My Review of GREENS TREASURED YORKSHIRE TERRIERS - MICHIGAN - YorkieTalk.com Forums

mynameisjake128 · 03-26-2009, 08:53 PM

I bought a puppy from Brenda last May. This puppy now has a genetic bone disease called Legge Perthes. My vet and all the specialists I have talked to have confirmed that it is genetic and could have been prevented if the parents were tested for the gene (it can be recessive and puppies can get it even though their parents don't have it). Please look it up for more info.

This disease is very common in Yorkies and causes a lot of pain and suffering to the dogs. Brenda did not even know about the disease and how common it was until I told her about it. She does not get her breeding dogs tested for it. As a breeder, one should know about all diseases common to the breed and make sure they are breeding quality dogs.

She refuses to accept the fact that the disease is genetic. It is VERY SAD!

My dog now needs surgery and the total cost of the surgery and all the medication will be at least $2,500. He is in a lot of pain and is suffering right now. This has been hard on my family and nobody should have to go through what we have gone through.

My puppies dad is the father of Brenda's upcoming litter. I am sure she will continue to breed puppies from the same mom and dad in the future!

Please educate yourself before you buy a puppy from ANY breeder. Do your homework and ask A TON of QUESTIONS!!!!

Feel free to contact me if you have any questions. My email is: mynameisjake128@hotmail.com

Update: 3/30/09 Me and Brenda worked together to come to an agreement on the above issue. She has went above and beyond her original contract to resolve this issue and she is a reputable breeder.

Breny · 03-26-2009, 09:57 PM

I would love to respond. I have offered repeatedly to uphold my contract with you but you refused stating your mom loves her pet, which I understand.
I still, to this day, have not received any proof of this diagnosis. NONE. But I still offered to take him back and replace him. After consulting with my Vet she even confirms that is is NOT proven to be a genetic disease as it can also be caused from injury or trauma.

Legg-Perthes'

Legg-Perthes' disease is a degeneration of the head of the femur. The femur is the upper bone in the rear legs of dogs. The part of the femur that degenerates is the ball at the end of the bone that fits into the socket formed by the pelvic bone.

There is no conclusive evidence that demonstrates whether Legg-Perthes' disease is genetic or that certain dogs are more prone than others. It is known that the condition may be caused by trauma to the joint. The degeneration may be triggered by a fall or blow to the hip joint that causes the flow of blood to the joint to be impeded.

Regardless of cause, Legg-Perthes' disease causes, pain, limping, and then eventually arthritis in the affected hip. It is common for Legg-Perthes' disease to affect only one hip of the dog.

Legg-Perthes' disease is treated with surgery to remove the disintegrated bone segment. Once the bad part of the bone is removed the muscles surrounding the joint may begin to hold the leg in place. Recovery is usually near complete and improvement is rapid. The disease usually shows up by the seventh month. The only real preventive measure that can be taken is to keep your puppy from climbing when he or she is young. Puppies naturally like to get up on the furniture with you. When they are young, they may try to jump--or simply fall--from a height too great for them to effectively navigate, resulting in Legg-Perthes' disease.

The parents have been researched and there are no signs of Legg Perthes in either parents lines, as well as throughly Vet checked. I am awaiting the OFA paperwork.

You told me you wanted me to pay for his surgery and I explained at that time I would be happy to uphold to my contract, (Even though this is not a proven Genetic disease) which states: If this dog is determined to have a major health defect, he/she may be returned to the seller for an exchange, (no cash refunds) at that time. If the puppy has a life threatening congenital or hereditary defect, it will be replaced with the first available puppy of the same value from the breeders stock, as soon as possible. Proof must be shown by Veterinarian and validated by my Veterinarian. The breeder is not responsible for any Veterinarian bills the purchaser may incur regarding said puppy.

You signed this contract but told me that if I didn’t pay for his surgery: “You will be spreading the word as much as you can through forums, blogs, people that see him, yorkie websites, your vets and surgeons, etc. “ and threaten to post on YorkieTalk”. This was all said to me once I told you that I do not pay vet bills.

