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![]() | #16 |
Donating Senior Yorkie Talker Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 234
| ![]() I watched that documentary.... it was so upsetting. My Yorkie, as many do, has the problem where his knee slips out of the joint ![]() It is awful what dog breeding has become. |
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![]() | #17 |
Donating YT 500 Club Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Memphis, TN
Posts: 3,051
| ![]() Thank you to all who took this post very seriously and posted such good information. We are all truly dog lovers and want the best for them.
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![]() | #18 |
♥ Luv Zoey & Austen! ♥ Donating Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Kansas City, MO, USA
Posts: 2,015
| ![]() Yes, it was hard to watch at times... but essential to be informed about!
__________________ ![]() ![]() Dear Jazzy ![]() ![]() There is no psychiatrist in the world like a puppy licking your face. ~Ben Williams |
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![]() | #19 | |
YT 1000 Club Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: ~CA~
Posts: 1,637
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![]() | #20 |
YT 2000 Club Donating Member | ![]() First I agree that BBC likely produced this video last year that I watched. At least it was advertised and marketed as such. If PETA got on the bandwagon --- well they are very good at grabbing negative exposure that supports their questionable goals. Whilst 78 breed standards were changed - all breed standards were reviewed. Does it go far enough? Maybe not - maybe yes only time will be able to tell. 5-10 Years of time that is. And that if judges are experienced enough and willing enough to overlook dogs that in |their opinion' presents a health risk. And breeders willingly following the new standard and through moral suasion persuading other breeders to do the same. Genetics is a complicated business - not every inherited condition is a clear cut single genome - many are polygenetic - including hip and elbow dysplasia, and likely knee subluxation. The gene pool of purebreed dogs is relatively limited. That is a real challenge. How and when do the pure breed registries allow outcrossings to improve a breed. Currently they do not as far as I am aware. None of my above statements mean that I believe "mutts" are healthier than purebreds. In fact because the majority of "mutts" are not tracked through databases we have no idea on the "health" of the general mutt population. What we have is anecdoctal evidence that some people portray as "hybrid vigor". This is hard to refute or support due to lack of objective - over time related evidence. Breeders of mutts - do not track their progeny through the variety of tests that purebred breeders do - CERF, hip/elbow Dysplasia registries, thyroid, heart tests, etc, etc.
__________________ Razzle and Dara. Our clan. RIP Karma Dec 24th 2004-July 14 2013 RIP Zoey Jun9 th 2008-May 12 2012. RIP Magic,Mar 26 2006July 1st 2018 |
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![]() | #21 | |
Princess Poop A Lot Donating Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Colorado
Posts: 6,728
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At this time I know in the states they are trying to do an outcrossing for the dalmations..I hear it has really stirred up the pot...we will see what happens. It is a beginning......
__________________ Cindy & The Rescued Gang ![]() Puppies Are Not Products! | |
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![]() | #22 |
Action Jackson ♥ Donating Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Maryland
Posts: 17,815
| ![]() I think the whole thing is just absolutely terrible. I've always thought the show dog world almost seemed cruel, in my opinion. It seems like they don't get to be DOGS... they're getting poked and prodded at, having to be "perfect." Let them be DOGS! I understand that I'm sure not every person who shows dogs is like this, but the whole show dog world has always just irritated me. Such a reach for perfection when there's no such thing. It's so sad that human beings have a "standard" in their eyes and basically mold these dogs into what they want. Every single Pug I've met has breathing issues, thanks to the shoved in face humans creating to get a more "human-like expression." Ugh, it's just saddening and maddening at the same time.
