Originally Posted by Woogie Man (Post 3270618)

I think this thread has come full circle, too. It kind of reminds me of the old cartoon.....where you have the dog punching the time clock to watch the sheep and the wolf punches his clock to go after them. Nothing ever changes but they keep punching in to do what they do LOL.

One thing I would like to say in regards to lighter colored Yorkies. I don't agree with dying a dog either, but lighter ones do show up. That doesn't mean they can't produce a correct dog and the tint of blue is no reason to discount these dogs as off-colored. Partis bred to partis will only produce partis so there is zero chance of getting a correctly colored dog from them.

Not every breeder produces cookie cutter dogs with 100% conformation, even with good lines. I get the impression that some think the breed standard is what a standard, typical Yorkie should look like. The breed standard describes the ideal Yorkie and many will not meet the ideal. Many exhibitors have said on this forum how they may have to wait several litters to get a great prospect. The ideal is something to strive for...not something that is achieved every time.

Originally Posted by yorkiegirl2 (Post 3270557)

Donna just how many do you think that are really breeding to the
true dark steel blue and tan standard ?
My guess would be somewhere around 10-20 %.

Most breeders are not going to discard a nice soft black or light blue if they have great pedigrees, health and meet the standard in every other way except for color.

We know the only way light blues can meet the standard is to dye the dog but what about the soft blacks ?
Can you dye a black coat to meet the standard ?

Originally Posted by GreenwoodBiewer (Post 3270701)

The puppy would be registered with a Biewer registry.. there is at least one registry in the states and many in Germany that could be used to register the "carrier" or traditionally colored puppy from a Biewer/AKC Yorkie mating. Most of the German clubs recognize the AKC registry and accept their registration I believe.

Diana :animal-pa

Originally Posted by Elle (Post 3270818)

Why would you? I don't know what your obsession is with dyeing dogs. Yorkshire terriers that you see in the ring are not dyed. Soft black? What is that? A puppy?

Originally Posted by Brooklynn (Post 3270839)

Elle...I don't know what their obession with dyeing is but you can't say that yorkies in the ring aren't dyed. You and I are on the same page with almost everything but I wont' say that every yorkie in the ring isn't dyed because yes there are. I've seen green yorkies, purple yorkies with bad dye jobs and I've been beaten by them and that is something I can't handle myself. If one chooses to dye, do it good or dont' do it at all. It's all wrong to do and if one chooses to do it and decide to breed a male out or sell a show dog out of a female one best be honest about the dye job.
I don't know what a soft black is but I do what a clerical grey is and I would assume that is what a soft black is...well at least that would be my interputation. A clerical grey or soft black yorkie doesn't have the correct silk texture and is what I interput as a soft coat.
At least I'm honest when some say there are dyed dogs in the ring and won't deny that there is.
Donna

Originally Posted by Brooklynn (Post 3270839)

Elle...I don't know what their obession with dyeing is but you can't say that yorkies in the ring aren't dyed. You and I are on the same page with almost everything but I wont' say that every yorkie in the ring isn't dyed because yes there are. I've seen green yorkies, purple yorkies with bad dye jobs and I've been beaten by them and that is something I can't handle myself. If one chooses to dye, do it good or dont' do it at all. It's all wrong to do and if one chooses to do it and decide to breed a male out or sell a show dog out of a female one best be honest about the dye job.
I don't know what a soft black is but I do what a clerical grey is and I would assume that is what a soft black is...well at least that would be my interputation. A clerical grey or soft black yorkie doesn't have the correct silk texture and is what I interput as a soft coat.
At least I'm honest when some say there are dyed dogs in the ring and won't deny that there is.
Donna

Originally Posted by kpstoybox (Post 3270878)

So..it's ok to lie and cheat...as long as the end result conforms to the written standard. How can anyone defend showing, finishing and breeding a light dog? Because it's only a color fault...and not a DQ? :confused:

That may fool the judges. But what happens when the dye washes clear? They still have light dogs producing light coats in their puppies. I wonder if they include dying instructions in thier puppy packs when they place a show prospect. The sad part is...I have heard that some dye recipes are indeed handed down like grandma's favorite cookie recipe.

