time biter before the age of a year in one dog. So please do not try and say i do not have a clue.

JL

Obviously you have a thing for Ceaser and think only your methods
are the correct methods. If it works for you great but Ceaser is Ceaser
and I have total respect for him because I know his methods work.
I have been using them on a Yorkie for 2yrs and know for a fact, if
followed daily, yes they do work.
Good luck to you in your training, however, I must say I don't think
it professional of you to knock another trainer's methods especially
when he is world known for his accomplishments and has saved
countless dog's from death.
Done on this subject.

YorkieMother · 08-06-2009, 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Britster

I think most people know and understand that they can't show everything in a 1 hour long show. Every television show is edited. Cesar states many, many times that the dog will not be rehabilitated if the owner does not continue to work with the dog. He never claims to be like magic and change the dog within a matter of 10 minutes! He just shows them how it can be done, and gives them tips, and they always usually show a home video from months after Cesar was at their house and updates on how the dogs are currently doing and what the owners have been doing.

look archie brought up the point and you know there are some that think it is that easy and then get discoucraged when it much harder then that.

As for the up dates the one with the great dane and the fear of slippery floors made me so upset the dog was still afraid. That is not fixing it.

JL

Britster · 08-06-2009, 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YorkieMother

i am glad you like him. Want to learn more from him. Turn the volume down.

Watch the dogs. count the lip licks, head turns, eye blinks, yanws, shake offs.. as in like a dog shaking off water. Once you have a total have a look at Turid Rugrass book On talking terms with dogs and find out what those mean.

Then come back and tell us all what you have learned. Should be that Ceasers got thos dogs under so much sttress that they are pleading for him to stop. There is very little that the dog is learning to do but to give up and give in.

JL

Oh, God. This is so ridiculous. Yes, this is a debate thread, you can say whatever the hell you want, but why you have to be like this is beyond me. Some people are going to like Cesar, and there is nothing you can do about it. Why on earth you would tell someone who comes into this thread to watch the show with the volume turned down? This is a debate thread, not a total put down thread.

Britster · 08-06-2009, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ARCHIE

Obviously you have a thing for Ceaser and think only your methods
are the correct methods. If it works for you great but Ceaser is Ceaser
and I have total respect for him because I know his methods work.
I have been using them on a Yorkie for 2yrs and know for a fact, if
followed daily, yes they do work.
Good luck to you in your training, however, I must say I don't think
it professional of you to knock another trainer's methods especially
when he is world known for his accomplishments and has saved
countless dog's from death.
Done on this subject.

Thank you.

I'm out too.

This debate thread is no longer even a debate, it's just a Cesar bashing madhouse and I must sit back and just laugh.

YorkieMother · 08-06-2009, 07:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ARCHIE

Obviously you have a thing for Ceaser and think only your methods
are the correct methods. If it works for you great but Ceaser is Ceaser
and I have total respect for him because I know his methods work.
I have been using them on a Yorkie for 2yrs and know for a fact, if
followed daily, yes they do work.
Good luck to you in your training, however, I must say I don't think
it professional of you to knock another trainer's methods especially
when he is world known for his accomplishments and has saved
countless dog's from death.
Done on this subject.

Really you been to LA to see the dog have you and talked to the trainers there cleaning up his leaving. I can knock what most other professionals at a higher level from him with PHDs and DVMs are saying is not the best way nor the safest way to train.
HAve I no have I talked to those that are yes. See that what a confrence and going to learn is all about you talk to those that are hands on.

JL

YorkieMother · 08-06-2009, 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Britster

Oh, God. This is so ridiculous. Yes, this is a debate thread, you can say whatever the hell you want, but why you have to be like this is beyond me. Some people are going to like Cesar, and there is nothing you can do about it. Why on earth you would tell someone who comes into this thread to watch the show with the volume turned down? This is a debate thread, not a total put down thread.

I love cesaer to learn from totally do it just a differnt form of learning than some of you and I was pointing out that he does indeed have something to teach. Just not what you are thinking.

JL

YorkieMother · 08-06-2009, 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ARCHIE

Obviously you have a thing for Ceaser and think only your methods
are the correct methods. If it works for you great but Ceaser is Ceaser
and I have total respect for him because I know his methods work.
I have been using them on a Yorkie for 2yrs and know for a fact, if
followed daily, yes they do work.
Good luck to you in your training, however, I must say I don't think
it professional of you to knock another trainer's methods especially
when he is world known for his accomplishments and has saved
countless dog's from death.
Done on this subject.

