Everyone-PLEASE-read and THINK ABOUT....

[Akbritt]

Originally Posted by AvyQuinn

QFT.

Shame on you and your petty bickering. I get that this is a public forum, but I, for one, don't care to see this. If you want to talk about the issue then do so. I think it's time we left this named organization and the personal slander OUT of this thread.

I see both sides, and I think Kelz has a good heart and is doing what she thinks is best for the dogs she cares about. If she didn't have good intentions then she wouldn't be here talking about it. She simply wouldn't care. She may be doing something wrong in some eyes, and in others she may be doing right. Just agree to disagree and stick to the original topic of discussion?

WOW IT IS GETTING NASTY IN THERE!

Now this is from an outsiders point of view, i dont know any of the members who are fosters or affiliated with this rescue group.
I would like to say, I am a huge advocate to rescues groups and when ANYONE ever asks about getting a dog of any kind, rescue is the first word that comes out of my mouth. I have tons of respect for individuals or bring these rescues in to there home in hopes one day that they will find forever homes.

But i have to say, I am heart broken about what i read tonight on this thread. My question is the same as Quickslivers'.
Where does the line need to be crossed when rescuing puppy mill puppies, if any?

We tell people till we are blue in the face, NEVER BUY FROM PET STORES, even though, they look sad, or sick, or lonely. Because we honestly know, that if we go with our heart and not with our head, and purchase that puppy, it will only make room for the next puppy.

We all know that the auction puppies rescued are from bybs or puppymillers. But isn't purchasing these poor things the same as purchasing from pet stores? Are you not still giving money to these horrible people, regardless the amount of money, be it $100 or $.01 To them, any profit is profit, and they are just making room for the next, that why auctions are big success for them. They still make something on the dog that nobody wanted. They couldnt care less if it went to a rescue group or a sausage factory as long as they didnt have a total lose of profit.

I hope that ANY rescue who is trying to save auctions, please reconsider making a very difficult decision not to do this, because the bottom line is, its still supporting the bad people who are abusing animals to make a quick buck. The problem of puppy mills and brokers will not just go away, but animal lovers should do all they can not to support them in anyway. But if any rescue or individual does choose to rescue from auctions, i think they should know consciously, that they are contributing to the problem.

[QuickSilver]

You know, I can see a difference in degree between buying a puppy from a pet store and buying a breed dog at an auction. Puppies presumably have a better chance of getting a good home, and even dogs in shelters probably had a nice life at one point. Buying a dog like Sasha (the little dog on PetFinder with the awful skin condition) and giving her some kind of life outside a cage is understandable.

There clearly some danger in thinking this way, though. Paying hundreds of dollars for a dog at an auction seems like all kinds of wrong. I can see how this could be a slippery slope. The emotion of an auction, helpless dogs, the need to get some young, cute dogs to pay for expensive vet bills....

I wonder if there is trouble even with just taking a miller's breed stock for free. I can't imagine that a miller would work with a rescue that turns around and reports them. Can you really stay completely clean? Does anyone know the answer to this?

There also remains the question of animals that die in shelters locally because you went somewhere somewhere else to find dogs. The goal of every rescue should be to eventually make itself obsolete, correct? As people have said, if you have no dogs in your area, this is a *good* thing, and if there is money to spend, it should be used getting dogs in other areas of the country. However, any kind of organization works to perpetuate itself, so it looks like there could be a conflict of interest here.

In any case, buying at auctions is a dicey issue, even if you believe it does more good than harm. I think rescues should be upfront about this and acknowledge the obvious moral hazard.

[Rusty's Momma]

Originally Posted by ladyjane

I keep seeing some posts about organizations being transparent. This is where having a 501c3 is useful.
Now, keep in mind that having that paperwork does not make an organization reputable, but it does give donors a way of understanding where their donations are going. It is also good because donors can then write off their donations.
I have posted before about Guidestar GuideStar nonprofit reports and Forms 990 for donors, grantmakers and businesses . If a rescue has a 501c3, then their records are public! You can see exactly what they have taken in and exactly where it is going! I do know of one rescue that I looked up recently that has not filed their form 990 but that can only go on for a short time before the IRS catches up to them. I believe it is around 5 years that a group's status is revisited.
Anyway......if anyone on here has a question about a group and how they spend their donations, look them up before you donate! You can also see how much they have in terms of assets. I know it was quite a shock to me to see that some groups carry an amazing bank account from year to year. I would also suggest you read their website very carefully. Read their mission statement and watch what they do to see if they are living up to it. You really can find out a lot by reading.
I am not saying that having that paperwork or not having it, makes a group legit or not legit. I am merely informing everyone that you can see what a group does with their donations if they have it.

I just wanted to make note for everyone. OKYR HAS indeed filed for its 501(c)3 papers. It was filed back in Aug or Sept I believe. Michelle has been in constant contact with them as to the status, it is in process.

[Hotel4Yorkies]

AMEN! I am absolutely sick to my stomach from reading this. It seems as though the purpose of the comments is more to damage or maybe the real intent is to shut down or destroy OKYR. I am deeply saddened by this.There will always be 2 sides for discussion about auctions.

Originally Posted by AvyQuinn

QFT.





Shame on you and your petty bickering. I get that this is a public forum, but I, for one, don't care to see this. If you want to talk about the issue then do so. I think it's time we left this named organization and the personal slander OUT of this thread.

I see both sides, and I think Kelz has a good heart and is doing what she thinks is best for the dogs she cares about. If she didn't have good intentions then she wouldn't be here talking about it. She simply wouldn't care. She may be doing something wrong in some eyes, and in others she may be doing right. Just agree to disagree and stick to the original topic of discussion?

