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01-17-2009, 01:12 PM | #1 |
Wee Winston Wiggles Donating Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Kewanee, Illinois
Posts: 9,666
| Rosemary extract and seizures Does any one care to share information regarding rosemary extract in dog food and treats as a seizure trigger? Are there other known or suspected seizure triggers that I should be aware of? Also, is there any known correlation between rosemary extract and glucose/blood sugar levels. I am trying to gather this information so I can talk to Winston's vet about it. Thank you in advance for any and all information I may receive.
__________________ As Ever, Kathy Intruducing Bentley Winston and Spencer: RIP My Sweet Angels |
Welcome Guest! | |
01-17-2009, 01:30 PM | #2 |
And Rylee Finnegan Donating Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Metro Detroit, MI
Posts: 17,928
| I have heard about the connection between rosemary and seizures but I'm not sure that a reliable source is relaying it. The same goes for nutmeg. Maybe someone from YT could contact the ASPCA about this. They seem to be the authority on toxic food and pets.
__________________ Crystal, Ellie May (RIP), Rylee Finnegan, and Gracie Boo🐶 |
01-17-2009, 01:35 PM | #3 |
Donating YT 1000 Club Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: In my house :)
Posts: 5,219
| Kathy...go spend some time reading around this website: Canine epilepsy and diseases that cause seizures in dogs Yes, there is a connection with rosemary and seizures according to that site. You can search from the top of the page for rosemary and it will bring up any of the articles and info they have on it. There is so much to learn on that site...it's amazing. Last edited by my2boyz; 01-17-2009 at 01:37 PM. |
01-17-2009, 01:40 PM | #4 |
Donating YT 2000 Club Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: North Carolina
Posts: 8,317
| Yes, there is a link between rosemary and seizures. If you start reading labels, it is amazing how many dog food products contain rosemary, including Petzlife. : PetzLife Products Inc - Products For a Healthier Pet |
01-17-2009, 03:51 PM | #5 |
Wee Winston Wiggles Donating Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Kewanee, Illinois
Posts: 9,666
| Hmmm, nutmeg too? I've been reading a lot and have not seen mention of this, although I do believe nutmeg is related to glucose levels. Thanks for your input. May have to contact the ASPCA...it's a thought.
__________________ As Ever, Kathy Intruducing Bentley Winston and Spencer: RIP My Sweet Angels |
01-17-2009, 04:12 PM | #6 | |
Wee Winston Wiggles Donating Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Kewanee, Illinois
Posts: 9,666
| Quote:
__________________ As Ever, Kathy Intruducing Bentley Winston and Spencer: RIP My Sweet Angels | |
01-17-2009, 04:15 PM | #7 | |
Wee Winston Wiggles Donating Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Kewanee, Illinois
Posts: 9,666
| Quote:
Thanks for the information of PetzLife, I don't use it myself...but I know many that do.
__________________ As Ever, Kathy Intruducing Bentley Winston and Spencer: RIP My Sweet Angels | |
01-17-2009, 04:18 PM | #8 |
Donating YT 1000 Club Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: In my house :)
Posts: 5,219
| What about your cleaning supplies? It does say on that site that Pine Sol causes seizures. Do you have laminate or wood floors that you use anything on? Are the seizures predictable as far as when they come...like so many days apart each time? Are you doing or using or doing anything that you can even remotely connect with his seizures? That might be a place to start if you can definitely rule out hypoglicemia. I believe it also says somewhere on that site that hypoglicemia can be caused from the dog not being able to process protein properly...but you might want to double check that point...it's been a while since I read about that. I read the list of chemicals that can trigger seizures and it was overwhelming...can't imagine how many things those chemicals might be in. |
01-17-2009, 04:26 PM | #9 |
And Rylee Finnegan Donating Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Metro Detroit, MI
Posts: 17,928
| Winston is having seizures, right? What has been ruled out and how? What is the diagnosis?
__________________ Crystal, Ellie May (RIP), Rylee Finnegan, and Gracie Boo🐶 |
01-17-2009, 05:59 PM | #10 | |
Wee Winston Wiggles Donating Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Kewanee, Illinois
Posts: 9,666
| Quote:
From what I have read a true epileptic seizure does not last as long as Winston's do...it comes on all of a sudden, although he does try to get to me first, I give him NutriCal and within 20-30 minutes he's come out of it, and most of the time vomits. But a seizure I understand usually only last from a few seconds to a few minutes. They do not seem to coincide with flea prevention, heartworm medicine or vaccines. I questioned the possibility of thunderstorms, but that isn't the case either. Winston is now 5 years old and 8 pounds, he has been having this same problem since he was 3 years old and 7 pounds. Everything points to low blood sugar, but why??? Keep the thoughts and ideas coming, I'm open to any and all suggestions.