It seems that for the most part...there is a color standard set for this breed that is practically unattainable without enhancements.

Originally Posted by Tnyorkiemom (Post 3270891)

the truely sad thing is getting downed for having partis........but yet people.....not saying you Donna......i know and have talked with you before...i appreciate your standards...........but we all know some are dying their dogs hair...........and that dye is very very dangerous and damaging to their coats and skin............that is the worst.........not what color they were to start with............im sorry......but i could go on and on ranting about people purposely putting their dogs in danger with such stuff.

Originally Posted by Elle (Post 3270914)

That's right Tammy:):):)
I make blanket statements about breeders. I stand by them, you fit the bill of what is considered a what? You must know it. If it makes you feel empowered to call me rude for repeating what is written all over this forum and everywhere any responsible and ethical breeder would look, have it your way dear.

I haven't singled anyone out. Just as you said in the thread, these threads go this way. I'll assume this is a your personal goal, as I don't know this to be true myself.

The bottom line in that you are not breeding within the standard. It's a practice my that is strongly disapproved of YTCA. Yorkshire Terrier Club of America (Awards)
Every person that breeds should breed with the #1 goal to be the betterment of the breed. You cannot be breeding for health without this goal first. So fine, so you have a friend or a few friends here on this thread that have your puppies because you just started breeding. OH YOU"RE A NEW BREEDER, RIGHT? A new breeder just selling to my friends that just loves her babies so much. So everything is different. I'm not here to sell puppies. I don't approve of this way to go about breeding. It doesn't make me rude when I say this is wrong. It's on the website, I'm not the only person that says so. If they cannot be shown in confirmation, you are hurting the gene pool. This is the mindset of thousands and thousands of breed lovers world wide. It is the opinion of the everyone that set the standard for the yorkshire terrier, the yorkie is not intended to be a parti not now, not ever. That's why you don't see it in dog shows. All of these posts are only attempts to get people to buy puppies.

All these comments about sneaking them in the ring, dyeing them, lying, saying I live under a rock because I don't agree with you, saying respectable people kill dogs, it's endless. You folks try to paint such a distorted picture. Surely nobody would be interested if they were believing your made up lies. Then you say I'm rude when I say it's not true.

Originally Posted by Brooklynn (Post 3270839)

Elle...I don't know what their obession with dyeing is but you can't say that yorkies in the ring aren't dyed. You and I are on the same page with almost everything but I wont' say that every yorkie in the ring isn't dyed because yes there are. I've seen green yorkies, purple yorkies with bad dye jobs and I've been beaten by them and that is something I can't handle myself. If one chooses to dye, do it good or dont' do it at all. It's all wrong to do and if one chooses to do it and decide to breed a male out or sell a show dog out of a female one best be honest about the dye job.
I don't know what a soft black is but I do what a clerical grey is and I would assume that is what a soft black is...well at least that would be my interputation. A clerical grey or soft black yorkie doesn't have the correct silk texture and is what I interput as a soft coat.
At least I'm honest when some say there are dyed dogs in the ring and won't deny that there is.
Donna

Originally Posted by Brooklynn (Post 3270917)

the colors I do know about is nothing compared to some maltese breeders who "bleach" their coats to obtain a whiter coat or the poodle breeders that bleach their white poodles...now that is a harsh chemical....
I know we've chatted and I appreciate your kind words. Dyeing and enhancements is not just done in yorkies.

But one has to always remember "health" should be the #1 priority then structure and movement ect...I still prefer the silky color standard but as long as the yorkie standard says what it does I will uphold it to the best of my ability :)

Donna

Originally Posted by Brooklynn (Post 3270922)

WHOA down Elle....no need to get riled up. Just stick to your beliefs in the standard and keep it respectable and professional hon.

Donna

Originally Posted by Elle (Post 3270932)

That looks worst than it sounded. LOL It's email, inflection gets lost. What can I say? It's only words, nothing more.