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Old 05-25-2008, 08:05 AM   #1
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Animal Smiley 019 16 Month Old Female In OKC, OK

1. Your name - Dena Lamkin

2. Your city, state: Oklahoma City, OK

3. Your phone number: 405-604-3101

4. Your email address: mom2babynatalie@aol.com

5. Yorkie(s) For Sale: Gloria - NON REGISTERED Female

6. Birthdate of Yorkie(s): 12/31/06

7. Age of Yorkie(s): 16 Months

8. Weight of Yorkie(s) parents: Said to be 4.5 lbs and 6 lbs. - I have not seen them.

9. Current weight of Yorkie(s) for sale: 3.5 - 4 lbs

10. Registration if any (AKC, etc): NONE

11. Price: 1000.00

12. When puppies will be ready to be taken home: Following Spay

13. Do you ship your Yorkies: Yes, at buyer's expense - 300.00 via Continental Airlines - includes all airline fees, taxes, transport, vet certified health certificate, airline approved travel kennel w/ soft travel bed, blanket, toys & accessories - -

14. Any additional information you want to add:

Gloria is a little doll baby! I purchased her to include in my program, but had some "issues" with the previous owner - leaving us with no registration... just one of the reasons that we are placing her in a pet home.
While she is not "breeding quality", she is a lovely little girl with a sugar sweet spirit and nice docile temperament.
Her weight varies between 3.5 - 4 lbs depending on her activity level (yesterday she was at a solid 3.5 lbs) - with the crazy weather in OK, there are times when she can't get outside and play for days at a time and she tends to eat a little more w/ less activity... though even at 3.5, she is a nice solid girl (not "skinny") and should be at her adult weight. I had initially thought she would reach 5 lbs, but it doesn't look like that is going to happen.
Gloria is 7" tall at the withers and 9" long.
She is well socialized with other animals - new people - children - and does very well with everyone! She has shown no signs whatsoever of aggression issues or other temperament concerns. She has spouted off with a bark from time to time in play with the other dogs, but she is otherwise a very quiet baby.... she is a very well rounded, happy little girl.
She is 100% house trained to wee pads. She has free reign of our home and sleeps in bed with me every night. She has never been a "kennel dog" or caged for any reason.
She is crate trained for transport purposes and has no anxiety issues with her travel kennel.
Gloria is an affectionate baby and loves to snuggle, but she is not so "needy" that she is unable to entertain herself with toys or "exploration"... she's the perfect companion for young or old and is quite accommodating to any situation she's been put in!
She may need some leash work w/ harness as we haven't had her on one much - - but she loves outings in her "purse / carrier" and being carried around, riding in the cart at PetSmart, etc.
She enjoys "dress up" and loves being brushed and pampered.... she's an angel in the tub and does beautifully for grooming.
Gloria has never been bred and will be spayed before going to her new home.
She has some retained baby teeth that will be extracted at the time of her spay.
Gloria will receive a full blood panel before her spay surgery to assure she is in good health... a bile acid test for LS will be performed if the blood panel in any way warrants concern. She will receive a complete health evaluation with examination of eyes, hearing, overall general health and she will be checked for LP and cardiac concerns.
She is current on all vaccinations, worming, parasite control and heartworm prevention.
She does not yet have the "correct coat colors" and I don't know if that will chage with time... she is black and tan... her head looks like it may stay silver/blue rather than tan, though the tan in her face is beginning to come out. Her coat is soft, silky and grows quickly... a bit dryer than I like, but a leave in conditioner keeps the "frizzies" away. She was shaved down when she arrived in February and already has a nice laying coat coming on. It is easy to maintain and does not tangle easily.
A separate puppy pack will be shipped to Gloria's new family with toys, treats, food & supplements, grooming supplies, little dresses, blankets and more!
Gloria is an excellent little house mate and is ready to find her best friend and human counterpart!! Please feel free to contact me with further questions!
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Old 05-25-2008, 10:45 AM   #2
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what a cutie pie!! Someone will be lucky to have that sweet baby!! wish i could get her as i love the "teenagers". I hope a YT'er will get her so we can keep up with her!! She's is precious!!
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Old 05-25-2008, 02:14 PM   #3
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She is so cute! Wish I could take on a 4th!!
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Old 05-25-2008, 04:08 PM   #4
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Hi Dena. I sent you a PM.

