Ebola or Hysteria Paranoia?

[Yorkiemom1]

All a huge joke!!! Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha!!!! Well....that is OK because it is now showing up in New York!
Quote from ShowGirlLola~~~~~(My Grandmom has an appointment with her cardiologist this week, they just called to ask if she's had a fever due to the Eboloa crisis.) We live in NJ so that's odd/extreme."......
...makes you think maybe they know something the general public does not know.....especially since this doctor now shows up positive with ebola!!! ~~~~~~~~~

A doctor got on the subway, and walked all over town, feeling sick,,,,when he started vomiting he decided it was time to go to the hospital....of course, he has ridden on the subway and exposed ....how many people crunch up together on the subway????....good thing all this is taken so light heartedly! All these people could actually begin to get fearful!!! Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha!!! Life is great and so much fun! We all need to have bumper (butt) stickers that read, "NO FEAR"!!!! I am confident nothing will come from all this.....this doctor may even turn out to not be positive at all...maybe it is all just a prank!!!

On a serious note, because I DO take this seriously, I am anxious to see what all those nurses in New York have to say about this....they have a REALLY strong union and nurses from all over the country are protesting about the lack of attention and care CDC and the government is taking with all this....they are passing out "Ebola Kits" in plastic bags for nurses in ERs....nurses are crying, "Really???!!!! You just can NOT be serious!!!" This is going to be very interesting....

[ShowGirlLola]

I really hope they start pressing charges against people who know they may have ebola symptoms and are going out in public, especially medical professionals. I really think harsh legal consequences and strict quarantines are the only hopes of containing this.

The east coast really is a scary place to be with things like ebola. Lots of cities, hospitals, and air ports/trains in a very small area.
On the news it said Penn and CHOP are building special rooms for ebola.

[megansmomma]

Originally Posted by Yorkiemom1

All a huge joke!!! Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha!!!! Well....that is OK because it is now showing up in New York!
Quote from ShowGirlLola~~~~~(My Grandmom has an appointment with her cardiologist this week, they just called to ask if she's had a fever due to the Eboloa crisis.) We live in NJ so that's odd/extreme."......
...makes you think maybe they know something the general public does not know.....especially since this doctor now shows up positive with ebola!!! ~~~~~~~~~

A doctor got on the subway, and walked all over town, feeling sick,,,,when he started vomiting he decided it was time to go to the hospital....of course, he has ridden on the subway and exposed ....how many people crunch up together on the subway????....good thing all this is taken so light heartedly! All these people could actually begin to get fearful!!! Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha!!! Life is great and so much fun! We all need to have bumper (butt) stickers that read, "NO FEAR"!!!! I am confident nothing will come from all this.....this doctor may even turn out to not be positive at all...maybe it is all just a prank!!!

On a serious note, because I DO take this seriously, I am anxious to see what all those nurses in New York have to say about this....they have a REALLY strong union and nurses from all over the country are protesting about the lack of attention and care CDC and the government is taking with all this....they are passing out "Ebola Kits" in plastic bags for nurses in ERs....nurses are crying, "Really???!!!! You just can NOT be serious!!!" This is going to be very interesting....

There is a reason for Unions and this is a very good example where hospital workers need to be protected. What went down in TX would never fly in NY or Chicago. As for the doctor that was wandering around NY in the subways that really is beyond words! He should have self quarantined knowing where he had come from and what he had been treating.

[yorkietalkjilly]

Originally Posted by megansmomma

There is a reason for Unions and this is a very good example where hospital workers need to be protected. What went down in TX would never fly in NY or Chicago. As for the doctor that was wandering around NY in the subways that really is beyond words! He should have self quarantined knowing where he had come from and what he had been treating.

Chicago and NYC might be the only two cities besides those with designated hospitals who've been deemed centers of excellence in caring for Ebola patients who are really ready. There seems to be several articles from news agencies where nurses' unions from all over are complaining of inadequate hospital training and protections. Below are just two links but loud complaints are coming from several unions who don't seem to be helping them out that much to date.

But of all the people who should know not to circulate in public after having very close contact with Ebola patients, you would think doctors and nurses would - just until they know this strain of Ebola hasn't mutated and know for sure Romero, Mukpo, Vinson and Pham's close contacts are cleared. And you would think that they would self-quarantine from highly congested, closed-in areas with others! Between Vinson flying after feeling fatigued and starting a fever, Dr. Nancy Snyderman going out for food after Mukpo was diagnosed and during honorary self-quarantine and Dr. Spencer feeling fatigued and then going running, riding in a closed vehicle with another and going to a public bowling alley, some of the healthcare workers don't seem that worried about passing it on.

