Returning an unwanted child!

[ArmaniMan]

Elaine... your post was so touching!

I know you feel like the one who is blessed but I am sure your boys believe it is them who was truly blessed.

[Bianca]

Originally Posted by jrsygal37

I'm a mom to two foreign born children. My oldest was perfect in every way. My younges son came to us at almost a year old. We were not told about his health issues, or that they suspected he was retarded. The first week we had Nick, we almost lost him. He was constantly sick for the first four years of his life. He didn't walk or talk until after three years of age. I knew something was wrong but we could not figure out what nor could the doctors. At four years old a pre-school teacher familiar with something called came to me and said "I think your son is Autistic." When you think of Autism, you think of the worse case scenario, but there are different forms and Asperger's is one of them. At five years old after going to two specialty hospitals, and a whole bunch of specialists, Nick was officially diagnoed with Asperger's ( A mild form of Autism). Quite honestly, as I look at these years the first thought that came to mind was he was retarded. Not true. We were surprised to learn that Nick was functioning on a genius IQ level. I worked countless hours to teach him, basic things like how to make eye contact when he's talking, how to get out of the way of a car when it comes, how to know when someone is mean and how to respond back. Simple things that seem to come so easily for children were a struggle for Nick, yet give him high school math, science etc. and Nick could perform all of it at the age of five, yet could not tell you why he knew how to do it or how he got his answers. He just knew.

Nick is now, almost 14. He has no trace of Autism. He's got a black belt in Karate, a straight A student (Main Stream) in gifted classes. Is a starter on the school baseball team, as well as a starting catcher/2nd baseman on a championship travel baseball team. He competes all of the country with his team. Has many friends and is for the most part outgoing, but still carries just a slight shyness about him.

The point I'm trying to make is that many of these children come home with issues, but with patience and love and good food and medical care I've seen personally that these children can turn around.

It saddens me to see when an adopted parent sends their child back. After all, if you gave birth biologically what would you do with that child if he did not turn out as you expected? To me when you adopt you are taking that child as your own.

I could not read the story, but even without reading you would think that they would have at the least placed him with social services right here in the US rather then send him back to Russia. Anyone that has gone through a foreign adoption or has been to the countries to see how the children live know what his outcome will be. I know in the country I adopted from, once a child is fully adopted there is no turning back. If you change your mind that child is doomed. He'll live his entire life in an orphanage and in Russia, more then likely will be placed with mentally disturbed children. Most even prior to adoption are all placed together and this is why the children come home as they do. It's very very sad.

In ending I would just like to say that although I think it was a terrible thing for them to do, not tell us how sick Nick was or that they suspected him to be retarded. I am thankful for not knowing, because had I known it then things could have turned out much differently and maybe we would not have Nick now. And, that would be our loss because we could not ask for a better son. I've been blessed with two perfect boys in every way.

Elaine

I think people like you are rare in this world My nephew also has Asperger's he is 14 and although it's under control it will never go away.
This I feel is totally different, we are talking about violence and bodily harm. There was a boy who harmed his 2 yr old sister in a very bad way *Not talking about this case* there is a difference when dealing with a severely violent child. Not being able to sleep at night or having to lock your other children in their rooms at night for fear of harm or in some cases death. I think the parents should have known from the start something was very wrong and the workers were not clueless, they knew full well what this child was capable of.
I have seen cases like this numerous times where the parents can just not handle it anymore, I am not saying this is a case like the ones I have seen, but you can't sit here and say you know how these parents feel and their daily fear if you have not lived through it. It's easy to say I would do this or I would do that * not referring to anyone on this thread I mean in general * , but we don't know what we would do if it happened to us.
Some of these children are very violent and need to be watched ALL the time, it's just not as easy and even more difficult when you have other children in the home to worry about.
Like I said I am not saying what this woman did was right, I am just saying we need to know all the facts before we pass judgement , thats all.