I’m so sorry you felt you had to take this public. You do not know what my dogs have or have not been tested for, yet you post this, as to assume I am breeding dogs with health issues which is the furthest from the truth.

kpstoybox · 03-26-2009, 11:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mynameisjake128

I bought a puppy from Brenda last May. This puppy now has a genetic bone disease called Legge Perthes. My vet and all the specialists I have talked to have confirmed that it is genetic and could have been prevented if the parents were tested for the gene (it can be recessive and puppies can get it even though their parents don't have it). Please look it up for more info.

This disease is very common in Yorkies and causes a lot of pain and suffering to the dogs. Brenda did not even know about the disease and how common it was until I told her about it. She does not get her breeding dogs tested for it. As a breeder, one should know about all diseases common to the breed and make sure they are breeding quality dogs.

She refuses to accept the fact that the disease is genetic. It is VERY SAD!

My dog now needs surgery and the total cost of the surgery and all the medication will be at least $2,500. He is in a lot of pain and is suffering right now. This has been hard on my family and nobody should have to go through what we have gone through.

My puppies dad is the father of Brenda's upcoming litter. I am sure she will continue to breed puppies from the same mom and dad in the future!

Please educate yourself before you buy a puppy from ANY breeder. Do your homework and ask A TON of QUESTIONS!!!!

Feel free to contact me if you have any questions. My email is: mynameisjake128@hotmail.com

I am so sorry to hear of your pups diagnosis. Did you have a signed contract with this breeder promising to pay any future vet bills? The reason I ask is...most breeders (myself included) will replace the puppy with the next available puppy. Did your breeder promise in her/his contract to pay any vet bills that may occur in the first few years?
Have you and/or your vet proven to the breeder that the Legg calves perthes was not brought on through injury or environmental reasons?

I wish you and your pup the best, and hope that all goes well with his surgery. Please keep us updated on his progress.

marcerella02 · 03-27-2009, 04:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kpstoybox

I am so sorry to hear of your pups diagnosis. Did you have a signed contract with this breeder promising to pay any future vet bills? The reason I ask is...most breeders (myself included) will replace the puppy with the next available puppy. Did your breeder promise in her/his contract to pay any vet bills that may occur in the first few years?
Have you and/or your vet proven to the breeder that the Legg calves perthes was not brought on through injury or environmental reasons?

I wish you and your pup the best, and hope that all goes well with his surgery. Please keep us updated on his progress.

I have a question- why do breeders say they will replace the puppy? I think this is kinda crazy. If at 11 months I found out Layla had a genetic disease you coudln't pry her away from my hands- i woudln't be looking for a "replacement". I can see the Principle of it- you promised something that was healthy and if it isn't you are going to make sure that happens- but i don't know many people that would say- well he's broken- better go get a new one... anyways- i was just wondering if maybe there was a different way breeders could handle this.

ARCHIE · 03-27-2009, 05:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by marcerella02

I have a question- why do breeders say they will replace the puppy? I think this is kinda crazy. If at 11 months I found out Layla had a genetic disease you coudln't pry her away from my hands- i woudln't be looking for a "replacement". I can see the Principle of it- you promised something that was healthy and if it isn't you are going to make sure that happens- but i don't know many people that would say- well he's broken- better go get a new one... anyways- i was just wondering if maybe there was a different way breeders could handle this.

I have always thought the samething. Sounds good but very few,
if any buyer's would ever take advantage of it.

journey826 · 03-27-2009, 05:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by marcerella02

I have a question- why do breeders say they will replace the puppy? I think this is kinda crazy. If at 11 months I found out Layla had a genetic disease you coudln't pry her away from my hands- i woudln't be looking for a "replacement". I can see the Principle of it- you promised something that was healthy and if it isn't you are going to make sure that happens- but i don't know many people that would say- well he's broken- better go get a new one... anyways- i was just wondering if maybe there was a different way breeders could handle this.

chickwit · 03-27-2009, 05:37 AM

If the Breeder is willing to replace the dog then why not just give the amount of money that they would recieve for the dog if they sold it ?
That could help with the vet bill!!!!Knowing that once someone gets attached to there little ones their not going to part with them no matter what is wrong with them.......they are now part of someones Family!!!!!
So sorry about your little one

Sending Prayers your way

mynameisjake128 · 03-27-2009, 05:53 AM

Hello everybody who responded to my post. I love to read them! Keep them coming!!

As most have you have commended on - YES it's kind of weird that brenda says she will replace a puppy with a genetic defect.