Still, it's looking like they didn't infect anyone so they are probably right that until they are vomiting, having diarrhe, running fairly high fever or bleeding, they just can't pass along the low level of virus they are incubating early on, though it would doubtless give many less worries to the public if Ebola caregivers would stay out of circulation for 21 days after their last contact with the disease.


Nurses to Jerry Brown: California isn?t ready for Ebola | The Sacramento Bee


Nurses? Unions Call for Better Ebola Support from CDC - Scientific American

[Yorkiemom1]

Originally Posted by yorkietalkjilly

Chicago and NYC might be the only two cities besides those with designated hospitals who've been deemed centers of excellence in caring for Ebola patients who are really ready. There seems to be several articles from news agencies where nurses' unions from all over are complaining of inadequate hospital training and protections. Below are just two links but loud complaints are coming from several unions who don't seem to be helping them out that much to date.

But of all the people who should know not to circulate in public after having very close contact with Ebola patients, you would think doctors and nurses would - just until they know this strain of Ebola hasn't mutated and know for sure Romero, Mukpo, Vinson and Pham's close contacts are cleared. And you would think that they would self-quarantine from highly congested, closed-in areas with others! Between Vinson flying after feeling fatigued and starting a fever, Dr. Nancy Snyderman going out for food after Mukpo was diagnosed and during honorary self-quarantine and Dr. Spencer feeling fatigued and then going running, riding in a closed vehicle with another and going to a public bowling alley, some of the healthcare workers don't seem that worried about passing it on.

Still, it's looking like they didn't infect anyone so they are probably right that until they are vomiting, having diarrhe, running fairly high fever or bleeding, they just can't pass along the low level of virus they are incubating early on, though it would doubtless give many less worries to the public if Ebola caregivers would stay out of circulation for 21 days after their last contact with the disease.


Nurses to Jerry Brown: California isn?t ready for Ebola | The Sacramento Bee


Nurses? Unions Call for Better Ebola Support from CDC - Scientific American

Two excellent links.... the Nurses Unions in California and New York are the buffers between what all the "suits" are claiming versus what is REALLY going on in hospitals.....when the nurses in those two States step up and say things are good, then I will buy it....until then, it is nothing but talking heads, blowing hot air so they and their city and their hospitals look good.

The nurses will honestly be concerned about the patients as well as themselves and how this disease is managed....the suits are strictly concerned about providing the best protection they can provide, within a set budget....money is their bottom line.

Nurses in any State that do NOT have a union, won't stand up and say what is actually going on, because they will lose their jobs by sundown! That ONE Texas nurse that got out and discussed all the short cuts and failures being made by that Dallas hospital that Pham was infected at.....wondering where she is today! She dropped completely out of sight, didn't she! Sad thing is....if she messes up and does something professionally wrong, like wrong med given, wrong dose given, wrong treatment given, etc and the patient is injured or dies because of it, if she is fired, she can go down the block and get a job at the next hospital within 24 hours. But if she stands up and speaks out about a systemic failure of a hospital, protecting patients or patients or visitors, she will be blackballed and she may not ever get a job in that city or State! That is where nurses unions really step up and protect the people that are trying to protect the public.

When the NURSES in New York, say they are prepared to care for ebola, and that they feel safe and prepared to deliver that care that is needed, I will feel confident about what is ACTUALLY going on. Your Mayor, Your Governor the CDC or the Director of the hospital are all coming from a position of getting the most they can get, as cheaply as possible.....

[yorkietalkjilly]

Originally Posted by Yorkiemom1

Two excellent links.... the Nurses Unions in California and New York are the buffers between what all the "suits" are claiming versus what is REALLY going on in hospitals.....when the nurses in those two States step up and say things are good, then I will buy it....until then, it is nothing but talking heads, blowing hot air so they and their city and their hospitals look good.

The nurses will honestly be concerned about the patients as well as themselves and how this disease is managed....the suits are strictly concerned about providing the best protection they can provide, within a set budget....money is their bottom line.