[laci32]

This is terrible . I do believe she was given bad advise if there was a lawyer ? as she stated . Some people think a child will be mentaly sound and have no issues whats so ever to be moved far out of their country ,Torn from their family and the life they knew .Nobody but the child knows what he/she had to suffer through in thier life . Just shakes my head .It's one more person that failed that child.

[BellaBlue82]

I agree with Darlene that the situation is sad from both sides. That boy deserves a loving family no matter what his upbringing is. That being said, coming from a home where I'm the only biological child and my parents adopted four after me, you have to look at it from the mom's side, too. The adoption process is so time consuming, gut-wrenching, expensive, and very difficult all the way around. Because of everything that you have to go through, when you finally get the child you want everything to be as it should... not have that child talk about burning your house down with you in it (allegedly). I can't wait to hear the entire TRUE story as to what really happened. I don't like that the person in charge of the Russian adoption agency has already come out and said that the boy told him that the mom was pulling his hair and being mean to him. I'm sorry, in my experience with adoption, people who go through this long, expensive process generally aren't child abusers, it doesn't make much sense.

[Krystee]

Originally Posted by jrsygal37

I'm a mom to two foreign born children. My oldest was perfect in every way. My younges son came to us at almost a year old. We were not told about his health issues, or that they suspected he was retarded. The first week we had Nick, we almost lost him. He was constantly sick for the first four years of his life. He didn't walk or talk until after three years of age. I knew something was wrong but we could not figure out what nor could the doctors. At four years old a pre-school teacher familiar with something called Asperger's came to me and said "I think your son is Autistic." When you think of Autism, you think of the worse case scenario, but there are different forms and Asperger's is one of them. At five years old after going to two specialty hospitals, and a whole bunch of specialists, Nick was officially diagnoed with Asperger's ( A mild form of Autism). Quite honestly, as I look at these years the first thought that came to mind was he was retarded. Not true. We were surprised to learn that Nick was functioning on a genius IQ level. I worked countless hours to teach him, basic things like how to make eye contact when he's talking, how to get out of the way of a car when it comes, how to know when someone is mean and how to respond back. Simple things that seem to come so easily for children were a struggle for Nick, yet give him high school math, science etc. and Nick could perform all of it at the age of five, yet could not tell you why he knew how to do it or how he got his answers. He just knew.

Nick is now, almost 14. He has no trace of Autism. He's got a black belt in Karate, a straight A student (Main Stream) in gifted classes. Is a starter on the school baseball team, as well as a starting catcher/2nd baseman on a championship travel baseball team. He competes all of the country with his team. Has many friends and is for the most part outgoing, but still carries just a slight shyness about him.

The point I'm trying to make is that many of these children come home with issues, but with patience and love and good food and medical care I've seen personally that these children can turn around.

It saddens me to see when an adopted parent sends their child back. After all, if you gave birth biologically what would you do with that child if he did not turn out as you expected? To me when you adopt you are taking that child as your own.

I could not read the story, but even without reading you would think that they would have at the least placed him with social services right here in the US rather then send him back to Russia. Anyone that has gone through a foreign adoption or has been to the countries to see how the children live know what his outcome will be. I know in the country I adopted from, once a child is fully adopted there is no turning back. If you change your mind that child is doomed. He'll live his entire life in an orphanage and in Russia, more then likely will be placed with mentally disturbed children. Most even prior to adoption are all placed together and this is why the children come home as they do. It's very very sad.

In ending I would just like to say that although I think it was a terrible thing for them to do, not tell us how sick Nick was or that they suspected him to be retarded. I am thankful for not knowing, because had I known it then things could have turned out much differently and maybe we would not have Nick now. And, that would be our loss because we could not ask for a better son. I've been blessed with two perfect boys in every way.

