Yorkie Male wanted in Illinois!

[Mardelin]

Originally Posted by crayz

We found a breeder in the local newspaper and we're going to check her puppies out tomorrow. We asked her all of the standard questions, but a red flag raised when she said she only has the father and that the mother is with her daughter. How do I know that she is telling us the truth? I tried googling her online and I see that she used to show german shephards in the late 90's and is a part of the skye terriers club of america national rescue chair. I've also noticed that her name has been in the paper consistently for the past 3 weeks with new litters each time. Am I just being overly cautious here? What are everyone's thoughts?

Just the fact that this breeder advertised in the local newspaper SCREAMS volumes. Picking a breeder from the classifieds is not something I would recommend anyone to do.

Hey! But, check it out....just do a meet and greet and evaluate.....ask questions, write answers, ask to see a contract......come back here and ask more questions....Do not, I say do not put down a deposit.

[Furbaby Friend]

Originally Posted by Mardelin

Just the fact that this breeder advertised in the local newspaper SCREAMS volumes. Picking a breeder from the classifieds is not something I would recommend anyone to do.

Hey! But, check it out....just do a meet and greet and evaluate.....ask questions, write answers, ask to see a contract......come back here and ask more questions....Do not, I say do not put down a deposit.

I would also like to say that I started my breeder search in the paper and online and it was a very poor place to start comparatively I think to the YTCA. Are there bad people everywhere? Yes, but I don't think the YTCA has nearly the volume of bad breeders as the paper or the internet does. I would feel more comfortable with the YTCA as a starting point. That's my opinion anyway.

You have to do your research with EVERYTHING. Including the YTCA and rescues. I found a bunch of "rescues" that were actually mills, but I didn't even know that until I came to YT. My mind just doesn't think like that... how could someone pose as a rescue? The level of scumbaggery my mind cannot fathom, so I'm lucky I came here for advice and found out how low people can stoop.

To the OP: Good for you doing your research! You're going to end up with a happy addition to your family! I expect pictures once you find them!

[Sugar's Mom]

Originally Posted by Mardelin

It's very easy to point fingers,,,,,talk trash, etc. I think the tough part is to look at the man in the mirror.

yes, it is!!!!!!!!!! I also agree with your other post about doing the meet and greet. As close as he is to this breeder, I see no reason why he should not check things out for himself. Who knows? He might find a diamond in the rough. On the other hand, it may be a total mess. But he does need to find this out for himself. Not one of us knows anything about this breeder because we have never been to her/his home . None of us know how the dogs are kept or what kind they are. Anything we would say would only be our opinion, hearsay or gossip so he needs to do it himself.

[JeanieK]

Originally Posted by gemy

I am so tired of the pot shots at YTCA and the AKC. No it doesn't mean if you belong to AKC or YTCA registered dogs that all is right in the world. Well actually no individual person belongs to the AKC,only breed clubs belong to the AKC.

BUT it doesn't mean all is NOT right in the world.

The breeder members of the YTCA are scrutinized prior membership, and agree to a code of conduct. Does that mean 100% will abide by it? Of course not. But probably the majority does.

It so damn easy to backhand those organizations that put out front their agenda(s). So easy to critique the shortcomings. So easy to find fault.

It is so easy, because they have a very public face. They show their ie post their ethics, their scruples, and they are watched, assessed, disparaged (on here it seems like at every turn).

I personally stand behind all those posters who say; "start at YTCA for a list of breeders" it is a good starting point. Then assess, rate, evaluate those breeders.

Are there other good breeders out there. Probably. But who knows who they are?

Excuse me please, I must have missed something in the post that I wrote.

Where am I taking pot shots at any one.

Here is exactly what I wrote, and no where does it say that the YTCA or the ACK is bad. And don't try to tell me what I REALLY meant by my post, because what I really meant is exactly what I said.

Originally Posted by JeanieK

I think the YTCA membership is just like AKC registered. It gives people a false sense of security.

Just because someone belongs to the YTCA or has AKC registered dogs, does not mean they are good breeders or good people. Nor does being a show breeder mean that you stand behind your dogs or breed healthy dogs.

To the OP. Do your homework on the breeder, beyond looking at their credentials.

[JeanieK]

Originally Posted by shodanusmc

Totally agree with what you wrote, but we all have to remember what the motivation is of the few people that bash the YTCA. I think anyone with the IQ above a potato know why they do it. You think Color of the dog has anything to do with it? Nah, that can't be why.

Perhaps if the YTCA printed the TRUTH about the parti color on their website they would have more credibility.

