I Have to Say Something

[blitz]

Originally Posted by MindieRose

I guess when a new person comes here asking questions, they have probably read this first, and figure they will be treated respectfully and not have to come here on the defense.
The thread you posted, the poster that I commented about was shouting at the original poster. Unless exclaimation points have some how changed meaning since I have been in elementary school. That is not respectful or even just "blunt" for that matter. Bluntness is often rude. YOU may not think so, but when you dont even KNOW a person, and you are shouting at them, that goes beyond blunt even.
This is obviously a very competitive forum. When someone comes here for advice it often turns into a debate, and thats unfortunate. What is SO hard about answering someone politely? Do you think you have the RIGHT to shout and assume things about someone you dont even know? Or be "blunt" with them, when you dont even know what their intentions are?
You want to judge someone else on here that originally wanted to make money off of her dogs. She has obviously heeded a lot of advice, brought her dogs in, and is continuing to ask questions even through the ridicule. Why would someone do that? Because they DONT care about their dogs? I dont think so.
As the quoted post says, if you dont like the thread or the question, dont reply. Its really that easy.
If I posted every little "blunt" comment that crossed my mind in this place, I would have been banned my first 5 minutes here.
Tell me again how having a "holier than thou" attitude about dog breeding is helping the breed please?

That sounded pretty blunt to me.

[blitz]

Originally Posted by MyFairLacy

OMG LOVE that movie!! It is hilarious!

You know it's so funny because it's true.

[txshopper73]

Originally Posted by MindieRose

As the quoted post says, if you dont like the thread or the question, dont reply. Its really that easy.
If I posted every little "blunt" comment that crossed my mind in this place, I would have been banned my first 5 minutes here.
Tell me again how having a "holier than thou" attitude about dog breeding is helping the breed please?

This is the exact reason why so many wonderful, caring breeders no longer reply to threads.

But I'm with you...if I were to type out what I really wanted to say to some people, I would have been banned a long time ago.

We are all here to learn. We all come from different backgrounds. What may be seen as rude or blunt by some are taken by others in a different light.

I appreciate the passion that ethical/responsibile breeders have...it's been a long time since I've thought that a post from these breeders have been rude.

[blitz]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

I would just like to say something, generally speaking, not directed at anyone individually. I read a thread today that really made me think and helped me put alot of my thoughts into words:

http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=122236

The thread in itself is a prime example of why people come here for help and don't get it, why people ask questions and don't get answers.

I have not been on in a few weeks...I've been dealing with some major speedbumps in life and have not had the chance to log on. Now that things are settling down and I have the chance to think about something else for a minute, I read all this and it just makes me want to cut my PC off.

Honestly, the disregard for these dogs and the attitudes directed at those who DO try to help is enough to turn anyone off of YT and breeding altogether.

More and more frequently, new members/breeders sign up and ask questions. People who clearly have limited (if any) knowledge regarding Yorkies as a breed and the breeding process altogether and people who openly have intention$, goal$ and motivation$, and practice$ generally frowned upon by the Yorkie community and those committed to it.

They come onto YT as newbies, learning as we all once did and ask basic questions--then begins the bickering!

Many of the questions are things that should be researced well in advance of breeding. Breeding is not something that should be picked up as you go along!

Nevertheless, those experienced and with many years of knowledge--either those who can stomach the stress or those who have not given up--answer the questions giving honestly and give good advice. Sometimes the answers are not the ones you want to hear and sometimes they come accross as harsh--all in an attempt to try to get others to realize the seriousness of breeding and how dangerous it can be if done irresponsibly! This results in many new members either genuinely feeling attacked or crying victim to gain support and distract attention from their newly established, questionable breeding practices--bottom line, the dogs and their well being sadly take a backseat to the new, 'more important' issue--who is being 'rude' and who got their feelings hurt. The advice and answers that were given are forgotten, ignored and not followed or even considered by those who claim to be here because they so desperately need help or want to learn?! Something there just doesn't add up. (Or maybe it is just as it seems.)

Then come the comments such as, "They are just going to do it anyway" and "May as well try to help out" Well, I'm sorry, but I for one refuse to 'help out' anyone who breeds irresponsibly. Furthermore, I know there are many others who feel the same way and who have 'given up' trying to help others as it only results in them being criticized for being truthful, God forbid.

So my point is, THIS is why so many of the long time, well respected breeders that are (or were) members here don't even log onto YT anymore and why those who do don't bother to answer questions or help anymore. I can think of several breeders who have been at this a long time, who have shown and had success doing it over the years, who I have learned alot from and who could offer information and share their experiences, greatly benefitting us all--several members who fit this mold but who don't come to YT anymore or bother to post at all.