Nurses in any State that do NOT have a union, won't stand up and say what is actually going on, because they will lose their jobs by sundown! That ONE Texas nurse that got out and discussed all the short cuts and failures being made by that Dallas hospital that Pham was infected at.....wondering where she is today! She dropped completely out of sight, didn't she! Sad thing is....if she messes up and does something professionally wrong, like wrong med given, wrong dose given, wrong treatment given, etc and the patient is injured or dies because of it, if she is fired, she can go down the block and get a job at the next hospital within 24 hours. But if she stands up and speaks out about a systemic failure of a hospital, protecting patients or patients or visitors, she will be blackballed and she may not ever get a job in that city or State! That is where nurses unions really step up and protect the people that are trying to protect the public.

When the NURSES in New York, say they are prepared to care for ebola, and that they feel safe and prepared to deliver that care that is needed, I will feel confident about what is ACTUALLY going on. Your Mayor, Your Governor the CDC or the Director of the hospital are all coming from a position of getting the most they can get, as cheaply as possible.....

Well, she was on every network for two or three day and even the weekend plus countless news articles online - I guess she got her message out, hospitals began seeing the handwriting on the wall, the news agencies lost interest and decided to wait on the outcomes of investigations. Presby has long been recognized in Dallas for its poor medical practices and had among Medicare's highest fines in the area for re-admissions. Thankfully, not all hospital are like Presby/Dallas but Chicago, NYC, Boston, Houston, L.A. and every large city have their own versions of it, too.

I think the US is the third largest country in the whole world by population(almost 320 million), yet in the last many years we have no raging epidemics of viruses, plagues, MRSA, etc. We're a huge country and I wonder how in the world it is we rarely have any epidemic really get out of hand? I heard Ebola is 50 - 90% deadly yet we're seeing a number of Ebola patients treated here showing a strikingly lesser percentage of death.

Heck, thousands of people die of flu each year and still Americans won't even get a flu shot, they are so certain of our healthcare delivery system supporting them should they get very ill. So Americans don't even think flu is ever out of hand. And I'll bet if there is ever an Ebola vaccine, most Americans won't get it either.

[megansmomma]

This is all stuff that I was saying right in the beginning. It was all fly by night and now it looks like Gov. Perry is coming under fire for not stepping up when this was all going down. I know for a fact if this went down in IL whoever was our governor they would have been all over it. The nurses union would have never allowed it to be so haphazard and it would have been taken seriously. While I was at work today there were signs up in the departments that I went to had exactly what needed to be done with very specific information and phone numbers to call. Truth be told we were talking about it and the sentiment was pretty much well it's TX........

[megansmomma]

Originally Posted by yorkietalkjilly

Well, she was on every network for two or three day and even the weekend plus countless news articles online - I guess she got her message out, hospitals began seeing the handwriting on the wall, the news agencies lost interest and decided to wait on the outcomes of investigations. Presby has long been recognized in Dallas for its poor medical practices and had among Medicare's highest fines in the area for re-admissions. Thankfully, not all hospital are like Presby/Dallas but Chicago, NYC, Boston, Houston, L.A. and every large city have their own versions of it, too.

I think the US is the third largest country in the whole world by population(almost 320 million), yet in the last many years we have no raging epidemics of viruses, plagues, MRSA, etc. We're a huge country and I wonder how in the world it is we rarely have any epidemic really get out of hand? I heard Ebola is 50 - 90% deadly yet we're seeing a number of Ebola patients treated here showing a strikingly lesser percentage of death.

Heck, thousands of people die of flu each year and still Americans won't even get a flu shot, they are so certain of our healthcare delivery system supporting them should they get very ill. So Americans don't even think flu is ever out of hand. And I'll bet if there is ever an Ebola vaccine, most Americans won't get it either.

This is why we will not have a rampant Ebola outbreak in the US like West Africa. The only reason Mr. Duncan died was because of the TX hospital mishandling from the beginning. I hope his family drops the biggest suit on that hospital for malpractice. The medical care in Liberia is probably equal to me setting up shop in my garage next to the space heater and husbands tools. So it's without surprise to me the very few people that have gotten sick have been successfully treated.

[yorkietalkjilly]

If he dropped the ball somewhere, he should be hammered for not being a superman but running a huge state with the growing GDP of Texas, larger than many countries, gaining huge populations by the day as people flock here at the rate of 1000 a day and the wide-based economy grows, with all its attendant issues, is no picnic and the governor is often stretched in many different directions, unable to personally handle every crises. To be honest, I doubt Rick Perry thought a single case of Ebola - or even three - is a glaring catastrophe in the scheme of things, unlike the media and some people.