What they say about the parti color are lies. When someone lies about one thing, makes me wonder what else they have printed that are lies.

Why does the YTCA feel the need to lie about the parti color. It is a disqualifying color.. fine it's their club, their rules. But why lie about them.

[shodanusmc]

Yes, and we are all just suppoed to take what you and several other self servers have to say as fact!

[Furbaby Friend]

To the OP: We'd love to hear updates on your search. However, you may want to consider posting them in a brand new thread. It seems this one is about to turn into a full blown parti errr... "discussion." They tend to get pretty lively. Can't wait to hear about how your search is going! Good luck!

[jencar98]

JeanieK, I do agree with you that many could get a false sense of security by a breeder's association with the AKC and YTCA, not unlike the old "Good Housekeeping" seal of approval. I understand the legalese disclaimer on their page, but if the club's true best interest is the breed and not selling pups, perhaps no breeders should be listed, no breeder referral. Period.

According to breeders here, most show breeders have waiting lists for their pups anyway, so I really don't see why YTCA needs to promote sales with a breeder referral page? They provide information on the website educating on what to look for when buying a yorkie, maybe they should leave it at that?

[Rhetts_mama]

Parti-Color Yorkshire Terriers? Do not be fooled into buying one of these dogs.
Now that Designer Dogs are the rage, the “new” Parti-Color Yorkie is certain to draw attention. While we have had problems in the past with “rare gold” Yorkshire Terriers being advertised, the parti-color is a new one! While some breeds have an occasional mismark and some breeds do have a gene for a white dog, we do not. Had there been a problem with white markings, piebald dogs, or white dogs, it would have been addressed in our Standard. Due to unscrupulous breeders advertising parti-colored Yorkshire Terriers at premium prices, our members voted unanimously at our annual meeting to add a disqualification for these and other off colored dogs.
The Yorkshire Terrier is a tan dog with a blue saddle. The “rare gold” Yorkie is actually a dog that appears as such due to an improper saddle pattern. Show breeders have seen this and commonly call it running gold. When the dog is cut down, you can see that the blue saddle does not come down far enough. The Yorkshire Terrier blue saddle extends lower than some of the other black and tan terriers extending to the elbow and also to the hock on the rear leg. Gold hairs can occur in the blue and black or blue hairs can appear in the gold. These faults are addressed in the Yorkshire Terrier Standard. These dogs have serious faults and they too should not be sold as "rare" but placed in loving homes as they are very incorrect. Yorkies do not have white markings…never have. A small white strip is sometimes seen on the chest of newborns but this always turns to tan within a few weeks. The AKC registration form for Yorkshire Terriers allows for four choices: blue and tan, blue and gold, black and tan, black and gold. There is no provision for markings.
A brief history of the development of the Yorkshire Terrier will show that the dog was developed in the 1800’s. In England, the Waterside Terrier was often crossed with the old English terrier, a silky coated black and tan or blue and tan terrier weighing around five pounds. When crafters from Scotland came into England, they brought several “Scotch“terriers, among them the Paisley and the Clydesdale. The Paisley was a small silky coated dog in various shades of blue. The Clydesdale was a blue and tan dog with the exact color pattern as the Yorkie of today. All of these original breeds were grizzle, tan, blue, blue and tan, or black and tan. No white dog or dogs with white markings were involved in the process of developing the breed. The first Yorkshire Terriers were entered at shows as Broken Haired Scotch and Yorkshire Terriers. In the early days, dog classes were often divided by size, under five pounds and over five pounds; however, there was never a class for colors other than the blue and tan we see today. The color pattern and coat texture has bred true and has been dominate enough that the Silky Terrier evolved by crossing the Yorkshire Terrier and the Australian Terrier with basically the same coat of the of the Yorkie.

Yorkshire Terrier Club of America (Awards)


What exactly is the lie? You obviously have a very different take on the history of the Yorkshire Terrier than they do. You firmly believe that there were white dogs involved in the breed development. They just as firmly believe there was not. Calling them liars doesn't seem to be the best way of proving your point. I've got no clue who's right or who's wrong. I wasn't there. It just seems that if the white was more prevalent early on, wouldn't there have been some mention of it in the early breed standards?