I think this is the case because most breeders know that when you bring a puppy in your life and raise him for almost a year you get attached and there is no way a person in their right mind would give him up. Funny how this "reputable" breeder doesn't want her puppy saying in a home that REALLY loves him and is willing to whatever it takes to get him better!

I told my mom that Brenda offered to replace Lucky for another new puppy and she was like "WOULD YOU REPLACE A CHILD IF IT HAD A DISEASE?? NO WAY!". Our puppy is our child. She's just trying to get off of this without doing anything, and that's what's happening. So, it's our intent to notify any person that is interested in one of her puppies to really think twice. This shouldn't be happening!!!

I asked Brenda OVER and OVER what she would even do with Lucky (our dog) if she did replace him. She never answered that question. If she would take him back and provide him with the care he needs she would have to pay for all his medical costs AND then she'd have to give me a puppy that was of equal cost to Lucky (we paid $1,300), so she wouldn't be getting any of that money either. It would cost her more to replace than pay for the surgery. We only asked Brenda to pay for the surgery and NOT any of the other medical costs associated with this disease (xrays, bone work, pre surgery tests, pain meds, physical therapy, etc. etc.).

She claims it's not genetic, but then why are you offering to replace him per your contract??!?!? She's in denial and I'm realizing she doesn't know much about the breed at all. Actually, in doing more research on her over the last few days, her kennel used to be under a different name "greens tiny treasures" or something like that. She also breeds chis. Who knew.

I have sent numerous articles to Brenda (some given to me by our specialists who know the disease) saying this is genetic. The Yorkshire Terrier Club of America's HEALTH page also states clearly that they suggest that all breeders do genetic testing to get their dogs OFA certified for LEGG PERTHES. If this wasn't genetic why would the breed club recommend that breeding dogs be tested for this disease? Hmmmmm

Brenda, you shocked that I took this public? As I said, our family has been very upset over this the last few days and there is NO reason this should of happened to us or any body else. This should be public. When we spend $1,300 in hopes to get a quality dog without and defects, that's what we should get! Simple as that!!

I have posted various other posts on here as well. Please everybody check them out!

Oh, and does anybody know how to delete an old post I wrote on here? I wrote one months ago and it needs to come down!

More to come!!!

marcerella02 · 03-27-2009, 05:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by journey826

I almost feel like the "we will replace your puppy" clause seems like a good idea to a breeder because they almost know that many owners will not be returning their pup. I don' tknow... i'm very confused by it and I hope a breeder will come on and sort it all out!

mynameisjake128 · 03-27-2009, 05:59 AM

I totally agree with you Chickwit!!

This seems logical to me!!!!

As I said in my earlier post, I think "replacing" a puppy is something easy for breeders to do because nobody would replace their family member. It's crazy.

Nobody would replace a dog after 11 months of owning him!!

Thanks for the thoughts and prayers!!! They are appreciated! Everybody on this website seems so nice!! I should come by more often!

Breeze · 03-27-2009, 06:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chickwit

If the Breeder is willing to replace the dog then why not just give the amount of money that they would recieve for the dog if they sold it ?
That could help with the vet bill!!!!Knowing that once someone gets attached to there little ones their not going to part with them no matter what is wrong with them.......they are now part of someones Family!!!!!
So sorry about your little one

Sending Prayers your way

Thats my thoughts too.

txrosegirl · 03-27-2009, 06:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by marcerella02

I almost feel like the "we will replace your puppy" clause seems like a good idea to a breeder because they almost know that many owners will not be returning their pup. I don' tknow... i'm very confused by it and I hope a breeder will come on and sort it all out!

i agree and i think this kind of contract has become the norm for breeders. i am not commenting on whether or not it is good or bad because i am not a breeder and have no idea of the things they need to protect themselves from (as we have even recently discovered, there are a lot of dishonest breeders AND buyers out there)

i know one of my babies came with a 100% MONEY BACK HEALTH guarantee which i thought was great.

