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Old 01-14-2006, 10:15 AM   #1
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Confused how little is to little

my sister has a yorkie that is about 4lbs. she wants to breed her so she has a puppy from her. dou all think it's safe? if it's safe, what size yorkie do you suggest she breed with?
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Old 01-14-2006, 10:25 AM   #2
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I am not a breeder but I hope a breeder sees and replys to your post. I have always heard the female should be at least 5 lbs to breed and the male should be smaller than the female.
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Old 01-14-2006, 10:31 AM   #3
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Do your sister a favor and click on the search button here on YT and type in breeding tinies. Maybe if you show your sister these articles and also what goes into breeding she will have second thoughts. Breeding is not a one time adventure to get another dog as any time can be dangerous for these little ones. Alot of testing needs to be done to be sure the female can handle having a litter along with many expensive tests that need to be done on the puppies. I would hate to have your sister lose her baby because she didn't know the risks.

It is excellent that you are asking the question and using the search link will give you lots of answers.
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Old 01-14-2006, 10:36 AM   #4
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I agree with the posts above. I am not a breeder, but I do know that breeding is very risky to the mother and the puppies, especially if she is under 5 lbs. I suggest that you take livingdustmops advice and do a search. Show your sister all that goes into breeding and make sure she knows about all of the expenses and risks. I hope this post helped you out a little bit.
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Old 01-14-2006, 11:22 AM   #5
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anything under 5lbs is at much higher risk, there are several threads here on YT addressing this issue here is a heart felt thread because she bred her tiny girl and lost her and most of her litter http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27086
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Old 01-14-2006, 05:09 PM   #6
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I am not a breeder but I have done a lot of research in this area and I would say the bigger the female the more you reduce the risk of "dystocia" or difficulty in delivery.

There have been studies done to suggest that small breed dogs already have a greater risk of death or serious injury or illness to the breeding female than most breeds of dogs and yorkshire terriers are even more prone to problems.... so a person who seriously considers breeding must do a lot of research and study very hard and have any prospective females evaluated thoroughly by a reproductive specalist before even considering a mating.

The studies I have read also suggest that there is a higher incidence of problems in females that are smaller than the breed average. The breed average for yorkies is 5 to 7 lbs if I am not mistaken so a beginner breeder should never attempt to breed anything smaller than 5 lbs in my opinion with 6 or 7 lbs being better. You should only do this after much research and under the guidance of an experienced and reputable yorkie breeder mentor who will be there to assist at the whelping.

IMO only the very experienced breeder under the guidance of a reproductive specialist should attempt to breed a yorkie under four pounds and no female under 4 lbs should be bred at all imo.
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Old 01-14-2006, 05:23 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalyorkiLvr
I am not a breeder but I have done a lot of research in this area and I would say the bigger the female the more you reduce the risk of "dystocia" or difficulty in delivery.

There have been studies done to suggest that small breed dogs already have a greater risk of death or serious injury or illness to the breeding female than most breeds of dogs and yorkshire terriers are even more prone to problems.... so a person who seriously considers breeding must do a lot of research and study very hard and have any prospective females evaluated thoroughly by a reproductive specalist before even considering a mating.

The studies I have read also suggest that there is a higher incidence of problems in females that are smaller than the breed average. The breed average for yorkies is 5 to 7 lbs if I am not mistaken so a beginner breeder should never attempt to breed anything smaller than 5 lbs in my opinion with 6 or 7 lbs being better. You should only do this after much research and under the guidance of an experienced and reputable yorkie breeder mentor who will be there to assist at the whelping.

IMO only the very experienced breeder under the guidance of a reproductive specialist should attempt to breed a yorkie under four pounds and no female under 4 lbs should be bred at all imo.
Can you please post the links to these studies? I know of no breed specific (yorkshire Terrier) studies published that validate your posts.
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Old 01-14-2006, 05:49 PM   #8
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Sure...I had already referenced the citation in two other posts today in different threads so I didn't do it here, but I found this when we were researching the risk of breeding the female yorkie, but I was able to post it in that a thread as the thread was closed before I could do so.

