Bleeding and breeding

[JeanieK]

Originally Posted by Marc

Question:

Just wondering about puppy weight gain and making sure mine are on a good path....

Pups were born Sunday at 11 in the evening...

Pup1 was 6.3 at birth and is now 7.8

Pup2 was 5.6 at birth and is now 7.5

Those were some good sized puppies. Lookls like they are doing well.

[JeanieK]

Originally Posted by Marc

And is it normal for such rapid growth rate in the first week or so? Should I expect that rate to slow down and if so around what week does the rate slow down?

EDIT: Oh, I was also going to update on the tea leaf thing! It went VERY good. First round of half a cup produced heavy panting and pushes producing a glob of normal discharge stuff. Did the second round and she had no pysical reaction which indicates she is clear She is picky about her eating but comes OFTEN to the kitchen to get whatever it is I make for her

Pups go for tails/claws tomorrow. Is there a general rule for length of tail? Keep all brown and a 1/4 inch of black? By the looks of that you are cutting exactly half the black off, no?

The rate will pick up before it slows down. Mine usually pick up speed the second to where they are gaining almost an ounce a day, and then it slows way down the third week.

I leave the tail length up to the vet. He knows what he is doing.

[Marc]

Goodness. My little porky boys are now 10 ounces! On sunday they will be a week old. Are these early puppy weights any indication that they are going to be huge adults? Or no.....

Mom and dad are both 5 pounds pretty much even.

[Mardelin]

Originally Posted by Marc

Goodness. My little porky boys are now 10 ounces! On sunday they will be a week old. Are these early puppy weights any indication that they are going to be huge adults? Or no.....

Mom and dad are both 5 pounds pretty much even.

No, this is an indication that mother's milk is good and they are just milk fat. While mom and dad's genetic make-up figure into your puppies sizes. So do there grand and great grand parents.......

You'll see a lot changes in weights and sizes within the next few weeks, months.......

I have a stud here that is 5 pounds on a good day and has the tendancy to produce his sire, more on the 7 pound range......

[delicatepuzzle]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

It's best to count from the day her heat started rather than trying to guess based on the appearance of blood. I am a big proponent of progesterone testing if you are unsure which days would be best.

I hope no one minds I ask questions. Instead of posting a new thread. How do you know what day she started on? I have a girl in heat (I wish I could just fix her but I got her on breeding terms ( I feel aweful that she can't play with my boys). She only "bled" for two days. That was a while ago, I should of recorded what date this was, BAD mommy!!! Her blood was brown discharge, that's normal right? She has been swollen for what feels like an eternity! When does the swelling in her private area go away? Should I just take her to the vet?

[Mardelin]

Originally Posted by delicatepuzzle

I hope no one minds I ask questions. Instead of posting a new thread. How do you know what day she started on? I have a girl in heat (I wish I could just fix her but I got her on breeding terms ( I feel aweful that she can't play with my boys). She only "bled" for two days. That was a while ago, I should of recorded what date this was, BAD mommy!!! Her blood was brown discharge, that's normal right? She has been swollen for what feels like an eternity! When does the swelling in her private area go away? Should I just take her to the vet?

Her heat cycle begins on the day she begins showing pickness and swelling. Very difficult to determine when her the first day of her cycle began. That is unless you are checking your girl everyday. That is why breeders usually begin the count from the onset of bleeding to determine when to breed.

I don't understand why you can't spay. Even though you obtain a breeding girl, the final decision on when to breed her is yours. The contract/registration gives you the option to breed, and usually doesn't mandate that you breed.

[carmen in nj]

Originally Posted by delicatepuzzle

I hope no one minds I ask questions. Instead of posting a new thread. How do you know what day she started on? I have a girl in heat (I wish I could just fix her but I got her on breeding terms ( I feel aweful that she can't play with my boys). She only "bled" for two days. That was a while ago, I should of recorded what date this was, BAD mommy!!! Her blood was brown discharge, that's normal right? She has been swollen for what feels like an eternity! When does the swelling in her private area go away? Should I just take her to the vet?