Now that the media spotlight is on all states, all the govs have stepped up their game but still nurses unions all over the country are apparently complaining their hospitals aren't ready and few governors have apparently stepped up to ready their state, California among them, from the sound of the linked article below. The article says no California hospital is ready to care for an Ebola patient according to the nurses in that union state so I doubt Presbyterian is the only inadequate hospital or Perry the only coasting gov on this issue when so many others issues and crises will still be there when the Ebola scare has passed.

Nurses to Jerry Brown: California isn?t ready for Ebola | The Sacramento Bee

[yorkietalkjilly]

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[Yorkiemom1]

Then of course, there is the "authority" from CDC that has PUBLICally said "All you need is a private room with a private bathroom facility.....no big huge program setting up hospitals to handle ebola.....No need for all that fuss.....fear mongering is all this is...".

Guess he thinks any patients that DO get sick/dying, they can take care of themselves! If all you need to address the ebola patients is a private room and private bathroom, hail, they can just stay at home! No need to get any other healthcare workers sick, or patients or visitors, or anyone in the public....just let them stay at home and take care of themselves!

[megansmomma]

Originally Posted by yorkietalkjilly

If he dropped the ball somewhere, he should be hammered for not being a superman but running a huge state with the growing GDP of Texas, larger than many countries, gaining huge populations by the day as people flock here at the rate of 1000 a day and the wide-based economy grows, with all its attendant issues, is no picnic and the governor is often stretched in many different directions, unable to personally handle every crises. To be honest, I doubt Rick Perry thought a single case of Ebola - or even three - is a glaring catastrophe in the scheme of things, unlike the media and some people.

Now that the media spotlight is on all states, all the govs have stepped up their game but still nurses unions all over the country are apparently complaining their hospitals aren't ready and few governors have apparently stepped up to ready their state, California among them, from the sound of the linked article below. The article says no California hospital is ready to care for an Ebola patient according to the nurses in that union state so I doubt Presbyterian is the only inadequate hospital or Perry the only coasting gov on this issue when so many others issues and crises will still be there when the Ebola scare has passed.

Nurses to Jerry Brown: California isn?t ready for Ebola | The Sacramento Bee

The media spotlight in on other states because of what went down in TX. The state level Health Dept. should have closed the boarders of TX to the healthcare workers that were in contact with the Ebola. It's not like they didn't have the power to stop travel via quarantine. As I'm typing looks like NJ and NY have just quarantined all travelers from Ebola zones. So obviously, this is something that should have been done in TX at the state level. I'm not really sure what you are talking about when you bring up all of these "people flocking" to the state or what that has to do with any of this for that matter. I've been to TX and well to tell you the truth Chicago is much more my style.

[chachi]

I dont think Rick Perry should be blamed for this there is no way he could have forseen that nurse who should have used common sense and not get on that flight however the CDC did tell her she should go so if theres any blame it should go to them. Ebola isnt new to them they know all about it and should have used better judgement when she called them to see if she could go. But even on that you dont know who she spoke to was it some lower level employee. So I think we should quit blaming and Now that we know what can happen take the appropriate steps. I dont even think the President could have forseen what has happened even though since hes the President he gets blamed

[yorkietalkjilly]

Originally Posted by megansmomma

The media spotlight in on other states because of what went down in TX. The state level Health Dept. should have closed the boarders of TX to the healthcare workers that were in contact with the Ebola. It's not like they didn't have the power to stop travel via quarantine. As I'm typing looks like NJ and NY have just quarantined all travelers from Ebola zones. So obviously, this is something that should have been done in TX at the state level. I'm not really sure what you are talking about when you bring up all of these "people flocking" to the state or what that has to do with any of this for that matter. I've been to TX and well to tell you the truth Chicago is much more my style.

Just saying in a huge state with people coming in daily from all borders with several deadly healthcare problems, huge economic issues and growing so fast, just because the governor couldn't drop everything and get deep into Ebola care at one hospital in Dallas doesn't mean he's not stepping up to what he deems is appropriate for his role - just the opposite. Texas has prospered greatly under his administration. We're a huge part of the economic recovery of this county. Many lives depend upon Perry's actions and decisions. And if Duncan had just gone to Baylor Hospital rather than Presbyterian, I doubt his travel history or diagnosis would have been missed.