It's really unfortunate. I can't speak for everyone, but I really miss some of the long time breeders that used to post frequently--I learned alot from them and enjoyed reading what they had to say. Now when I come to the breeder section, it's not filled with anything helpful at all.

I don't know the solution to the problem. Heck, I don't even know if there is a solution! And maybe it's because I've recently had to deal with something that made me reconsider what really takes priority in my life and has made me rethink things I thought I had my mind made up about a long time ago. But for whatever reason, this bickering among people who all have (or claim to have) the same concerns (their dogs!) in mind seems completely ridiculous and petty and completely non-productive. Like I said, I can't fix it, but I can choose not to involve myself in it and rather focus my attention on other things, both on and off YT, relating and not relating to dogs.

If you come on here and ask a question, then listen to the advice given and understand that some answers will be passionate and not what you hoped for, but maybe what you truly need to hear. If you're answering a question, let it go and don't stress over those who refuse to see reason. And regardless of who you are, let your dogs, not some point you are trying to prove, be your main concern.

Anyways....that's all I got.

I've only been here a short time and I see all kinds of breeders and Yorkie lovers on here asking all kinds of questions and getting some helpful answers. They may have to take some heat too but people have different opinions. Unless I misunderstood what you were trying to say, you said you refuse to help someone who breeds irresponsibly... well, how are they going to learn if they are shunned?

There have been a lot of good things in the breeders section. For instance, a lady who was keeping her dogs outside brought them in because she got good advise here. Then I heard that she got all tied up in a bunch about something somebody said.... but that all really was incidental to the question and just part of forum life.

You know, you say you care about the dogs but if everyone refused to help her, the dogs would be the ones being hurt. Also, we had a big discussion on liver shunt and that discussion had a lot of views.

I know it is ridiculous but the bickering, snickering and gossiping is a major part of the dog world. It's always been this way.

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by txshopper73

We are all here to learn. We all come from different backgrounds. What may be seen as rude or blunt by some are taken by others in a different light.

You are so very right. I think in many cases alot of it comes down to how you choose to interpret things. Also, the power of suggestion is a strange thing...it generally only takes one person to get things started. And you are right...no being able to say something nice or not agreeing is the reason why many choose not to post.

[Brooklynn]

I have cut my breeding program before and it was due to LP and that's not even life threatening so if I'm willing to spay and neuter all the dogs I had from LP including my first homebred champion then I guess it would be very easy for me to start over if I had Liver Shunt pop up
I'm proud of my accomplishments as a breeder and those that disagree with what I have to say then that's their option I don't lose sleep over it

Donna Bird
Brooklynn's Yorkshire Terriers

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by blitz

Unless I misunderstood what you were trying to say, you said you refuse to help someone who breeds irresponsibly... well, how are they going to learn if they are shunned?

You are not mistaken. That is EXACTLY what I meant and how I feel. If people are going to breed irresponsibly and not listen or even consider advice being given, how on Earth could I help them? If someone is putting their dogs at risk, throwing your advice back at you, then I'll be darned if I'm going to continue to coach them through it and helping them risk the life of their dogs. You learn by listening to others and researching, not turning a deaf ear and doing what you please anyway. Sadly, the only way many will learn is when something tragic happens and they have to deal with the consequences of their own actions. So yeah, I'll say it again, I refuse to help anyone who breeds irresponsibly...it shocks me that anyone would do otherwise.

Originally Posted by blitz

There have been a lot of good things in the breeders section. For instance, a lady who was keeping her dogs outside brought them in because she got good advise here.

Yes, you are right, she got lots of good advice here and brought her dogs in--she got lots of good advice about alot of things. It was her choice as it is anyone else's if she is going to follow that or go her on way.
(Go back and research the situation...you'll see I offered to help her out...even drive to where she is to get the dogs and help rehome them if she felt she'd gotten in over her head and needed help.)

Originally Posted by blitz

You know, you say you care about the dogs but if everyone refused to help her, the dogs would be the ones being hurt.

Yes, you are absolutely right...it's the dogs being hurt...that is the sad reality of the situation.

Originally Posted by blitz

I know it is ridiculous but the bickering, snickering and gossiping is a major part of the dog world. It's always been this way.

You are right, and like I said, you can't change the way things are, but I can choose whether or not to get involved in it. There are lots of aspects of the dog world (and outside of the dog world) that are not that way. That is where I think my time will be better spent.