Elaine

What an amazing, beautiful story... I had chills while reading it. We need more parents like you in this world

[Krystee]

Originally Posted by BellaBlue82

[B]I agree with Darlene that the situation is sad from both sides. That boy deserves a loving family no matter what his upbringing is. That being said, coming from a home where I'm the only biological child and my parents adopted four after me, you have to look at it from the mom's side, too. The adoption process is so time consuming, gut-wrenching, expensive, and very difficult all the way around. Because of everything that you have to go through, when you finally get the child you want everything to be as it should... not have that child talk about burning your house down with you in it (allegedly). I can't wait to hear the entire TRUE story as to what really happened. I don't like that the person in charge of the Russian adoption agency has already come out and said that the boy told him that the mom was pulling his hair and being mean to him. I'm sorry, in my experience with adoption, people who go through this long, expensive process generally aren't child abusers, it doesn't make much sense.[/B]

I agree, that doesn't make much sense. But then on the other hand, it doesn't make much sense that she would return him the way she did. I don't know, I am waiting to hear the true story as well because people who adopt usually are warm, caring, loving people. It's such a sad situation.

[jrsygal37]

Originally Posted by Bianca

I think people like you are rare in this world My nephew also has Asperger's he is 14 and although it's under control it will never go away.
This I feel is totally different, we are talking about violence and bodily harm. There was a boy who harmed his 2 yr old sister in a very bad way *Not talking about this case* there is a difference when dealing with a severely violent child. Not being able to sleep at night or having to lock your other children in their rooms at night for fear of harm or in some cases death. I think the parents should have known from the start something was very wrong and the workers were not clueless, they knew full well what this child was capable of.
I have seen cases like this numerous times where the parents can just not handle it anymore, I am not saying this is a case like the ones I have seen, but you can't sit here and say you know how these parents feel and their daily fear if you have not lived through it. It's easy to say I would do this or I would do that * not referring to anyone on this thread I mean in general * , but we don't know what we would do if it happened to us.
Some of these children are very violent and need to be watched ALL the time, it's just not as easy and even more difficult when you have other children in the home to worry about.
Like I said I am not saying what this woman did was right, I am just saying we need to know all the facts before we pass judgement , thats all.

I'm in no way passing judgment. I've done a lot of research prior to adopting and Russia has one of the worse systems out there. The children live in orphanages, where normal children are placed with severely mentally handicapped children. They are often place two or three to a crib and in some cases even tied down with little to no stimulation. These children often do not become available for adoption until after the toddler stages and by then the damage is done. Also, the the children are a lot of time products of fetal alcohol syndrome. This is not the first case where a child from Russia has either been returned or put into US Foster Care due to attatchement disorder. It's unfortunate, but yes there is a big difference. Not all but quite a few children being brought home have attatchement disorders, bipolar, and a lot of it is caused due to the fetal alcohol syndrome as well as the environment they have lived in for years prior to being available for adoption. I did not read this story, but without even reading it IF the parent could not handle the child and believe me I'm not faulting the family for saying "It's too much for me to handle" but I am saying that this child should never have been sent back to Russia. The family has given this child a life sentence. As I said in foreign countries it is not like here. Once that child is returned the country does not allow for a new adoption. That child will rot in an institution because really that is what a Russian orphanage is. The best route for this family to have taken was to hand the child over to a US system were there he would have atleast had a fighting chance. I believe when you adopt you take that child as your own blood. I always tell my children you were not born in my belly you were born in my heart. I can't imagine ever handing my child back no matter what but honestly, I don't think any of us can say for sure what we'd do until we are put in that position. I thank God every day that I was never put in a position where I had to make this kind of decision.