Unless the people have taken bodily fluids of the sick or dead from Ebola into their own bodies, why quarantine them all? I think they are just quarantining some with the highest exposure - such as Ebola healthcare workers - which Thomas Duncan wasn't. So quarantining healthcare workers wouldn't have caught him at a US airport and his family said he didn't know he had been at high risk so NJ or NY wouldn't have quarantined him, nor would Texas even if we'd had such a mandate at that time.

Perhaps in such a population-dense state as New York and New Jersey quarantining is a good decision but I imagine there are other vital reasons which are just as urgent not to do it. Those two states have less cars per household than Texas and rely greatly on mass transit, people being crammed into subways and buses in close contact with others during busy times. Each governor is going to have to make the best decision for the overall administration of his own state.

Many don't care for the Texas lifestyle - wish more were like you. We've far too many wanting to become Texans as it is. They are flocking here by droves every day and have been for years now.

[Yorkiemom1]

I have been to Chicago, and Texas better suits me! As far as shutting down the Texas border and not allowing those people to leave the State.....that suggestion was made by someone on this forum early on, but it was offered up as more of a "redneck yahoo paranoid knee jerk reaction/solution", rather than a legitimate, plausable solution. I agreed with the idea enthusiastically, shut down Texas, no one in, no one out, and I had already contacted the Govoner's office about this. Thank goodness the authorities have come to their senses and have started restricting travel and putting mandatory quarantine in place. Fortunately, the CDC also FINALLY decided it may be a good idea to restrict travel on public transportation by patients that are supposed to be "self isolating" and were not doing it.....and they JUST rewrote the protocol, which has enabled all States to now limit such travel. Everytime anyone tries to get the upper hand on this disease and how to handle it, all the "experts" running the show, chide and conjole and remind us not to panic...."everyone was following protocol, everything is just fine".

That doctor that just exposed the subway system, the taxi service, the resturant, the bowling alley, the public park....he was following protocol so hey, it is OK. They keep saying he was not symptomatic...that is gravely incorrect...he was fatigued and having muscle cramping/soreness for 2 days already!!!.....he just had not spike the temperature that everyone hangs their hat on. "Symptomatic" and "Temperature elevation" are NOT synonymous!! The first symptoms to appear are the flu like fatigue and muscle aches....the elevated temp does not come until later. That doctor KNOWS this....he was symptomatic, had not yet had the elevated temp, so he was "within protocol"!! But look at the work and the money and distress he has caused!

I do hope all the other States do learn from the Dallas experience. They were ground zero for something no one in this part of the world had ever had to deal with. There are hospitals ....maybe 4 of them....in the entire country that are already set up to accept infectious patients....NOT specifically ebola patients but every other infectious disease we encounter in this part of the world. They can handle ebola infections. Oh the "suits" can sit back on their haunches and snort about how they have always expected an ebola patient, blah, blah, blah. NOT!! Our President just told us last month how totally unlikely we would have to deal with ebola here....NOT!!!

I wish that patient had not gotten as far as Texas before he became so ill. If they could have caught him at the airport in New York, he could have been handled by a system that has existed for years, to treat all kinds of infectious diseases, not necessarily ebola, but everything else we have encountered in North America. He may have lived, and he would not have contaminated the staff of the hospital in Dallas. But fortunately, NY now has their own case....we will see if all the training and education and hospital set up to specifically address infectious diseases, actually works as planned when dealing with ebola.

But meanwhile, they can start the terribly complicated seek out and search for every person this "educated professional" exposed. Too bad those CDC restrictions were not in place and could have prevented his entry to this country, as well as prevent his glorious little carefree trecks all over New York...it was kind of like he decided to take one last hoorah all over the State before spiking the temp, before turning himself into the hospital!

The common argument against setting up quarantine for 21 days for people coming from "hot spots" infected with ebola, especially health care workers, is the fear that people will not want to go help in those areas....my response is, I dont WANT these people that have NO apparent regard or concern for the public in THIS country, to go "help" over there. Why would anyone with any decency or respect, deliberately go there, get exposed helping sick and dying people, then return here and walk around, hoping they did not get the disease while they were over there....but if they did, "oh well we can handle it!"