No I do not think that mind is the only way of training. There are several postive methods that work Tellingon touch, lure and reward, clicker and posibbly a few more but zapping, poking and shoving a dog is not training. It is abuse

JL

chattiesmom · 08-06-2009, 08:07 AM

One of the most important things I learned about training my dogs came from a well known horse trainer. I am the best trainer for MY dogs. Any time I am within sight, smell, or hearing distance of my dog he/she is learning from me. It is my responsibility to make each moment a positive one.

With that said, I believe that I can learn from EVERYONE. Not just fancy schmancy "trainers", but from each one of you. We all have had different experiences and I can learn do's and don'ts from all.

As for Ceasar -- I loved his book, but since I don't have TV and the sound on my 'puter doesn't work I haven't seen any of his episodes. I have found that I don't agree with everything any trainer has to say, I glean what I think will work for me and discard the rest. I do like the idea of seeing that the dogs are exercised enough to be tired in the evening and that they aren't bored. I truly believe that a lot of behavorial problems stem from bored dogs with too much "time on their hands". All of our kids need a job to do.

With that said, I don't believe in running one to death, but some dogs may NEED and ENJOY a daily 6 or 7 hour daily run. I know my Irish Setter would run with me when I rode my horse cross country and sometimes those rides were 5 or 6 hours (

back in my single days).

I don't know anything first hand about Cesar - I have never talked to him in person and I haven't worked with him as a trainer - so I don't have enough information to comment on his specific methods. I don't take third party comments about people as the gospel truth. Remember his TV shows are edited and so are his books..... so what we are forming an opinion on isn't necessarily the entire picture.

Bottom line - I like some of his methods, I have employed many and they have worked for me. The methods I don't think will work for me, I discard. I think he is very cute and I would love to hear his accent

ARCHIE · 08-06-2009, 08:15 AM

Bottom line - I like some of his methods, I have employed many and they have worked for me. The methods I don't think will work for me, I discard. I think he is very cute and I would love to hear his accent
__________________

Why Cindy you little devil you.

I totally agree. (even about him being cute)

08-06-2009, 07:30 AM	#48
ch774 No Longer a Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Corpus Christi, Texas Posts: 415	Cesar I love him and have tried some of his methods and they have worked. I get encouraged by his love for animals. I watch him everyday. Love Him and his work Cheryl

08-06-2009, 08:07 AM	#59
chattiesmom Donating YT 10K Club Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Alabama Posts: 17,674	One of the most important things I learned about training my dogs came from a well known horse trainer. I am the best trainer for MY dogs. Any time I am within sight, smell, or hearing distance of my dog he/she is learning from me. It is my responsibility to make each moment a positive one. With that said, I believe that I can learn from EVERYONE. Not just fancy schmancy "trainers", but from each one of you. We all have had different experiences and I can learn do's and don'ts from all. As for Ceasar -- I loved his book, but since I don't have TV and the sound on my 'puter doesn't work I haven't seen any of his episodes. I have found that I don't agree with everything any trainer has to say, I glean what I think will work for me and discard the rest. I do like the idea of seeing that the dogs are exercised enough to be tired in the evening and that they aren't bored. I truly believe that a lot of behavorial problems stem from bored dogs with too much "time on their hands". All of our kids need a job to do. With that said, I don't believe in running one to death, but some dogs may NEED and ENJOY a daily 6 or 7 hour daily run. I know my Irish Setter would run with me when I rode my horse cross country and sometimes those rides were 5 or 6 hours ( back in my single days). I don't know anything first hand about Cesar - I have never talked to him in person and I haven't worked with him as a trainer - so I don't have enough information to comment on his specific methods. I don't take third party comments about people as the gospel truth. Remember his TV shows are edited and so are his books..... so what we are forming an opinion on isn't necessarily the entire picture. Bottom line - I like some of his methods, I have employed many and they have worked for me. The methods I don't think will work for me, I discard. I think he is very cute and I would love to hear his accent __________________ Silk Step-In Harnesses www.foxypups.etsy.com

08-06-2009, 08:15 AM	#60
ARCHIE No Longer A Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: NEW YORK Posts: 16,218	Bottom line - I like some of his methods, I have employed many and they have worked for me. The methods I don't think will work for me, I discard. I think he is very cute and I would love to hear his accent __________________ Why Cindy you little devil you. I totally agree. (even about him being cute)