I've seen documentaries on these children brought home from Romania and Russia and the rage they display. It's very very hard to live like that on a daily basis, to not be able to go to sleep without worrying whether the child will burn your house down, harm your other children etc. And, it's not to frighten people from adopting from these countries, but you do have to trust your attorney and your agency as unfortunately, these two countries have a very high rate of kids coming home like this. And, really it is due to the institutionalization they have been forced to live in for so many years before being available for adoption. Do any of you remember the big segment years ago, like maybe 20 years ago about the children in Romanian Orphanages and all the families rushing to Romania to adopt. I do. I watched it and it was heartbreaking. Normal children or children with something as simple as a clef palett being labeled unadoptable and institionalized. I think it was 20/20 that did the segement and went through the orphanages with cameras, some under cover. If you ever watched it you would know why this child came to him as he did. Elaine

[megansmomma]

I cannot understand what kind of a heartless person would do something like this. She is a healthcare provided and are we not suppose to have compassion? She packed a 7 yr old onto a transcontinental flight with a note! She should be charged with every crime in the book possible! Her actions have not shut down a network of adoptions and the chance for other children to have a life filled with love. How very sad

[megansmomma]

Originally Posted by jrsygal37

I'm in no way passing judgment. I've done a lot of research prior to adopting and Russia has one of the worse systems out there. The children live in orphanages, where normal children are placed with severely mentally handicapped children. They are often place two or three to a crib and in some cases even tied down with little to no stimulation. These children often do not become available for adoption until after the toddler stages and by then the damage is done. Also, the the children are a lot of time products of fetal alcohol syndrome. This is not the first case where a child from Russia has either been returned or put into US Foster Care due to attatchement disorder. It's unfortunate, but yes there is a big difference. Not all but quite a few children being brought home have attatchement disorders, bipolar, and a lot of it is caused due to the fetal alcohol syndrome as well as the environment they have lived in for years prior to being available for adoption. I did not read this story, but without even reading it IF the parent could not handle the child and believe me I'm not faulting the family for saying "It's too much for me to handle" but I am saying that this child should never have been sent back to Russia. The family has given this child a life sentence. As I said in foreign countries it is not like here. Once that child is returned the country does not allow for a new adoption. That child will rot in an institution because really that is what a Russian orphanage is. The best route for this family to have taken was to hand the child over to a US system were there he would have atleast had a fighting chance. I believe when you adopt you take that child as your own blood. I always tell my children you were not born in my belly you were born in my heart. I can't imagine ever handing my child back no matter what but honestly, I don't think any of us can say for sure what we'd do until we are put in that position. I thank God every day that I was never put in a position where I had to make this kind of decision.

I've seen documentaries on these children brought home from Romania and Russia and the rage they display. It's very very hard to live like that on a daily basis, to not be able to go to sleep without worrying whether the child will burn your house down, harm your other children etc. And, it's not to frighten people from adopting from these countries, but you do have to trust your attorney and your agency as unfortunately, these two countries have a very high rate of kids coming home like this. And, really it is due to the institutionalization they have been forced to live in for so many years before being available for adoption. Do any of you remember the big segment years ago, like maybe 20 years ago about the children in Romanian Orphanages and all the families rushing to Romania to adopt. I do. I watched it and it was heartbreaking. Normal children or children with something as simple as a clef palett being labeled unadoptable and institionalized. I think it was 20/20 that did the segement and went through the orphanages with cameras, some under cover. If you ever watched it you would know why this child came to him as he did. Elaine

I can totally see your point and that is why you need to do your homework when it comes to adoptions. From your post, I can tell that your knowledge was from doing much research on this subject prior to adopting. But I think the issue is that people think "I can change him" and not fully understand it is not something that can be changed. It sounded like they expected him to become what they expected and when things started to spiral out of control they made a decision that was inappropriate or not well thought out. When you take in a living creature (child, dog, cat, whatever) you need to do as much research as possible and accept your decisions and cope as best as you can. It sounds like the adoptive mom did not take appropriate steps to address his issues and instead make a snap decision to transport him back to Russia. I cannot imagine having such fear of a child and have read stories about the condition of the orphanages in Russia and Romania. It makes me sick to think about all of those children living in those types on condition without love or even basic stimulations. Being adopted, I cannot imagine my adopted parents not loving me or living on those types of conditions.