__________________ As Ever, Kathy Intruducing Bentley Winston and Spencer: RIP My Sweet Angels | |
01-17-2009, 06:58 PM | #11 |
Donating YT 1000 Club Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: In my house :)
Posts: 5,219
| Is there a treat that he gets on the days you're home? Maybe he's just using his food up faster while he's playing. Do you make sure he takes time out for a snack and rest a little when you're home? What about taking him for a walk...maybe that would burn off some of his energy in a more constructive way. Does he have allergies? They can cause seizures too. I don't know what you feed Winston but there is a very good diet on that site for epi dogs...maybe give it a try and see if it makes a difference in him. Otherwise a visit to a neurologist might be in order. Oh, instead of the nutrical try the Hagendaz vanilla ice cream like they suggest on the site...it works more efficiently in their system and doesn't give the high and low that nutrical does. |
01-17-2009, 07:02 PM | #12 | |
Wee Winston Wiggles Donating Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Kewanee, Illinois
Posts: 9,666
| Quote:
The first time this happened, I just happened to be home sick myself during the week...I rushed him to the vets, which is only a couple blocks from my house. Their first thought was heat stroke, but it was March in Illinois it was not that hot. They rushed him back and started him on IV's, the only thing they found out of the ordinary was a dangerously low glucose reading of 25. They kept him in CCU until he was able to eat on his own and his sugar didn't drop. So, then we were trying to find a reason for this, I told her there were toadstool type mushrooms in our yard, I usually try to destroy them but they pop up overnight and maybe I missed one...maybe he tried to eat one. She did some checking and found hypoglycemia was a symptom of ingesting these. So we thought that was that and I'd have to be more careful with him outside. But then the seizures continued. Testing: Complete Chemistry Complete Blood Count Fecal Test Urinalysis Glucose Tolerance Thyroid Profile Bile Acid Testing Cortisol Test Liver Profile Electrolyte Test Lipid Profile Chest X-ray KUB-Abdomen X-ray Ct Scan Chest Ct scan Abdomen I guess that's it, any suggestions? My regular vet referred him to a vet in Internal Medicine, her suggestions were...to put him back on puppy food, frequent small feedings, 6 times a day. Check his blood sugar at home at the very first sign of a seizure (it's always low) and immediately after a seizure (most always a low normal). Possible liver biopsy for glycogen storage, which I have not done. May need hypoglycemic agent, which I have not done. He is also on (Valium) diazepam 2.5mg twice a day. It was suggested to try Prednisone...as it has the side effect of raising ones blood sugar...but I would rather not use this if at all possible. Insulinoma was pondered, but ruled out, due to his age at the time, breed and testing done thus far. All of the vets he has seen so far, and he's been seen by several, think it is not epileptic seizures, but hypoglycemic seizures. So that brings us up to date on Winston...his last episode was January 10th.
__________________ As Ever, Kathy Intruducing Bentley Winston and Spencer: RIP My Sweet Angels | |
01-17-2009, 09:06 PM | #13 | |
Wee Winston Wiggles Donating Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Kewanee, Illinois
Posts: 9,666
| Quote:
There is no way that ice cream will work, he is completely seizing, he has no control and is totally unable to eat any thing, then there's the risk of aspiration too. I have to open his mouth, insert my finger and rub NutriCal on the roof of his mouth...it's the only way. The ice cream could come later, after seizing, to stabilize the sugar level I suppose. But he almost always vomits afterwards and I have a hard time getting him to eat anything then. I remember someone told me once to give Breyers All Natural ice cream after an episode...nope, he didn't want it.
__________________ As Ever, Kathy Intruducing Bentley Winston and Spencer: RIP My Sweet Angels | |
01-18-2009, 05:18 PM | #14 |
Wee Winston Wiggles Donating Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Kewanee, Illinois
Posts: 9,666
| Winston had another episode today, it started at 4:20 pm and lasted about 20 minutes. I'm beginning to feel so hopeless and helpless, I could just cry...
__________________ As Ever, Kathy Intruducing Bentley Winston and Spencer: RIP My Sweet Angels |
01-18-2009, 05:31 PM | #15 |
Donating YT 1000 Club Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: In my house :)
Posts: 5,219
| Kathy...I'm sorry to hear about Winston. Maybe it's time to make an appointment with a neurologist and see if they can help. |
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