ETA: brenda, sorry you are going through this. i have read nothing but good things about you and your babies and i think it is outstanding you offered to replace the puppy even though it fell outside the signed contract

Lorraine · 03-27-2009, 06:38 AM

Legge-Calves-Perthes is thought to be genetic that is correct but not proven for sure yet. However, there is wrong information, there is NO TEST for it. Until a genetic marker is found for it, there is no way in a mating a breeder will know that a pup could potentially have LCP.
If there was a test that would make it easy. Two completely normal parents can be carriers meaning they don't have it but are carrying the genes to produce it. You don't know if they are until you actually get a puppy from the mating that has it. It does help enormously if you know the lines you dealing with to know what might be in the background but that still is not a for sure thing, it can still pop up in a mating.
An LCP dog or puppy, usually manifests the symptoms by suddenly hiking the rear leg and sometimes will not walk on it at all. It is easy for the average pet owner to think they have pulled something or perhaps has a knee issue.
A visit to the Vet who will xray if LCP is suspected will confirm it. you can see it on the xray where the end of the bone going into the hip, has lost circulation and died. It almost looks like a break.
A knowledgable vet can do surgery, remove the end of the bone that has died, put it back into the hip. After initial healing gentle exercise and massage will knit a new joint.
However, the parents should be removed from the breeding program and certainly progeny should not be used for breeding again.
I have seen a Pomeranian with this, now 12 years old, living a very normal happy life and no arthritis has set in at all.
In my contracts, I have a guarantee for LCP but I would pay for the surgery and refund half the purchase price should the owner want to keep the puppy.

blueskies · 03-27-2009, 09:17 AM

Not going to comment on the breeder or what one should or shouldn't cover or offer, but I did want to point this out: the OP obviously read and signed the contract when he/she purchased the puppy in the first place. If you did not agree with the contract in the first place, why did you sign it? Why didn't you just find another breeder? The fact is, you did sign that contract, and that is not the breeders fault. The blame does not all go on one person here, it is both parties. The OP should have researched and found a breeder and contract that he/she was comfortable with. The fact is, you are bound by that contract because you signed it. Not saying it's fair or not fair, but it is what it is.

Also, the poster above is correct, just because parents don't have it does not mean it's not in the lines, and sometimes there is no way to tell. Health issues will, at one point or another, come up in a breeder's program. Unfortunately Yorkies are a breed that carry many genetic health problems in their lines. Even a line that has been clear for many years can have something come up randomly. However, I do believe that those two parents should never be bred together again, and if either parent bred to another dog has the health issue come up again, then they should be spayed/neutered and all puppies from those litters as well.

Again, not trying to point fingers here, just playing Devil's Advocate.

MyFairLacy · 03-27-2009, 09:40 AM

Anytime a disease or defect affects a breed or group of breeds more often it is known to have some genetic basis. Legge calve perthes most commonly affects toy breeds and small terriers. It is widely thought to have a genetic cause, however they don't know the mode of inheritance - ie is it autosomal recessive, multigenic, etc. They don't know what gene(s) cause it just like the currently don't know what genes cause liver shunt (but they do know it us genetic) if you breed two LCP dogs, there is a high mode of inheritance in the offspring. This is why breed clubs and the OFA recommend not breeding any LCP dog.

This article discusses some research behing LCP and it's mode of inheritance
SHOW DOG MAGAZINE, Leg Perthes in dodgs

So far as the contract, it I'd true that that is what you agreed on so legally she's under no obligation to help. I personally would never agree to such a contract. I would only sign a contract that agreed to pay medical costs up to the purchase price of the dog. It is a loophole to include the words "life threatening" as it is open to interpretation, and to only offer a replacement always gets the breeder off Scott free because no loving pet owner would return their dog. These contracts are so common and appear okay to many pet buyers, but they really don't offer much at all in my opinion. The breeder ought to pay medical cost up to the purchase price of the puppy.

Two other thoughts: why would a buyer want another puppy from a breeder when they already got one with a problem? And two - why would the breeder want to give another puppy to a buyer that would return a pet for being sick? A loving pet owner wouldn't give up their pet.

Now with alltgat said - having one puppy with a health issue does not in itself make brenda a bad breeder. It will show in how she handles it. If she's researched her lines and health screened, she has done all she could up until this point. You unfortunately can't identify carrier dogs right now, and it might not have showed up until these two particular carrier dogs were bred that produced the genes necessary to cause disease in this puppy. Hopefully she will do the right thing and stand behind her puppy and make sure the parents aren't bred again, as well as any offspring. Even the most careful breeder could get a puppy pop up with an issue - it's all in how they handle the situation.