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Old 05-26-2008, 01:39 PM   #5
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Default Your Post From February...

Dena, I came across some old posts about Gloria. (See below) Has she been checked out to determine whether she has hip or knee problems as you suspected when she first came to you? It looks as though you got her in February. You never mentioned in your for sale ad or to me in PM about her back legs or the possiblility of hip or knee problems. And, you never mentioned about her large overbite.

You mentioned that prior to her going to her forever home that you would look into this, but if you suspected this back in February iand it really should have been checked into back then, before listing her for sale or having a potential home get their hopes up and then finds out there are hip or knee problems that was previously suspected.

Back in February you also said she was very underweight and should be around 4.5 lbs. Isn't she still only 3.5 lbs. so is that weight alright for her or do you still think she should be about 4.5 lbs. I'm confused.

I think I will have to pass. I was un-aware of any of these issues (or) the fact that you were trying to send her back to her original owner. And, I don't mean to cause trouble by posting this or your original February post but I do think it's only fair that someone interested know all of this. It's unfair to not tell a prospective home. I know you did mention to me that because YOU did not breed her that you could not offer a health guarantee with her. Hmm, I'm sorry but this does raise concern for me since NONE of these possible health problems nor the overbite was mentioned to me via your PM.

I'm really sorry for this little girl and I hope she finds a wonderful home.

Elaine (Below is your post from February)

______________________________________________

(Your Post from February when she first came to you)


Well she certainly is a sweetheart... but what it really comes down to, is that I paid for a HEALTHY 1 year old female Yorkshire Terrier - free of genetic / congenital defects -

I was told that she was a perfectly healthy 4 lb girl - but that she did have "a couple of retained baby teeth".... okay, a couple of teeth pulled... I can do that.... but NINE??? At a year old?? That will cost a pretty penny....

Secondly, she is NOT a HEALTHY 4 lb girl... she is a GROSSLY UNDERWEIGHT 3 lb girl who SHOULD weigh 4.5 lbs (or thereabouts) You can feel EVERY bone in her spine, hips, ribs... ugh.... it's terrible...

She has a pretty large overbite - only worsend by the additional teeth she has in her little mouth....

She walks with her back legs as though they look "too close together"... so I'm only assuming that she has knee / hip / joint problems... unconfirmed of course, as I haven't had her to the vet....

Regardless.... she's precious... and I'm certain will make someone a wonderful pet once they've dealt with her issues....

But frankly, what I paid for her... was not a "pet quality" price... nor was it anywhere CLOSE to that of a "rescue dog" which essentially is what she'd be if I decided to keep her.... which I'm not...

My own fault.... for not being more diligent.... lesson learned...
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Old 05-26-2008, 03:12 PM   #6
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Elaine,

There should be several posts regarding little Gloria free for the reading in the YT forums - and I do have to say that when she was arrived, she was NOT what I expected... and I was indeed, justifiably upset. (as you may have "felt" from my posts).

Several of her retained baby teeth have since fallen out on her own and the overbite was caused by those retained teeth. It has essentially worked itself out and will continue to do so with the extraction of the remaining retained teeth. Within a couple of months of the extractions, she will likely have a nice scissor bite.... IF she has any overbite at all, it will remain slight.

As for her knees and hips - my initial posting back in February was premature, I'm sure... caused by my unhappiness with her overall condition... and the "stiffness" I initially recognized was seemingly just that, stiffness, from being kenneled throughout her journey to Oklahoma. She has been fine with her movement since then - yet as stated in this listing, she will be checked for LP and other pertinent issues BEFORE going to her new home. I don't suspect a negative outcome of any of the medical testing that will be performed.