[nana911]

Boy, there are so many sides to this issue. Being a foreign born adoptee that came from an orphanage, adopted at almost 2yrs old by overly strict religious parents who were emotionally and physically abusive. She, one summer DID try to ship me back, at the age of 12, I can see a couple of sides. I've also read cases where unstable, violent adoptees grow up to return to their adopted families and kill them in their beds. Scary stuff. Where do you draw the line? When do you take chances with your safety on someone that may or may not be rehabilitated? Most adopting parents are in it for the right reasons. Mine adopted 3 for all the wrong reasons. My middle brother and I, coming from the same orphanage (he was adopted at age 5) both suffer from reactive attachment disorder. (the youngest was adopted locally at 3days old) I am able to terminate a relationship with no lasting emotional consequences. I don't understand people that miss their parents, kids, grandkids, have roots, etc... I fulfill the socially obligatory roles and I do love my kids and grandkids. I am over the moon about my furbabies....LOL

Anyway, I guess I'm saying that if that woman was scared enough she did what she felt she had to do. Or she was like my mom and she was just abusive and carried through on a threat. There is more than one side.

[jrsygal37]

Originally Posted by nana911

Boy, there are so many sides to this issue. Being a foreign born adoptee that came from an orphanage, adopted at almost 2yrs old by overly strict religious parents who were emotionally and physically abusive. She, one summer DID try to ship me back, at the age of 12, I can see a couple of sides. I've also read cases where unstable, violent adoptees grow up to return to their adopted families and kill them in their beds. Scary stuff. Where do you draw the line? When do you take chances with your safety on someone that may or may not be rehabilitated? Most adopting parents are in it for the right reasons. Mine adopted 3 for all the wrong reasons. My middle brother and I, coming from the same orphanage (he was adopted at age 5) both suffer from reactive attachment disorder. (the youngest was adopted locally at 3days old) I am able to terminate a relationship with no lasting emotional consequences. I don't understand people that miss their parents, kids, grandkids, have roots, etc... I fulfill the socially obligatory roles and I do love my kids and grandkids. I am over the moon about my furbabies....LOL

Anyway, I guess I'm saying that if that woman was scared enough she did what she felt she had to do. Or she was like my mom and she was just abusive and carried through on a threat. There is more than one side.

I'm sorry, that your adoptive parents turned out to be physically and emotionally abusive. I think in a lot of countries requirements need to be changed and adoped parents should be checked up on, just as if they adopted here in the states. They do the fingerprint checks, to check for any crimanal records, they do a homestudy to check to make sure your home is suitable with regard to being clean and a room for the child, and through the homestudy the social worker will ask you questions about your childhood, why you want to adopt etc. yet many countries stop short after this. They failt do a psychiatric on prospective parents and they fail AFTER the child comes home to follow up on the progress and on the parenting. In my oppinion this child should be tracked for at least a year by social services to make sure that BOTH child and adoptive parents are adjusting. Unfortunately, there are holes in the system that allows for people to adopt that shouldn't have children. Guatemala, for one is one of the easiest places. There are no age limits (Which I'm not totally against since my husband is older then I) There are also no limit on the amount of children you can have (Which again I'm not totally against since other countries such as China who use to only allow one child per household, following their own govermental rules that has since been changed) and they do not require the parents to travel to the country. If the parents do travel, the child is then issued a final decree of adoption prior to ever entereing the US. This I'm against. I think the adoption should be finalized in the US and only AFTER the child has been monitored in the care of the US family for one year. I think this would prevent a lot of what happened where this boy was sent back, and I also think it would have prevented the abuse you suffered. We as adopted parents do go through a lot of background checks, fingerprinting, strangers coming into our home to ask questions that biological parents never have to go through, yet still some have slipped through the cracks and for that I'm sorry.

