Oh, definitely not! I'm worried as heck about having to get her spayed, or the rabies vaccine. Geesh, talk about protective Mama! :rolleyes:

My point is that the pain is similar, short-lived and not that traumatic.

at least its a health reason.... but i suggest you do not watch the spaying video ...just giving you a heads up in case you decide to watch

OK...I finally got up the nerve to watch the video and in my observation the puppy was was crying while they were just measuring it's tail and continued crying about the same throughout the video until after it's tail was docked. At the very end before they took the hemostat off, it quit crying. I'm sure there is some discomfort but is it any worse than having baby boys circumcised? I agree, this may seem cruel but it is the breed standard and I don't feel it causes any long term trauma when done at around 3 days old. Just my opinion.

he's louder when they cut the tail

My thoughts exactly.

Circumcision, ear peircing......

And the puppy was crying before the tail docking. I'm sure it does hurt and it would be nice if we could choose weather or not we get our pups tails docked. But as others have mentioned leaving the tail undocked is not breed standard and I highly doubt there is any more trauma than that of a new born baby getting curcumcised.

I just aided in performing the tail docking on 8 of my Black Russian Terrier puppies when they were three days old.

The puppies were no worse for the wear moments after it was done. In fact, there was no sensitivity issues even hours after the procedure. It's like nothing had changed to them. We had only put in one or two sutures afterwards. It's all you need. The dew claw removal is pretty interesting though, when it's done correctly, it's slightly harder to watch than the tail docking, to those that have never seen either.

Here's a pic of my pups only minutes after their dew claw and tail docking:
btw, I have Yorkies with both tails and docked tails. I certainly prefer the DOCKED tail. Some Yorkies with tails have hair that grows screwy or the tail itself just doesn't do the dog's structure justice.

"Every dog should have a tail to tell"
 

I'm so grateful to live a country that has come to its senses and banned these(tail docking/ear cropping) outdated,selfish procedures for purely cosmetic reasons! Of course I agree that if any surgical procedure is needed for the health and safety of an animal then its a necessary evil eg. neutering/docking tails on working animals. There are no increased health/safety or hygiene issues with pet/show/breeding dogs in this country just because we have left them with their tails. Mika has her tail and I don't ever clip or need to wash under her tail, I check her after every toilet trip but theres never been an issue. I realize since I'm growing her hair that it may become an issue but I'd much rather spend some of my time each day tending to her needs and cleaning her rather than deprive her of an extremely important part of her body! Having two breeds that were traditionally docked I can see how vital their tails are everyday, they use them to communicate in ways that would be impossible with a stump, there are never any serious arguments between my dogs. I can tell by their tails straight away if theres anything wrong and they can tell each other that they're sorry when a problem arises their facial expressions and body language are the last signs, their tails do all the talking and keep the peace in our house!

You are on the money about being able to tell how they feel by looking at their tails. The only thing I wish Ivy did get done was to have her dew claws taken off (only because of health reasons ) But they are all so cute:D:D with or without.

I really cant see why cropping the tail makes it better for cleanliness, as they are still left with the bit that gets poo on it! :confused:
I think it is barbaric and unnecessary to dock a little puppy's tail..If everyone made a stand and refused to dock, it would eventually put an end to it. ( you may be able to tell that its something i feel very strongly about...maybe its because im a nurse!)

Why anyone would want to inflict unnecessary pain on their little babies is beyond my comprehension...bizzarre! :confused: :confused:

We do do it to humans
 

How many of you had your sons circumcised?

Or, as I mentioned before, think nothing of having a young daughter's ears pierced?

I agree. :thumbup: I noticed the dogs were whining just as much when they were measuring the tail than when they actually cut it. :rolleyes:

I actually have had several pups who never even woke up when the tails were docked. The reason it's done at such an early age is because the circulation and nerve activity is not yet funtioning fully. Of course, it can still be a painful procedure if the one performing it doesn't know what they are doing, go figure.

As with every other time this subject comes up, I like to sit back and wait for the Europe/USA comparisons and insinuations of how barbaric and inhumane we are here. I'm surprised the thread went as far as it did before it came about this time.:p

It's done when the pup is only a few days old. At that point (in the majority of cases) the puppies have not be choseen by or placed with the new/future owners, so it would make it impossible to request of the breeder that the tail be left intact....so I'm confused at how that is "wrong." :confused: I guess the option would be if you are not supportive of the practice, get a dog from a breeder who doesn't dock...