[roseylovestosho]

I don't understand why every time the YTCA is mentioned there has to be a full-blown discussion. While the YTCA is not a 100% guarantee, the probability that you will find a bad breeder by contacting a YTCA member is a lot lower than if you just search the internet haphazardly. For someone who is completely new to looking for a Yorkie breeder, the YTCA offers a great information shortcut, which allows someone who is new acquire a lot of good information in one place. Yes, it is important to do a lot of research before finding a new companion, and yes it is important to thoroughly search for a good breeder, but if the OP does not know what to look for, it is a lot easier to contact a YTCA member who will more likely than not serve to educate him on a yorkie. That's what happened to me when I contacted a YTCA member. I spent an hour on the phone with her and learned A LOT. Everything she said (as well as information here) helped me on my path to finding the right breeder for me, however that path started with that one YTCA member.

[shodanusmc]

Color
Acceptable colors are black, lighter and darker shades of gray, lighter and darker shades of fawn, and red. Brindling is allowed on all of these colors. Solid fawn and red, including lighter and darker shades have a black or gray mask; it does not go beyond the eyes. There may be a white patch on the chest, throat, chin, backs of the pasterns, and on the toes. Disqualification: Any color with marking pattern as seen in black and tan breeds

Wait, that is the standard for the Cane Corso
Cane Corso Association of America - AKC Parent Club of the Cane Corso

Now for this breed, you want to go to a reputable Breeder here, and not from some guy named Luigi on the street corner. Many Cotsi are in shelters because the person did not do any research on what to expect with this dog. THey are not for everyone. You could have 140 pounds of Liability, agression or Illness. But the breeder first, and research. The breed club is the best bet to go to for info, not the Classifieds.

[Furbaby Friend]

Originally Posted by roseylovestosho

I don't understand why every time the YTCA is mentioned there has to be a full-blown discussion. While the YTCA is not a 100% guarantee, the probability that you will find a bad breeder by contacting a YTCA member is a lot lower than if you just search the internet haphazardly. For someone who is completely new to looking for a Yorkie breeder, the YTCA offers a great information shortcut, which allows someone who is new acquire a lot of good information in one place. Yes, it is important to do a lot of research before finding a new companion, and yes it is important to thoroughly search for a good breeder, but if the OP does not know what to look for, it is a lot easier to contact a YTCA member who will more likely than not serve to educate him on a yorkie. That's what happened to me when I contacted a YTCA member. I spent an hour on the phone with her and learned A LOT. Everything she said (as well as information here) helped me on my path to finding the right breeder for me, however that path started with that one YTCA member.

I firmly believe you have a better chance at being led in the right direction with the YTCA as a STARTING POINT for your search for a pup. It is good start to researching because even if you DON'T get a pup from a YTCA member, you are more likely to be more educated when you leave there than when you started. If they don't have pups available a lot of them are likely to help you out in research (e.g. educate you on what you should look for and red flags to watch for). It is kind of like people coming here.

[shodanusmc]

Seems to apply here!

Cane Corso Association of America - AKC Parent Breed Club

[shodanusmc]

Best of both worlds.....

[yorkiegirl2]

Originally Posted by Rhetts_mama

Parti-Color Yorkshire Terriers? Do not be fooled into buying one of these dogs.
Now that Designer Dogs are the rage, the “new” Parti-Color Yorkie is certain to draw attention. While we have had problems in the past with “rare gold” Yorkshire Terriers being advertised, the parti-color is a new one! While some breeds have an occasional mismark and some breeds do have a gene for a white dog, we do not. Had there been a problem with white markings, piebald dogs, or white dogs, it would have been addressed in our Standard. Due to unscrupulous breeders advertising parti-colored Yorkshire Terriers at premium prices, our members voted unanimously at our annual meeting to add a disqualification for these and other off colored dogs.
The Yorkshire Terrier is a tan dog with a blue saddle. The “rare gold” Yorkie is actually a dog that appears as such due to an improper saddle pattern. Show breeders have seen this and commonly call it running gold. When the dog is cut down, you can see that the blue saddle does not come down far enough. The Yorkshire Terrier blue saddle extends lower than some of the other black and tan terriers extending to the elbow and also to the hock on the rear leg. Gold hairs can occur in the blue and black or blue hairs can appear in the gold. These faults are addressed in the Yorkshire Terrier Standard. These dogs have serious faults and they too should not be sold as "rare" but placed in loving homes as they are very incorrect. Yorkies do not have white markings…never have. A small white strip is sometimes seen on the chest of newborns but this always turns to tan within a few weeks. The AKC registration form for Yorkshire Terriers allows for four choices: blue and tan, blue and gold, black and tan, black and gold. There is no provision for markings.
A brief history of the development of the Yorkshire Terrier will show that the dog was developed in the 1800’s. In England, the Waterside Terrier was often crossed with the old English terrier, a silky coated black and tan or blue and tan terrier weighing around five pounds. When crafters from Scotland came into England, they brought several “Scotch“terriers, among them the Paisley and the Clydesdale. The Paisley was a small silky coated dog in various shades of blue. The Clydesdale was a blue and tan dog with the exact color pattern as the Yorkie of today. All of these original breeds were grizzle, tan, blue, blue and tan, or black and tan. No white dog or dogs with white markings were involved in the process of developing the breed. The first Yorkshire Terriers were entered at shows as Broken Haired Scotch and Yorkshire Terriers. In the early days, dog classes were often divided by size, under five pounds and over five pounds; however, there was never a class for colors other than the blue and tan we see today. The color pattern and coat texture has bred true and has been dominate enough that the Silky Terrier evolved by crossing the Yorkshire Terrier and the Australian Terrier with basically the same coat of the of the Yorkie.