Mary is absolutely right, I also had purchase a yorkie girl under a breeding contract but she is mine and after I took her for all her testing I decided that what she had to offer was not what I was looking for so I had her spayed. I did contact my breeder and informed her of my decision since we are also friends. is really up to you to breed her or not and if you are not wanting any babies, have her spayed is better than an unwanted pregnancy that puts in danger the life of your precious girl.. I have a Very good experience stud in my home and did not want to chance it... usually he knows when my girls are coming into heat and he always picks the RIGHT day to mate, LOL ..
best of luck with your decision..
hugs,
Carmen in nj

[bjh]

Originally Posted by delicatepuzzle

I hope no one minds I ask questions. Instead of posting a new thread. How do you know what day she started on? I have a girl in heat (I wish I could just fix her but I got her on breeding terms ( I feel aweful that she can't play with my boys). She only "bled" for two days. That was a while ago, I should of recorded what date this was, BAD mommy!!! Her blood was brown discharge, that's normal right? She has been swollen for what feels like an eternity! When does the swelling in her private area go away? Should I just take her to the vet?

How long has she actually been in heat? The heat cycle should only last about 3 weeks but there are exceptions. It does seem to last forever. You don't want to make the mistake of putting her back with males too early because some females will accept a male 3 weeks or longer after the start of their heat cycle. Yes, it is important to record the date of her start of her heat cycle. Usually a female will start swelling a few days before the bleeding starts. I count the first day I see bleeding as the first day of the heat cycle. The brownish discharge does not seem normal to me. The discharge normally starts off red and then turns to a pinkish discharge. How old is this female and is this her first heat? I am assuming from your statement that you must have got her on a breeding contract where you have to give puppies back to the previous owner.

To answer your question about the swelling, normally after 3 weeks it starts going down and the discharge should stop. If it has been longer than 4 weeks then you might want to get the vet to check her. Some females have slit heats where they start to come in heat, then stop but a few weeks later the heat starts again. I have never experienced a split heat but I read of a few instances on here.

[delicatepuzzle]

Originally Posted by Mardelin

Her heat cycle begins on the day she begins showing pickness and swelling. Very difficult to determine when her the first day of her cycle began. That is unless you are checking your girl everyday. That is why breeders usually begin the count from the onset of bleeding to determine when to breed.

I don't understand why you can't spay. Even though you obtain a breeding girl, the final decision on when to breed her is yours. The contract/registration gives you the option to breed, and usually doesn't mandate that you breed.

Thanks for replying I know you are well versed in breeding. So here's the story behind how I got my baby girl. I had been searching for a chocolate yorkie (not to breed just to have) for about 3 years. I stumbled upon Ella a few times but only saw baby pictures so I figured if it was meant to be she'd be available in a month or two. And sure enough she was. Well long story short, I convinced the breeder to let me have her at a lowered price (MUCH lower than even her pet asking price) but I had to promise to responsibly breed her. At this point I'd be happy with fixing her, no papers or anything (since she is a biro/chocolate biewer I can't do anything show wise anyways. But the problem is that had not given the breeder a dime towards the puppy in 4months. So I feel guilty for asking her if we can terminate part of our agreement. Should I just pay her more for the pet price? She is an amazingly trusting WONDERFUL lady. She works with another lady and they breed biewers and other animals. They each own their own farm, it is gorgeous there (that's coming from a city girl).

When should I expect the swelling to go down? I felt her nipples today (I was just rubbing her belly when I noticed ...) some of the nipples were hardish mass in them. Is this normal? I feel so nervous. I've kept the boys as separate as I can. I NEVER leave them by themselves (always crated when I'm gone, not in the room someone boys or girl are crated). I have NEVER seen them tie.