To the OP, I'm sorry about your puppy

03-26-2009, 08:53 PM	#1
mynameisjake128 Yorkie Talker Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Pleasant Hill, CA Posts: 14	My Review of GREENS TREASURED YORKSHIRE TERRIERS - MICHIGAN I bought a puppy from Brenda last May. This puppy now has a genetic bone disease called Legge Perthes. My vet and all the specialists I have talked to have confirmed that it is genetic and could have been prevented if the parents were tested for the gene (it can be recessive and puppies can get it even though their parents don't have it). Please look it up for more info. This disease is very common in Yorkies and causes a lot of pain and suffering to the dogs. Brenda did not even know about the disease and how common it was until I told her about it. She does not get her breeding dogs tested for it. As a breeder, one should know about all diseases common to the breed and make sure they are breeding quality dogs. She refuses to accept the fact that the disease is genetic. It is VERY SAD! My dog now needs surgery and the total cost of the surgery and all the medication will be at least $2,500. He is in a lot of pain and is suffering right now. This has been hard on my family and nobody should have to go through what we have gone through. My puppies dad is the father of Brenda's upcoming litter. I am sure she will continue to breed puppies from the same mom and dad in the future! Please educate yourself before you buy a puppy from ANY breeder. Do your homework and ask A TON of QUESTIONS!!!! Feel free to contact me if you have any questions. My email is: mynameisjake128@hotmail.com Update: 3/30/09 Me and Brenda worked together to come to an agreement on the above issue. She has went above and beyond her original contract to resolve this issue and she is a reputable breeder. Last edited by admin; 03-30-2009 at 02:44 PM. Reason: Admin Edit: Update of review 3/30/09

03-26-2009, 09:57 PM	#2
Breny My Tiny Treasures Donating Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: . Posts: 11,790 Blog Entries: 3	I would love to respond. I have offered repeatedly to uphold my contract with you but you refused stating your mom loves her pet, which I understand. I still, to this day, have not received any proof of this diagnosis. NONE. But I still offered to take him back and replace him. After consulting with my Vet she even confirms that is is NOT proven to be a genetic disease as it can also be caused from injury or trauma. Legg-Perthes' Legg-Perthes' disease is a degeneration of the head of the femur. The femur is the upper bone in the rear legs of dogs. The part of the femur that degenerates is the ball at the end of the bone that fits into the socket formed by the pelvic bone. There is no conclusive evidence that demonstrates whether Legg-Perthes' disease is genetic or that certain dogs are more prone than others. It is known that the condition may be caused by trauma to the joint. The degeneration may be triggered by a fall or blow to the hip joint that causes the flow of blood to the joint to be impeded. Regardless of cause, Legg-Perthes' disease causes, pain, limping, and then eventually arthritis in the affected hip. It is common for Legg-Perthes' disease to affect only one hip of the dog. Legg-Perthes' disease is treated with surgery to remove the disintegrated bone segment. Once the bad part of the bone is removed the muscles surrounding the joint may begin to hold the leg in place. Recovery is usually near complete and improvement is rapid. The disease usually shows up by the seventh month. The only real preventive measure that can be taken is to keep your puppy from climbing when he or she is young. Puppies naturally like to get up on the furniture with you. When they are young, they may try to jump--or simply fall--from a height too great for them to effectively navigate, resulting in Legg-Perthes' disease. The parents have been researched and there are no signs of Legg Perthes in either parents lines, as well as throughly Vet checked. I am awaiting the OFA paperwork. You told me you wanted me to pay for his surgery and I explained at that time I would be happy to uphold to my contract, (Even though this is not a proven Genetic disease) which states: If this dog is determined to have a major health defect, he/she may be returned to the seller for an exchange, (no cash refunds) at that time. If the puppy has a life threatening congenital or hereditary defect, it will be replaced with the first available puppy of the same value from the breeders stock, as soon as possible. Proof must be shown by Veterinarian and validated by my Veterinarian. The breeder is not responsible for any Veterinarian bills the purchaser may incur regarding said puppy. You signed this contract but told me that if I didn’t pay for his surgery: “You will be spreading the word as much as you can through forums, blogs, people that see him, yorkie websites, your vets and surgeons, etc. “ and threaten to post on YorkieTalk”. This was all said to me once I told you that I do not pay vet bills. I’m so sorry you felt you had to take this public. You do not know what my dogs have or have not been tested for, yet you post this, as to assume I am breeding dogs with health issues which is the furthest from the truth. __________________ http://Brenysbabies.com

03-27-2009, 05:37 AM	#7
chickwit YT Addict Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Airdrie,Alberta,Canada Posts: 358	If the Breeder is willing to replace the dog then why not just give the amount of money that they would recieve for the dog if they sold it ? That could help with the vet bill!!!!Knowing that once someone gets attached to there little ones their not going to part with them no matter what is wrong with them.......they are now part of someones Family!!!!! So sorry about your little one Sending Prayers your way __________________ Linda and Harley Regret makes you old, and bitterness poisons the people around you.