Yorkshire Terrier Club of America (Awards)


What exactly is the lie? You obviously have a very different take on the history of the Yorkshire Terrier than they do. You firmly believe that there were white dogs involved in the breed development. They just as firmly believe there was not. Calling them liars doesn't seem to be the best way of proving your point. I've got no clue who's right or who's wrong. I wasn't there. It just seems that if the white was more prevalent early on, wouldn't there have been some mention of it in the early breed standards?

With more people doing research into the history about the founding dogs and those behind them.
I would say not all agree with YTCA statement of fact.

YORKY CLUB MAGAZINE #11 -- December 2008

"More about Color and Texture" by Hugo Ibanez

Richard Haynes (Eburacum,UK) - a nut as I am about Yorkie history - says “You judge the whole dog – I want the whole package. I will forgive some unevenness of color, whether light or dark, but I want it natural not artificially enhanced (Richard is a breeder/judge).”
Talking about being nuts about history, it seems appropriate to inject a bit of history here. Richard just found out details of the original Standard (1886) not known before that states “A bright steel blue” was required for the first 25 years by the Kennel Club in England. This was written by the first Yorkshire Terrier Club, The Halifax Yorkshire Terrier Club.
According to Richard’s research, Mary Ann Foster showed Ch. Ted year after year until he probably was nearly white (Ch. Ted was one of our founder fathers). The Yorkshire Terrier Club was formed in 1898 – still the bright blue was in effect. But by 1911 (Richard’s research) the standard required “a dark steel blue”. This was a reaction to the light colored dogs that were being shown in the North of England. The implication here, as I understand it, is that “bright” in those days was equivalent or similar to “light”.




Finally, you must understand why we have so much trouble and tribulations with color and texture as well as other elememts of type. As I indicated before, I was coming back to touch a bit of history. Learning a bit about Yorkie ancestors will give you a better understanding of our breed and the Yorkie founding fathers, the consequences and difficulties with which we are confronted today.
In 1845, one of them was described “resembling a Scotch (not Scottish) terrier, weight about 8 or 9 lbs., with good terrier head and eye but with a long body. The legs and muzzle only were tanned and hair on the body would be about 3 or 4 inches.” His mate was described as “a drop-eared Sky under 12 lbs with plenty of coat of blue shade but destitute of tan on any part of the body.” The third dog to play his part in the breed’s foundation was “a bitch, an old English Terrier with tanned head, ears, legs and sort of grizzle back.”
Most of these English Terriers also had white markings.
These genes from these dogs are the beginning of our breed. It seems that after 163 years, those initial genes would have disappeared or have been diluted; apparently, they did no disappear, they just laid dormant, in sleep mode.
Some canine experts believe our purebred dogs are locked in a genetic trap due to the evolutionary and hereditary process. What does it all mean? It means that after so many years it is difficult to eliminate influences of breeds used in early foundation stock. Why? Well, it could be argued that at the beginning all were somewhat inbred, as any given breed would have a relatively small member of founding sire.
What are the consequences?
Well, as you can see we are attempting to breed the perfect dog from imperfect ancestors. 163 years seem legendary, but, genetically, Yorkies are newbies (babies)
As you can see our ancestors were “tutti frutti” which makes our breeding more complicated. Nevertheless, considering all the odds, we have succeeded in most of the elements of type. All we have to do to reassure our success just take a pick of pictures of Yorkies appearing in books and magazines from the last century, it would seem – to our reality now – that many were just pets.
No one knows better than you that as much we have progressed, we can not get complacent, still the hill that we must climbed is too steep.