In our system laws are passed, yet not addressed on how to apply them. I can go on and on on this subject. I'm going through it now with my son who is 16 and his passport. Citizenship Act of 2000 was passed in 2001 it reads any US family that adopt a foreign born child and that child has come home with and RI3 Visa, that child is an automatic citizen, eliminating the step of having to apply citizenship for that child yet places like passport, NJDVM are unaware of this law and still look for the certificate of citizenship which INS no longer supplys. In order to have it, you then have to file for citizenship (Kind of silly) and pay the fee of $400 which by the way use to be $75. Then the issue with the birth certificate, many families have applied to have their foriegn child's bc ammended to a NJ bc so the child does not have to continually supply all his foreign paperwork. This new ammended bc is suppose to eliminate this and act to allow the foreign child to give just what a US born child would supply yet still places like the State Dept (of all places) still require when applying for a passport, the original foreign documents. They are not familiar with the NJ statue on the NJ BC which is law, yet they are unaware of it.

Anyway, I think you get what I'm saying. Things, laws are put in place and passed yet no one is appropriately trained in how t apply them and like everything there are holes in the system.

I'm really sorry for what you went through as a child brought to the US. And, as far as this little boy goes I pray to God that the the same loop holes help this boy slip under the Russian Laws and allow for him to be placed for readoption and not just institutionalized for the rest of his life.

Elaine

[nana911]

As you say, you can't legislate for every contingency. My brother and I developed RAD in the orphanage setting, before adoption. My adoptive parents would have passed any tests with flying colors, but this was 50yrs ago before any of that...LOL There are natural born families with much worse problems and that is a whole 'nother forum, I'm sure!

[miabellaamoure]

Originally Posted by DvlshAngel985

All I can say is WOW. I don't think the truth will be coming out immediately. So many people are going to try to cover their behinds and point fingers. If the boy truly did the things that were described, that's disturbing. Why would a Russian adoption agency knowingly adopt a mentally unstable child out to any family?

One less mouth to feed in that orphanage & for the sake of the $$$...definitely not the child!

[Ashley V]

I'm fairly neutral on this subject - I just don't feel we have all the facts yet. The adoptive parents are saying that the child reported abuse to the orphanage. The orphanage is saying that the child reported abuse from the adoptive parents. The news articles never state if the adoptive parents ever sought medical and psychiatric treatment for the child.

In a situation where the parents tried all they could do with medical attention and were truly in fear for their lives and felt they couldn't do anything more to help this child, then maybe returning him was in the child's and their best interest HOWEVER I do not believe putting a 7 year old on a international flight with a note is the right way to do it. Someone from that family should have accompanied that little boy. If they didn't feel comfortable with just one family member alone with him, then have two adults accompany him. You don't just send a child alone with a note on an international flight to Russia. That's wrong, IMO. If he truly is violent, then the agency should have known and should have said something to the adoptive parents. That IMO is also wrong.

I feel bad for the little boy though, violent or not. He's been through so much at such a young age. I pray he gets the help he needs and goes to a loving family that can give him everything he needs and he can live a normal life.

[ARCHIE]

Originally Posted by livingdustmops

I can't believe she just put him on a plane but I will tell you this has happened in the past before with other people adopting children from Russia.. Some of these children were never touched the first years of their life and as such have real mental problems..it is so sad but it does not excuse what this woman did..

A few years ago I was watching Montel Williams. He had a show on this
very thing. There was a couple who had adopted two brother's as babies from
Russia. As the boys grew they did things that you would not believe children
could even think of to do. Became violent, abused animals, set the house on
fire, were not loving or accepted any kind of human touch. The adopted
patents tried seeking help but only to be turned away from the agency that
they adopted from. The boys were under the care of a psychiatrist and other
doctor's for observation. Parents feared for their lives. So please don't judge.
Children who are brought up in institutions in foreign countries are left in
cribs alone all day and fed in the same place. They have little stimulation
and who knows what kind of parent's they came from. Wanting to give
a child a loving home and ending up with a child that can harm you must
be terrifying. Most of those children are unadoptable but the agencies
push them out without telling future parents of their problems only to
make room for more homeless children. I couldn't believe what I was watching. But it was all true. I don't believe this child was put on a plane
without the other side being notified. There is more to this story than is
being told. Leave it to the press, because all they want to do is sell
paper's.