My personal preference is a docked tail but I have two yorkies - Adie has her tail docked but Skeeter has his full tail. Both of them are as cute as can be. If you don't plan on showing your little one there is no need to dock the tail.

Or, if you're like me, begin taking deposits once you have an idea how many puppies your female should have and upon taking those deposits, take requests on tails. Not removing the dew claws in not an option.
It's my personal preference to dock, tattoo and in the case of little boys...circumsise.

To each his own! It's an age old act done with modern medicine touch.
If you don't agree with this being done, you've got a great idea to not buy.
Do know that my last two BRTs came from the Ukraine and both had their tails docked there. Veterinarians are teaching breeders how to do the procedure at home. It's NOT illegal for them to do this. Wouldn't you rather it me made legal again and veterinarians were permitted to do the procedure at a clean medical facility instead?

do you think spaying is wrong too!?!

I think the op does, I do believe in a earlier post that I read last night, her family didnt believe in unnessary surgery and spaying in thier eyes was unnessacary. :rolleyes: however I could be wrong??

I had a choice as to whether or not my little guy's tail was docked and I choose to have it done and he isnt even full bred. He had it done at 3 days old, never cried and didnt have issues after. Its a personal preference and if you choose to keep your pets tail then do it.. dont call those barbaric for wanting it done, its the standard of the breed and those who breed to the standard and show thier dogs dont have a choice.

no spaying is a health thing so I think it's ok..but I made a mistake in watching all the videos and I know now that I shouldn't have ..I just don't want you to do the same mistake as me

no the lady's family didn't believe in spaying..the one were buying the puppy from

Of course , they don't believe in spaying , if they do they wouldn't be able to have $$$$$$$$

[quote=hugz4all4;2392526

.. dont call those barbaric for wanting it done, its the standard of the breed and those who breed to the standard and show thier dogs dont have a choice.[/quote]

as its a discussion forum, i think i have as much right to call it barbaric as you do to call it ok. We are never going to agree on it i guess...but i still dont think its right! :thumbdown
:aimeeyork..please dont dock my tail..i like to wag it when im pleased to see you.

Well, I am of the other opinion. Like I said, my puppies only cry for about a minute or less, period!! Most cry at first before any docking is even done. I think its because of the holding part. Its also barbaric to burn goat horns, dock lambs tails, circumsize baby boys and have babies ears pierced.But there is a reason for all of this except for the ear piercing. Ever see a dead goat tangled up in a fence because they got there horns caught up in it? Ever see blow flies in a lambs butt hole because the tail was not docked? Ever see a human baby scream for hours after they got their ears pierced?

:2popkorn:

I will be docking Lilly's pups when she has a litter. If it weren't the standard, I would not. If someone were to prepurchase I would not dock their puppy, but their money would be nonrefundable.
I also circ'd my boys and pierced my girls' ears, I'm just barbaric like that. I even declawed my cat. I am very thankful to live in my free country.

My Yorkies have absolutely no problem communicating and there tails are docked.

Exactly. I have goats, we had to have them dehorned because they are in 4-H. My vet was very kind and put them under to dehorn them. When they came to, it was like nothing ever happened, and its for their benefit. Our 4-H leader breeds sheep. She explained why they need their tails docked, and it is a very good reason. I think that sometimes we forget that animals are not people, and that docking a tail or dehorning is not like having a leg amputated on your child.

So because your dog's have their tails, they fight less? My yorkies have never fought and they are docked. I would like to know how a dog with a tail can communicate better than one with a shorter tail, morse code? I am sorry, but I do not see the truth to that argument. My shih-tzus have tails and I see no difference in communication.
If someone want's a tail long or short, I don't really care, but I do not think that it is detrimental at all to shorten it.

Ha ha ha ha!
As a family full of nubs and curly tails that are up and out of the way, I just laughed when I read some of these posts.
NUBBY tails are SO expressive! Perhaps even more exaggrated that a full tail! Sometimes the butt even gets in a sarcastic mood and helps further exaggerate their mood.

I also think it should be mentioned that you can, and I have, shown Yorkies WITH full tails. I simply prefer not to. Same with my BRTs.

tails
 

I say leave the tail. Like most of the people stated, it's a natural part of their body. I wish my Yorkie had his tail. I think it would be cute:animal-pa