03-27-2009, 05:53 AM	#8
mynameisjake128 Yorkie Talker Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Pleasant Hill, CA Posts: 14	Thanks for all the posts! Hello everybody who responded to my post. I love to read them! Keep them coming!! As most have you have commended on - YES it's kind of weird that brenda says she will replace a puppy with a genetic defect. I think this is the case because most breeders know that when you bring a puppy in your life and raise him for almost a year you get attached and there is no way a person in their right mind would give him up. Funny how this "reputable" breeder doesn't want her puppy saying in a home that REALLY loves him and is willing to whatever it takes to get him better! I told my mom that Brenda offered to replace Lucky for another new puppy and she was like "WOULD YOU REPLACE A CHILD IF IT HAD A DISEASE?? NO WAY!". Our puppy is our child. She's just trying to get off of this without doing anything, and that's what's happening. So, it's our intent to notify any person that is interested in one of her puppies to really think twice. This shouldn't be happening!!! I asked Brenda OVER and OVER what she would even do with Lucky (our dog) if she did replace him. She never answered that question. If she would take him back and provide him with the care he needs she would have to pay for all his medical costs AND then she'd have to give me a puppy that was of equal cost to Lucky (we paid $1,300), so she wouldn't be getting any of that money either. It would cost her more to replace than pay for the surgery. We only asked Brenda to pay for the surgery and NOT any of the other medical costs associated with this disease (xrays, bone work, pre surgery tests, pain meds, physical therapy, etc. etc.). She claims it's not genetic, but then why are you offering to replace him per your contract??!?!? She's in denial and I'm realizing she doesn't know much about the breed at all. Actually, in doing more research on her over the last few days, her kennel used to be under a different name "greens tiny treasures" or something like that. She also breeds chis. Who knew. I have sent numerous articles to Brenda (some given to me by our specialists who know the disease) saying this is genetic. The Yorkshire Terrier Club of America's HEALTH page also states clearly that they suggest that all breeders do genetic testing to get their dogs OFA certified for LEGG PERTHES. If this wasn't genetic why would the breed club recommend that breeding dogs be tested for this disease? Hmmmmm Brenda, you shocked that I took this public? As I said, our family has been very upset over this the last few days and there is NO reason this should of happened to us or any body else. This should be public. When we spend $1,300 in hopes to get a quality dog without and defects, that's what we should get! Simple as that!! I have posted various other posts on here as well. Please everybody check them out! Oh, and does anybody know how to delete an old post I wrote on here? I wrote one months ago and it needs to come down! More to come!!!

03-27-2009, 06:38 AM	#13
Lorraine Donating YT 1000 Club Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Abbotsford, BC Posts: 2,060	Legge-Calves-Perthes is thought to be genetic that is correct but not proven for sure yet. However, there is wrong information, there is NO TEST for it. Until a genetic marker is found for it, there is no way in a mating a breeder will know that a pup could potentially have LCP. If there was a test that would make it easy. Two completely normal parents can be carriers meaning they don't have it but are carrying the genes to produce it. You don't know if they are until you actually get a puppy from the mating that has it. It does help enormously if you know the lines you dealing with to know what might be in the background but that still is not a for sure thing, it can still pop up in a mating. An LCP dog or puppy, usually manifests the symptoms by suddenly hiking the rear leg and sometimes will not walk on it at all. It is easy for the average pet owner to think they have pulled something or perhaps has a knee issue. A visit to the Vet who will xray if LCP is suspected will confirm it. you can see it on the xray where the end of the bone going into the hip, has lost circulation and died. It almost looks like a break. A knowledgable vet can do surgery, remove the end of the bone that has died, put it back into the hip. After initial healing gentle exercise and massage will knit a new joint. However, the parents should be removed from the breeding program and certainly progeny should not be used for breeding again. I have seen a Pomeranian with this, now 12 years old, living a very normal happy life and no arthritis has set in at all. In my contracts, I have a guarantee for LCP but I would pay for the surgery and refund half the purchase price should the owner want to keep the puppy. __________________ Lorraine www.loribenyorkies.com Canada