The survey is cited and some of the results are presented in "table" or graph form on page 148 of this veterinary article on dydtocia.
http://www.intl.elsevierhealth.com/e-books/pdf/974.pdf
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Old 01-14-2006, 06:07 PM   #9
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I don't understand the use of the term "breed standard" with the quote of 5-7 pounds. If I read the standard correctly, the standard is to 7 pounds as adult. Are you using the term in a different context? I have not read the other posts so if you have answered this question just refer me back to the post.
I read and see a lot of opinions stated by authors-I am not referring to the originator of this post as I do not know her or where she finds her search results, so do not take this personally. I am saying that many times when I have read results of some search it ends up being little more than the opinion or translation of the data of the author.
I have known and continue to have very well known friends/breeders and it seems we can have as many opinions about some of these "facts" as we have numbers of breeders discussing the reports.
The current differing opinions about PSS that is being discussed now is one example that comes to mind. These things can be very disconcerting to responsible breeders, handlers and owners. I hope I have not gone too far off topic but to me so many facets of breeding and caring for our breed are intertwined.
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Old 01-14-2006, 06:13 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whispersmom2
I don't understand the use of the term "breed standard" with the quote of 5-7 pounds. If I read the standard correctly, the standard is to 7 pounds as adult. Are you using the term in a different context? I have not read the other posts so if you have answered this question just refer me back to the post.
I read and see a lot of opinions stated by authors-I am not referring to the originator of this post as I do not know her or where she finds her search results, so do not take this personally. I am saying that many times when I have read results of some search it ends up being little more than the opinion or translation of the data of the author.
I have known and continue to have very well known friends/breeders and it seems we can have as many opinions about some of these "facts" as we have numbers of breeders discussing the reports.
The current differing opinions about PSS that is being discussed now is one example that comes to mind. These things can be very disconcerting to responsible breeders, handlers and owners. I hope I have not gone too far off topic but to me so many facets of breeding and caring for our breed are intertwined.
I used the term "breed average" when referring to the weight of the dog...not "breed standard". The veterinary survey I referenced mentioned that 26% of the dogs who had dystocia were "under the breed average" in weight. This supports the idea that it is riskier to breed smaller than average yorkies.

While the breed standard for weight is "up to 7 lbs", the "breed average" weight for the yorkie is around 5 to 7 lbs I believe. Is this correct?

What is PSS?
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Old 01-14-2006, 06:20 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalyorkiLvr
Sure...I had already referenced the citation in two other posts today in different threads so I didn't do it here, but I found this when we were researching the risk of breeding the female yorkie, but I was able to post it in that a thread as the thread was closed before I could do so.

The survey is cited and some of the results are presented in "table" or graph form on page 148 of this veterinary article on dydtocia.
http://www.intl.elsevierhealth.com/e-books/pdf/974.pdf
This is what I posted in another thread earlier to day:

Small breed dogs in particular seem to have a greater risk and problem with dystocia than other breeds. There is a survey on dytocia dicussed in this article done in South Wales and it was conducted in 12 veterinary practices. Of the 265 cases of dystocia 26% were yorkies, 8% were jack russell and 8% were welsh corgies. The only problem with the accuracy of the survey is that there was no information as to the numbers of these different breeds in the general dog population of the area so there may have just been more yorkies there.

In any case, the experinced breeders on here and elsewhere will tell you that there is a high risk to breeding any yorkie female so it is very important if and when you decide to think seriously about breeding any female that you do everything posssible to minimize this risk.
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Old 01-14-2006, 06:32 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalyorkiLvr
Sure...I had already referenced the citation in two other posts today in different threads so I didn't do it here, but I found this when we were researching the risk of breeding the female yorkie, but I was able to post it in that a thread as the thread was closed before I could do so.

The survey is cited and some of the results are presented in "table" or graph form on page 148 of this veterinary article on dydtocia.
http://www.intl.elsevierhealth.com/e-books/pdf/974.pdf
where are you citing all your other information from? breed average for example is merely not to exceed 7lbs it is not written anywhere breed average 5-7lbs

here is another with far less stats on dystocia
http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:e...+terrier&hl=en
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Old 01-14-2006, 06:37 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by feminvstr
where are you citing all your other information from? breed average for example is merely not to exceed 7lbs it is not written anywhere breed average 5-7lbs

here is another with far less stats on dystocia
http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:e...+terrier&hl=en
I have been researching Maltese lately, and I know that they have a best at 4 1/2-6lbs...However, I've never seen that as far a yorkies go..Everywhere I've been that catered to Yorkies be it, shady or reputable...is say's to not exceed 7 pounds..In fact that particular quote has been quoted to me often here!

Edited...I think I am mistaken again...
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Last edited by PlatinumYorkies; 01-14-2006 at 06:40 PM.
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Old 01-14-2006, 06:40 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by feminvstr
where are you citing all your other information from? breed average for example is merely not to exceed 7lbs it is not written anywhere breed average 5-7lbs

here is another with far less stats on dystocia
http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:e...+terrier&hl=en
"breed standard" weight and "breed average" weight are not synonymous and I have no source for the fact that the "breed average" is 5-7 except that that is what I have read here which is why I said

"is this correct?"
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Old 01-14-2006, 06:48 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalyorkiLvr
"breed standard" weight and "breed average" weight are not synonymous and I have no source for the fact that the "breed average" is 5-7 except that that is what I have read here which is why I said

"is this correct?"
I knew that "breed average" sounded familiar to me..The only place I've seen that is in my Yorkies for Dummies book..here is that exact quote from their website!!!
"Compact and well-proportioned stature: Size and body structure matter. The breed standard stipulates that Yorkies must not be over 7 pounds and, on average, adult Yorkies fall between a petite 57 pounds. (Remember, however, that some Yorkies are smaller and some are larger.) In terms of body structure, everything should be in proportion and just, well, fit."

It doesn't quite say breed average..but I guess this is what you mean, Kim..HUH?
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