[andibaby]

Originally Posted by Kelz

that's is it! we do go to auction.. like it or not.. it is what it is.. there does need to be something done about mills.. but until there is.. i will still be there.. getting all the used up yorkies that no one wants.

I think this thread was very informative. It lets everyone know how okyr feels about going to auctions and they can then determine if they would like to support them.

I just want to say tht I love all of the points everyone has made. Thanks. It is a validative thread.

[jencar98]

Originally Posted by Hotel4Yorkies

There will always be 2 sides for discussion about auctions.

You're right there are 2 sides for this discussion. As long as rescues buy from auctions the breeders are still selling their dogs, plain and simple. The breeders know the rescues attend the auctions and the breeders are just supplying the demand of yorkies for rescues. In other words, rescues are part of the problem.

It's a shame because rescues can't purchase every auction dog out there and so some of those very dogs the breeders are supplying for rescues will also end up as breeders bought by the few breeders that attend the auctions . But then if you're a rescue that buys auction dogs, I guess that's a good thing for you, it just re-supplies the rescue with more dogs.

[sdtrippe]

Darling Jen, We can't stop them...Please honey we know u care for all those lil yorkies...Please Please its a ugly world with ugly people...Let it go for anothe day ...This Day in time will not do it....
Sheila

[oopsmyhalofello]

I'm glad this topic was posted, it is very interesting to me to hear that there are "reputable" rescues that do buy from auctions. I don't agree with it, but if it is known information so that those who do donate can make a decision with thier own feelings on this in mind then "it is what it is".

There should not be ANY secrets in any type of group that is supported by public donations. EVER

I can't believe the verocity that some people came on this post with in defense, in the beginning of this thread I did read what rescue organization was named, not once did I feel they were being slandered in any way. It wasn't until the petty posts with bickering started that I realized that maybe this rescue isn't exactly on the up and up

[QuickSilver]

I think if there's any pressure from this thread on OKYR, it is to be more open about its actions and perhaps stop buying at auctions. I can't imagine that anyone on a yorkie lovers forum would want to shut down a rescue.

Clearly there is some bad blood between the people directly involved here, but for most of us reading, it's not about one specific rescue.

[andibaby]

Originally Posted by QuickSilver

I think if there's any pressure from this thread on OKYR, it is to be more open about its actions and perhaps stop buying at auctions. I can't imagine that anyone on a yorkie lovers forum would want to shut down a rescue.

Clearly there is some bad blood between the people directly involved here, but for most of us reading, it's not about one specific rescue.

Agree.

[erickajm]

Originally Posted by QuickSilver

I think if there's any pressure from this thread on OKYR, it is to be more open about its actions and perhaps stop buying at auctions. I can't imagine that anyone on a yorkie lovers forum would want to shut down a rescue.

Clearly there is some bad blood between the people directly involved here, but for most of us reading, it's not about one specific rescue.

You are so right! I think it has been mentioned throughout this thread that in no way is this meant to bash the volunteers, donors, fosters or the actual rescue itself.

In today's society it is hard to put trust in anyone or any organization. This is the world of corrupt & dishonest people. You can only hope and pray that the people that you are dealing with are going to be honest and open with the runnings of such an important organization.

I do think it is important to "name" these organizations. It does give the donor the important information needed in deciding if this is an organization that they want their hard earned dollars to go to. I would like to know the same of the rescues in my area and all over. It just happens that the Oklahoma rescue was named because it was the one known for going to the auctions.

[jencar98]

Originally Posted by sdtrippe

Darling Jen, We can't stop them...Please honey we know u care for all those lil yorkies...Please Please its a ugly world with ugly people...Let it go for anothe day ...This Day in time will not do it....
Sheila

Sheila, thank you. I do appreciate and understand what you're saying. And, after this I'm sure I will sleep easier at night, knowing that what has been going on is exposed now.

Originally Posted by oopsmyhalofello

I'm glad this topic was posted, it is very interesting to me to hear that there are "reputable" rescues that do buy from auctions. I don't agree with it, but if it is known information so that those who do donate can make a decision with thier own feelings on this in mind then "it is what it is".

There should not be ANY secrets in any type of group that is supported by public donations. EVER

I can't believe the verocity that some people came on this post with in defense, in the beginning of this thread I did read what rescue organization was named, not once did I feel they were being slandered in any way. It wasn't until the petty posts with bickering started that I realized that maybe this rescue isn't exactly on the up and up

I completely agree with your statement about secrecy within a charitable organization....and that also was one of my concerns with OKYR mgmt.

[jencar98]

Originally Posted by QuickSilver

I think if there's any pressure from this thread on OKYR, it is to be more open about its actions and perhaps stop buying at auctions. I can't imagine that anyone on a yorkie lovers forum would want to shut down a rescue.

Clearly there is some bad blood between the people directly involved here, but for most of us reading, it's not about one specific rescue.

You're so right!

[Hotel4Yorkies]

OKYR is a good organization and today we are working to get 3 out of shelters. With all of us working full time jobs it is so hard to get to the shelters in time. Pray that we save 3 today from shelters and who knows what tomorrow will bring.

[sdtrippe]

Thank you Jen for having the courage to expose such things.I was naive and applad at the idea that this would and does happen.Yes with you Jen we all got a lesson; in what we really expect from our rescue donation.I'm a very shy person and don't really stand up and speak out when someting is unpopular..I admire you honey..I don't know that I could have ....Thanks you and you have every reason to be proud of yourself....I appreciate you more than I can say.... God Bless you,

Sheila