[Brooklynn]

I would reply but since one seems to think I know it all so I'll not respond LOL...but I will say this...

When I stop learning the yorkie breed is when I'll get out of it

[blitz]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

You are not mistaken. That is EXACTLY what I meant and how I feel. If people are going to breed irresponsibly and not listen or even consider advice being given, how on Earth could I help them? If someone is putting their dogs at risk, throwing your advice back at you, then I'll be darned if I'm going to continue to coach them through it and helping them risk the life of their dogs. You learn by listening to others and researching, not turning a deaf ear and doing what you please anyway.

Not everyone is this way.

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

Sadly, the only way many will learn is when something tragic happens and they have to deal with the consequences of their own actions. So yeah, I'll say it again, I refuse to help anyone who breeds irresponsibly...it shocks me that anyone would do otherwise.

I've been shocked many times from the very beginning. I was at a breeder's house and he had a dog in his basement with a completely broken in half leg. He told me he fell down the stairs with her and he didn't have the money to fix her leg. It had been like that for a year. I convinced him to turn the dog over to a rescue group. At least half of the breeders that I have met have been skuzbuckets. I was shocked to say the least but I don't look at it like I helped him...

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

Yes, you are right, she got lots of good advice here and brought her dogs in--she got lots of good advice about alot of things. It was her choice as it is anyone else's if she is going to follow that or go her on way.
(Go back and research the situation...you'll see I offered to help her out...even drive to where she is to get the dogs and help rehome them if she felt she'd gotten in over her head and needed help.)


Yes, you are absolutely right...it's the dogs being hurt...that is the sad reality of the situation.



You are right, and like I said, you can't change the way things are, but I can choose whether or not to get involved in it. There are lots of aspects of the dog world (and outside of the dog world) that are not that way. That is where I think my time will be better spent.

The lady who sold me my first show dog once told me, in regard to dog show people "They'll eat you up and spit you out!" and I was like uhm, somebody's being overly dramatic... but now I realize what she meant. You have to let things roll off you like a duck lets water roll off its back. What aspect of the dog world is not dog-eat-dog?

[blitz]

Originally Posted by MindieRose

I suppose some people might not posess that ability though, or choose not to.

well that was blunt.

[blitz]

Originally Posted by Susan123

Is there a popular site for breeders? I'm from New England, there are very few of us breeding, and we don't experience the same degree of nastiness that is so legendary elsewhere. Unfortunately, because we are few and far between I'm looking to internet as a relative newcomer looking for good information, but this site has some destructive characters on it. I hope the newcomers realize that and don't just blindly accept whatever is thrown out at them...

Since you obviously would like to be at another forum, might I suggest google? As a newcomer, if you did want to stick around I'd suggest searching the archives. There are tons of information on the net, not just forums. There are also plenty of books that are at everyone's access. These and having a mentor really are our best resources.

[MindieRose]

Originally Posted by blitz

well that was blunt.

touche

[LittleDogBoutiq]

Does anyone know about that Preemie puppy? I just hope the puppy is okay. I suppose I will do a new post. I should be asleep not blogging here right! Tomorrow I will be wearing sun glasses to hide my dark under eye circles..

[chachi]

Originally Posted by MindieRose

touche

I think your hipocritical. I quess no one has the right to be blunt unless its you

[red98vett]

Originally Posted by yorkiekist

Why must all of the experenced or knowledgeable breeders need to "sugar coat" the information that someone is asking? Breeding should be taken seriously and if unimformed first time "breeders" are asking VERY basic questions, then they have no business breeding period. I mean, come on. I have seen questions on here and I wonder if some of these people have EVER even heard of the birds and the bees. I am all for helping people with their questions but I would rather give them the hard, blunt truth on what may or may not happen or why every run of the mill cute wonderful Yorkie should not be bred. And maybe, just maybe, a first time "breeder" will take a look at what they are doing and not breed or will do the health testing first, or will be more informed and prepared mentally and finacially.

GREAT Point - but unfortunatly - most will do what they want no matter how good the advise is - and I'm with everyone who said many breeders no longer post now - it's sad because some really DID have alot to offer.

Being blunt is NOT A CRIME but I think people see the words as they're written - get offended and don't listen. If we had to sugarcoat everything how would someone new to breeding really LEARN what they're getting into ?

I'm not a breeder but learned so much about it here - it's sad that the longtime breeders no longer feel the need to post because of the bashing.