When she arrived she was a terribly skinny girl... all of her bones could be easily felt... she was just BARELY 3 lbs - and yes, she still is only between 3.5 and 4 lbs... yet her overall build and muscle mass is greatly improved. (even a half pound on these little ones makes a huge difference in their health and appearance). She has been kept on a high quality diet with supplements since day one with us and is doing beautifully. She is at a nice healthy weight right now. As stated in my listing for her availability, I did expect her to grow to be a 5 lb adult.... but I don't see her getting to that at this point.

My initial concerns regarding Gloria, even though they were evidently unfounded since my experience with her - - are the reasons for the COMPLETE medical screening as noted below.... rarely would you find another pup being placed in a pet home, receive such a thorough evaluation with vet documentation - not to mention surgical procedures as the spay and dental work noted - before being placed.

I respect your decision not to proceed and thank you for considering her.... although there is no need to "feel sorry" for her.... she is well cared for, loved and in good hands until the right family for her comes along.

For anyone who still may be interested in making this girl a part of your family, I will be posting in a few moments, a short video and photos that we just finished up this afternoon.
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Old 05-26-2008, 03:32 PM   #7
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Dena, thanks for the post back. I think it's great that you are doing the spay and dental prior to adopting. You're right most people selling do not do this and as I said to you in PM's I commend you for taking that kind of care. My only concern was that I wish I had known about some of these possible issues first (Such as possible hip or knee problems)

As I said to you I have rescues and NONE of them are without faults and I love them for who they are and would not trade or sell them for any amount of money, but we don't know each other and when a Yorkie is for sale in a different state that is going to be shipped, you have to rely on what the owner tells you and be comfortable and I have to be honest I was upset reading your February post and not seeing any of this (Especially possible knee or hip troulbe) mentioned in your for sale ad.

Again, I do commend you for doing her dental, vet testing and her spay. You're right no one does this but with all do respect I still believe that if their were hip or knee concerns THAT should have been checked prior to listing her for sale.

What happens if someone falls in love with her and then iafter you do your testing, it turns out her knees or hips are bad? Will you take care of the vetting for that as well or will you tell the prospective owner and then leave it up to them whether to proceed and pay themselves to have the surgery to correct it? Again, I'm not trying to be fresh but that leaves that person in a terrible dilema as they may love her but not have the funds to pay for that kind of expensive surgey. Where as if that had been checked prior then prospective homes would know in advance before falling in love and can then make an educated decision on whether they can proceed or not.

Anyway, thanks again for your post and I really really do hope she finds a great home.

Elaine
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Old 05-26-2008, 03:36 PM   #8
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Dena,

I remember when you were disatisfied with some things about Gloria and was considering sending her back. I am glad that you keppt her gave her time to develop and see if she would fit in your breeding progam. It also says alot that you are having her spayed before she goes to her new home so she wont be bred. I think the price you are asking for her is a steal considering her size, the spay and all the testing you are doing. Someone is going to be very lucky to have her. Best wishes
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Old 05-26-2008, 03:40 PM   #9
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Quote:
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Dena,

I remember when you were disatisfied with some things about Gloria and was considering sending her back. I am glad that you keppt her gave her time to develop and see if she would fit in your breeding progam. It also says alot that you are having her spayed before she goes to her new home so she wont be bred. I think the price you are asking for her is a steal considering her size, the spay and all the testing you are doing. Someone is going to be very lucky to have her. Best wishes
I agree. Elaine
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Old 05-26-2008, 04:02 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrsygal37 View Post
What happens if someone falls in love with her and then iafter you do your testing, it turns out her knees or hips are bad? Will you take care of the vetting for that as well or will you tell the prospective owner and then leave it up to them whether to proceed and pay themselves to have the surgery to correct it? Again, I'm not trying to be fresh but that leaves that person in a terrible dilema as they may love her but not have the funds to pay for that kind of expensive surgey. Where as if that had been checked prior then prospective homes would know in advance before falling in love and can then make an educated decision on whether they can proceed or not.
I suppose when I posted Gloria's availability here on YT, I just ASSUMED (and yes, I know what that makes me, haha!) that EVERYONE knew of the issues I'd had with her and her breeder in the beginning. Everything was so public... not to mention the "heated debates" that followed (even leading to removal of many of the posts, including ones where I had followed up with new and better informed opinions on her physical condition - as well as the closing of threads that were left) - - but you're right, I should not have assumed.