__________________ ~ Brit & Lights! Camera! Jackson! CGC ETD TKP ~ ![]() |
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![]() | #23 | |
Puppy Luv Donating Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Canada
Posts: 2,678
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![]() | #24 | |
Donating YT 12K Club Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Council Bluffs Iowa
Posts: 12,552
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As you saw in the video, the judge for the GSD said that the crippled dog met the standard, it did not matter that the other dogs might have been healthier. That is the problem. But why they don't adjust their standards when they see it is creating health issues, is beyond me. how can you say you love the breed and you love the dogs when you are knowingly producing unhealthy dogs. It doesn't make sense. Does a stupid ribbon mean that much that people are willing to produce crippled dogs just to win it? | |
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![]() | #25 | |
Action Jackson ♥ Donating Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Maryland
Posts: 17,815
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__________________ ~ Brit & Lights! Camera! Jackson! CGC ETD TKP ~ ![]() Last edited by Britster; 12-14-2009 at 08:24 PM. | |
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![]() | #26 | |
Puppy Luv Donating Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Canada
Posts: 2,678
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Bettering the breed as you say should be the most important part, your so right. ![]() It doesn't make sense. Does a stupid ribbon mean that much that people are willing to produce crippled dogs just to win it?" It must to some which is the sad part of showing that needs to stop. Also some of the standards such as the yorkie's should I agree, say a minimum weight as well. Th good thing is many of the show breeders I've seen are not breeding for the tinies though thank god. | |
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![]() | #27 | |
Donating YT 500 Club Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Memphis, TN
Posts: 3,051
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![]() | #28 | |
Donating YT 500 Club Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Memphis, TN
Posts: 3,051
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I don't know diddly about the show dog world, but from what I have seen, most of the dogs seem to really LOVE what they are doing, and some of them have that little extra UMPH, it is like they are saying to the judge LOOK AT ME< PICK ME, and even more amazing is they seem to know when they have been PICKED ,especially the Best in SHow (though I am sure they are maybe reacting to the excitement of their handler, the romantic in me just hopes they know they are the winner). Anyway, I think they are treasured and pampered, and not every dog out of a litter is cut out to be a show dog, they have to have that little something special, maybe after all, they are different, and have different things that make them happy like us people. Thanks for you views though, very much. Just putting alternative thought out there for your consumption.
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![]() | #29 | |
Donating YT 12K Club Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Council Bluffs Iowa
Posts: 12,552
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The one man in that video said that dogs used to be judged by how well they did what they were bred for, but now it is nothing but a beauty pagent. And we all know how much fake there is in those. | |
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![]() | #30 |
Yorkie Yakker Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: NEW YORK
Posts: 30
| ![]() Thanks for the post, I am so glad that this documentary is being discussed here. Here we can to our part to turn the tide of opinion against inbreeding were it counts, among those who love and breed purebreeds or any dog. Fifteen years or so ago, my family had our collective hearts broken by a purebred. It was a purebred boxer from generations of championship lines. Looking at his lineage chart is how I discovered line breeding to "set the breed". Our poor (or should I say puredog) dog was beset by allergies his entire life and he was barely ten when we had to put him down because he was crippled from a chronic, uncurable, degenerative disease of the spine. His gait became like the gait of the German Shepards in the documentary. I do believe it comes from breeding for a certain topline. It eventually leads to a totally paralyzed and suffering dog. The kids grew up with him we all loved him, losing him was like losing one of the family and made me very wary of purebreds. We all learn in basic Biology that inbreeding is limiting the gene pool which statistical increases the possibility of genetic based disease in ANY creature. I now have two dogs, one is a mix between a westie and a maltese. The other is her son, from an accidental breeding with a purebred yorkie named Baxter I rescued from an abusive home. Baxter is how I came to join this forum. I would have kept dad too but Hubby insisted that we had to reduce the number of canines in the house, so I let my cousin, who positively loves dogs, have Baxter. Sammy, their son, looks like a teapot Yorkie, I even have to tell the groomers he is not a big Yorkie (with floppy ears). Both are truly wonderful dogs and very healthy. Neither of them (so far) have any of the inherited maladies know to any of the three breeds they are mixed from and I hope they never will. Sam's father had slipping kneecaps, but Sam does not. I am glad of the designer "breed" movement, not because I believe in a name or think these are breeds at all, but because it is away to increase the gene pool for purebreds. Izzy is considered a "Highland Malty" to me she is just my Izzy and I do not care what she is. After saying ALL of that, let me be clear I love the Yorkie and if my Dear Husband would let me I would have three dogs (I am working on him about that) the last would be a Yorkie! However, I would ask my breeder about the health of the lines the dog comes from, I would ask to see the lineage chart to check for inbreeding. Let me also express my gratitude to responsible breeders, after just one liter, I see what they go through to breed these dogs we love and my hat is off to them that do it right! Izzy was immediately spayed and Sammy will also never be bred! Baxter is an example of a badly bred Yorkie, in no way does he approach the breed standard. The original owners purchased him from a slimy pet shop that buys puppy mill pups (I know the shop). That shop is a perfect argument for responsible breeding practices. Now we need to convince those that bred that inbreeding is a practice that is detrimental to the breed. Those who bred and those how buy must decide collectively that the health of these dogs is a paramount issue that must take precedent over appearance. That has got to be a part of our responsibility as dog owners and lovers. |
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