[carmen in nj]

Originally Posted by delicatepuzzle

Thanks for replying I know you are well versed in breeding. So here's the story behind how I got my baby girl. I had been searching for a chocolate yorkie (not to breed just to have) for about 3 years. I stumbled upon Ella a few times but only saw baby pictures so I figured if it was meant to be she'd be available in a month or two. And sure enough she was. Well long story short, I convinced the breeder to let me have her at a lowered price (MUCH lower than even her pet asking price) but I had to promise to responsibly breed her. At this point I'd be happy with fixing her, no papers or anything (since she is a biro/chocolate biewer I can't do anything show wise anyways. But the problem is that had not given the breeder a dime towards the puppy in 4months. So I feel guilty for asking her if we can terminate part of our agreement. Should I just pay her more for the pet price? She is an amazingly trusting WONDERFUL lady. She works with another lady and they breed biewers and other animals. They each own their own farm, it is gorgeous there (that's coming from a city girl).

When should I expect the swelling to go down? I felt her nipples today (I was just rubbing her belly when I noticed ...) some of the nipples were hardish mass in them. Is this normal? I feel so nervous. I've kept the boys as separate as I can. I NEVER leave them by themselves (always crated when I'm gone, not in the room someone boys or girl are crated). I have NEVER seen them tie.

oh wow, ok, If I was you and I had the money I would just give her the rest of the money, but then again that is up to you. like my mentor loves to say..." A tie not always means pregnancy and a pregnancy is not always from a tie" so IF and I mean IF any doubt I would have her check by a vet. is so many little tiny details in nature that I never leave anything to chance.. I noticed my girls teats look a bit like you discribe when they are pregnant, then again a false pregnancy can bring in all the symptoms too..
hugs,
Carmen in nj

[delicatepuzzle]

Originally Posted by carmen in nj

oh wow, ok, If I was you and I had the money I would just give her the rest of the money, but then again that is up to you. like my mentor loves to say..." A tie not always means pregnancy and a pregnancy is not always from a tie" so IF and I mean IF any doubt I would have her check by a vet. is so many little tiny details in nature that I never leave anything to chance.. I noticed my girls teats look a bit like you discribe when they are pregnant, then again a false pregnancy can bring in all the symptoms too..
hugs,
Carmen in nj

Its good to know that I'm not just freaking out! I'm going to take her to the vet!! I'm getting my eldest boy neutered tomorrow. I wish I had the money to just pay her but I had to take out a loan to pay her the original amount.

[carmen in nj]

Originally Posted by delicatepuzzle

Its good to know that I'm not just freaking out! I'm going to take her to the vet!! I'm getting my eldest boy neutered tomorrow. I wish I had the money to just pay her but I had to take out a loan to pay her the original amount.

oh I understand, I remember paying a loan for my stud, but i HAD to have him...LOL he is the light of my eyes.. and he is getting close to retiring age, so I am starting to feel it.... congrats on having your boy neutered, that way you don't have to worry constantly. I am like a hawk with my girls and my stud, and believe me more than once he has surprised me by courting the girls right at the very begining of their cycle.
that is when he goes home to grandma..LOL

[delicatepuzzle]

After going back through some emails, I have determined that the first day I noticed the brown discharge (similar to what human's first menses looks like) about 3 weeks 2 days ago (max 4 weeks ago). I took some pictures of her nipples. I hope they come out good enough to see. Her stomach is no bigger than normal, it is just the nipples and her vulva that are swollen. The nipples themselves have not changed in size it is the tissue beneath the nipple. She looks like she has little boobs. I am a new mommy to a girl ... I am used to leg lifters. (which I just wanted to add, has been scheduled to be neutered tomorrow).

Ok here are the pictures, please do not laugh too hard at how foolish I might be. I'm just so nervous I don't want anything to happen to my baby, and it drives me nuts that I entered into a breeding contract. If I had the money I'd pay it to her in a heartbeat.

[delicatepuzzle]

Heres the other one.

[Marc]

Update:

So mom and the boys are doing just great! Mom is back to eating her puppy food without me having to get fancy....and the boys are growing like weeds! They are two weeks old today and I think they are around 17 or 18 ounces. One's eyes opened today and the other are still closed. I am looking forward to the weeks to come!