Even still, I do feel that I am offering every opportunity to ASSURE that Gloria is in top physical condition before placing her. IF a negative report were to come back, the new owners would be fully informed of that BEFORE bringing Gloria home and able to make a decision as to her adoption.

Medical testing is expensive.... and while I am certainly willing to put forth the cost of such tests to determine that Gloria is indeed in good health, I truthfully wouldn't move forward with such things if she were to be staying here with me. I would have her spayed, baby teeth removed, and that would be that.... because to me, that would be all I would require to keep her as a family pet.

So essentially, if there is no interest in her here, I am not going to spend the money for further testing when I am having absolutely no problems with her health.

BUT, for the sake of a NEW family - who doesn't know me from Adam... and who hasn't had the wonderful opportunity of being with her from day to day - I am happy to provide all of the medical evaluations necessary for them to feel comfortable in bringing home new healthy little girl...

One has to know that a pup at this price, being offered to a pet home - is being placed as such with good reason.... because she does not meet the requirements of what would be a "breeding quality" animal. That being said, it would be silly for someone to expect a show dog in a situation like this... but I have noted my concerns with her and again, am following up with with what I feel are pertinent issues regarding placement....

And that's the best I can do.....
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Old 05-26-2008, 04:05 PM   #11
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As promised, here is Gloria's little video from this afternoon....

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Old 05-26-2008, 04:15 PM   #12
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Dena, I also commend you for taking the time to explain it but isn't that a lot for an unregistered dog? Well, anyway, hopefully she will find a good home here on YT and we can all watch her mature.
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Old 05-26-2008, 04:16 PM   #13
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Dena. That is a great video of her. Honestly, I know it's hard to tell in just a video but her hips/knees do not seem to give her any trouble. Tia (My little Morkie) has problems with her patellas. The vet said she's so small that she should be fine. Only thing I notice with her is that she does not run too much, but that may be just her. She's very lady like you know. LOL. Gloria is absolutely beautiful. She is really tugging on my heart strings. I also have an older couple that lost their 13 year old Yorkie to Kidney Failure back in December. That was when that food problem came about. He had been feeding her Iams and it caused kidney failure (The China problem). He sold me my furniture last week and he when he spoke of his Maggie you could see how torn up he still was. I promised I'd looke for a rescue or rehome for him. Hubby actually suggested that I send him this info on Gloria but I guess I'm selfish because I just fell for her. I'm going to get in touch with him via email and give him your info. I'm sorry if I jumped to conclusions with you. It's hard when you are dealing online with someone that you don't know and by nature I guess I'm suspicious. Kind of comes with being married to a cop. LOL. I would still like to consider her for myself but don't want to hold you up and have not spoken to hubby in detail. I am going to send this info. to the man and his wife. I think they would make a great home for a little one. They are older, and their children are grown and gone. I don't know them just from buying furniture from the man but I am pretty good with people and can usually tell how they are with animals and he truly loved his Yorkie.

Elaine
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Old 05-26-2008, 04:20 PM   #14
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Aw she is adorable. I love the two bows on her so cute
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Old 05-26-2008, 04:20 PM   #15
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Dena. Can you send me the video and pictures straight to my email address? This way I can forward it to the couple I mentioned in my post. My email address is jrsygal37@aol.com. Things happen for a reason, maybe I'm supposed to find this little girl for them. Who knows.

Thanks. Elaine
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