You know, I dont know Ann. I dont know how ethical she is. If she is purposely breeding parti carriers then, IMO, she is not very ethical. But then I dont know her. If that is her goal to breed partis, then there is no difference, ethically, between you and her. And I am talking about breeding ethics.

Can you honestly say that with 100 % certainty after seeing the pedigree that was just posted today?

No, it just proves that not everyone has the same values and ethics. There are good and bad breeders everywhere, whether they are members of the ytca or not. I do not judge people and I do not feel it necessary to make everyone think just as I do. If someone wants to show parti carriers then that is their business as long as the breeders are being honest to those that buy their pups as to what faults the pup's might have if they are sold as breeding or show quality pups. The same thing would apply to anyone selling yorkies for show or breeding purposes. One needs to know your lines, faults and weakness along with the good qualities and go from there. You should be trying to breed faults out, not in, whether you are showing or not.

I really feel that what this boils down to is how can parti breeders claim they are breeding for the betterment of the breed if they are intentionally adding a disqualifying fault to their bloodlines? Sure you might get a nice parti carrier that might finish but then if you bred that nice carrier back to a parti yorkie then to me you all your hard work of producing a nice yorkie, carrier or not, has gone down the drain. JMO

I don't breed nor show so I'm not comparing myself to anyone. But, I do believe it is a legitimate question and deserves a serious answer, and not another attempt to deflect attention from the question. Is it or is it not deception to dye a coat? Is it like a "white lie" and some think it doesn't really matter?:confused:

Sorry, dont know what you are asking.

You said"Well, if you want to keep comparing yourself with the coat dying exhibitors... But, just remember, those lighter blue coats that some have dyed will NEVER produce a parti, a serious DQ fault, by the way"
And Kp ask you "Can you honestly say that with 100 % certainty after seeing the pedigree that was just posted today?
Meaning how can you say that those lighter blue coats will never produce a parti? Can you predict that?

So what you are saying is it's ok to breed a known carrier as long as you are taking the gene recessive by breed back to a standard color dog.

How is that in the betterment of the breed if you are intentionally adding a disqualifying fault to your standard bloodlines?

No answer....for my question??? :confused:

Anyone?????

I am saying I would not repeat that breeding and if the dog continued to produce parti pups I would remove him from my breeding program. Hylan Acres has produced many champions and they have been breeding for many years. I will never judge a breeder's breeding program just based on one questionable litter. Anyone that breeds knows that sometimes breeding can produce surprises. I normally stay out of these debates because they usually go no where. Everyone that breeds are on different levels when it comes to breeding ethics and convictions. Life it that way to. Who are we to judge?

If he was DNA'd and proven to be the sire of those parti pups, and from the posts I read on here...HE WAS. What would be the purpose of keeping him intact or producing more pups out of him?

We are being told in this thread that it is ethically and immorally wrong to breed or show a known carrier.

The YTCA says they are changing the standard to be stricter? All I can say is they better think long and hard before they go imposing on stricter measures. They may soon find they cut the fingers off of the hand that feeds them. No one can predict what lies in the future. Just look at what has come about in the last 10 years with the parti color. What is happening is that now when the parti's are showing up in a Ch. line it is harder and harder to get the owner of the Dam to get rid of them unlike 15 years ago when it was taboo to have them.
If the YTCA wants to protect the standard then they need to atleast converse with the parti/other colors breeders instead of calling them names and putting them down at every opportunity. Nothing was ever solved by not talking.

Good luck getting a strait answer on this one!! ;)

I have read this thread long enough and will not be back. Normally I avoid reading these threads, but for some reason I stuck with this one. I simply want to leave you all with my thoughts on this mess:

Tragic. Certainly many here do not have the best interest of any dog at the forefront of their thoughts.
I could puke reading some of this nonsense. :(

Carry on. Of course you will as you always do. :(

Ok..let's just cut to the chase. Would showing any of Ridin the Storms pups be cheating?

Not in pedigrees with weak and unknown tail lines.