03-27-2009, 05:59 AM	#10
mynameisjake128 Yorkie Talker Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Pleasant Hill, CA Posts: 14	I totally agree with you Chickwit!! This seems logical to me!!!! As I said in my earlier post, I think "replacing" a puppy is something easy for breeders to do because nobody would replace their family member. It's crazy. Nobody would replace a dog after 11 months of owning him!! Thanks for the thoughts and prayers!!! They are appreciated! Everybody on this website seems so nice!! I should come by more often!

03-27-2009, 09:17 AM	#14
blueskies Senior Yorkie Talker Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Tacoma, WA Posts: 138	Not going to comment on the breeder or what one should or shouldn't cover or offer, but I did want to point this out: the OP obviously read and signed the contract when he/she purchased the puppy in the first place. If you did not agree with the contract in the first place, why did you sign it? Why didn't you just find another breeder? The fact is, you did sign that contract, and that is not the breeders fault. The blame does not all go on one person here, it is both parties. The OP should have researched and found a breeder and contract that he/she was comfortable with. The fact is, you are bound by that contract because you signed it. Not saying it's fair or not fair, but it is what it is. Also, the poster above is correct, just because parents don't have it does not mean it's not in the lines, and sometimes there is no way to tell. Health issues will, at one point or another, come up in a breeder's program. Unfortunately Yorkies are a breed that carry many genetic health problems in their lines. Even a line that has been clear for many years can have something come up randomly. However, I do believe that those two parents should never be bred together again, and if either parent bred to another dog has the health issue come up again, then they should be spayed/neutered and all puppies from those litters as well. Again, not trying to point fingers here, just playing Devil's Advocate. Last edited by blueskies; 03-27-2009 at 09:20 AM.

03-27-2009, 09:40 AM	#15
MyFairLacy Donating YT 10K Club Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: DFW, Texas Posts: 11,003	Anytime a disease or defect affects a breed or group of breeds more often it is known to have some genetic basis. Legge calve perthes most commonly affects toy breeds and small terriers. It is widely thought to have a genetic cause, however they don't know the mode of inheritance - ie is it autosomal recessive, multigenic, etc. They don't know what gene(s) cause it just like the currently don't know what genes cause liver shunt (but they do know it us genetic) if you breed two LCP dogs, there is a high mode of inheritance in the offspring. This is why breed clubs and the OFA recommend not breeding any LCP dog. This article discusses some research behing LCP and it's mode of inheritance SHOW DOG MAGAZINE, Leg Perthes in dodgs So far as the contract, it I'd true that that is what you agreed on so legally she's under no obligation to help. I personally would never agree to such a contract. I would only sign a contract that agreed to pay medical costs up to the purchase price of the dog. It is a loophole to include the words "life threatening" as it is open to interpretation, and to only offer a replacement always gets the breeder off Scott free because no loving pet owner would return their dog. These contracts are so common and appear okay to many pet buyers, but they really don't offer much at all in my opinion. The breeder ought to pay medical cost up to the purchase price of the puppy. Two other thoughts: why would a buyer want another puppy from a breeder when they already got one with a problem? And two - why would the breeder want to give another puppy to a buyer that would return a pet for being sick? A loving pet owner wouldn't give up their pet. Now with alltgat said - having one puppy with a health issue does not in itself make brenda a bad breeder. It will show in how she handles it. If she's researched her lines and health screened, she has done all she could up until this point. You unfortunately can't identify carrier dogs right now, and it might not have showed up until these two particular carrier dogs were bred that produced the genes necessary to cause disease in this puppy. Hopefully she will do the right thing and stand behind her puppy and make sure the parents aren't bred again, as well as any offspring. Even the most careful breeder could get a puppy pop up with an issue - it's all in how they handle the situation. To the OP, I'm sorry about your puppy __________________ ~Magnifique Yorkies~ Purchasing from backyard breeders, pet shops, and puppymills perpetuates the suffering of other dogs. Educate yourself and buy from reputable breeders or rescue.