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[QUOTE=JeanieK;2446313]Pruett had made that statement, (apparently not too nicely) in t he post that was deleted. I specified that in the post. although since she is not around to defend herself, maybe someone else will explain. which registries they are registered in (and you can't just make up your own registry). I am referring to the all breed registries such as the AKC and the CKC. I just went back over the post that was deleted and there is absolutely NO mention of registries. Please go back over the post in your inbox. If you do a little more research you will see that all of the Biewer clubs have their own registries which is very important and a neccessity in order to keep your records and stud books. |
And to reply to my own post... It's my understanding about a dozen genes have been identified that control eye color in humans. It's very rare for a physical trait to have just ONE controlling gene, though it is possible. It seems to me that coloring in dogs is too varied to be controlled by just one gene. |
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I thought the genes concerning the eye included such things as depth of color or amount of color, besides the actual color. In other words, two people could have the BB gene for blue eyes, but on one it, would be a much darker blue and another could have a pale pale blue. Lighter colors again, are always recessive. Are you sure the other genes aren't referring to other traits of the eyes such as shape etc? I haven't read any recent research, but would love any links you could send me. The reason I thought there was only one gene responsible for the parti color are the statistics given when two parti carriers mate. They say that there is a one in 4 chance, so this would mean one gene is involved, and each parent has to give one recessive trait to the offspring for the results to be seen. If more then one gene were involved the changes of having a parti, would be greatly reduced. In the case where both parents are Parti's and actually displaying the trait, there is 100 percent chance of the trait being displayed in the offspring, this again indicates only one gene is responsible for the results. |
There is" Not ONE"Yorkshire Terrier club in Germany ,that recognize the Biewer Yorkshire Terrier as a Yorkshire Terrier and this after 25 years in the country of it's origin.The VDH to this day will ban any Yorkshire Terrier Breeder from registering with them, if they also are breeding Biewer Yorkshire Terriers a la pom pon.Nobody has ever fought to get the Biewer recognized as a Yorkshire Terrier in Germany.You call them ,and they will tell you the Biewer Yorkshire Terrier a la Pom pon is a Mischling (mixed Breed).Dagmar took over an existing Yorkshire terrier club and started the IBC.The IBC is run by one person and has no backing from any other Yorkie club.Independent all Breed registries started in later years, to register the Biewer Yorkshire Terrier a la Pom pon also.If you truly believe that the Biewer Yorkshire Terrier a la pom pon ,that was bred by Mr. and Mrs. Biewer, is the same thing ,that has been send over here in the last 6 years ,you are sadly mistaken. |
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I see no need to do the mars testing because they are from a line that was extensively DNA'd, by the AKC, as far back as they could go and were satisfied that they were yorkies. I trust the breeder that I bought them from. I see no point in trying to prove something that all the involved parties already agree on. The mars testing is not designed to determine purebred dogs, by their own admission, and I believe that the testing is too new to put too much faith in. |
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With BTRA registry both parents are required to be DNA tested in order to register the litters. Funny about what you say that Mars says since the BTCA submitted only one AKC registered yorkie to be tested, it came back as a purebred yorkie in the yorkie cluster and not amongst the Biewers. Hmmmmm |
Jeanie K, If Mars, per your statement, can not detect a purebred,why would we believe that Susan Williams tested Biewer is a pure Yorkie???? |
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I am not talking about the breed club registries, I am talking about the all breed registries like the AKC. I know they are not registered with the AKC, but like the CKC or the various other smaller all breed registries. |
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Why can't this test detect purebreds? Is Mars Veterinary worried about lawsuits? The WISDOM Panel™ MX test was designed to determine the breed makeup of mixed-breed dogs. Its development involved the analyses of more than 19 million DNA markers from more than 13,000 purebred and mixed-breed dogs to best tell breeds in a mixed-breed dog apart. In order to determine if a dog is a purebred, Mars Veterinary would ideally need DNA samples that cover all family lines for each breed of purebred dog. But since their focus was the development of a test capable of accurately determining the breeds in a mixed-breed dog, they did not focus on collecting such a catalogue of purebred dog DNA samples. |
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For the second part of your question, I think when attempting to start a new breed there are only breed club registries, and for Biewers there are three in United States at this time, and one in Canada. In the US, there is the BTCA, the BBCA, and the BYTCA, and in Canada it's the BBCC. I hope this is right. |
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And none of it really matters to me since all parties concerned, the breeder, me, and the KC, all agree that the parti colored yorkies are purebred yorkshire terriers. If it matters to someone else, then let then test theirs. Can you imagine the pandoras box that would be opened if every existing Champion show dog was required to be tested. If they want to extablish this pratice in the future that is fine. but sometimes it is best to let sleeping dogs lie, or there might be a lot of expert judges standing around with egg on their face. |
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So I am asking, what are they registered as? So do you care to share wsith us what Pruett said in her deleted post. I did not see it. I was told that she said she did not like to repeat herself, and that they were registered as Biewer yorkshire terriers. that is all I know. |
BTRA is going into the 4 th Generation of DNA ed and Mars tested Biewer Terriers .Why on earth, would we want to register our dogs with something like CKC ,that requires a picture and some money to register.I have not seen a Yorkiebreeder that registers with CKC unless they lost their AKC privilege or is registering limited marked AKC puppies for breeding. |
JeanieK, thank you for the info on genes. What you say would indicate that parti coloring is controlled by one gene, so there you go, I learned something. To be honest, the eye color thing was something I learned in biology long ago, so I am not up to date on the latest research. I do believe it was just eye color, though. For instance (based on this long ago biology class), I learned that many Celts have a dominant blue-eyed gene, which is clearly not the case in most ethnicities. Off topic and not backed up, but I thought it was interesting. Anyhoo, thanks again. |
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Somewhere back in this thread, someone said they were trying to breed partis and had been unsuccessful in breeding this color. I would think if this was clearly one recessive gene, it would be easy to get partis, no? Wouldn't you just take two partis, or two dogs that have produced parti pups? Did I misunderstand something? |
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The BTCA does also register its dogs with ARBA. ARBA is recognized by a number of creditable dog organizations in America. ARBA also recognizes the BTCA as the parent club for the breed. What you keep referring to on the Mars page is the blanket statement they make to the general public, it does not reflect the intricate work that they are doing with the BTCA. |
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If you breed two Biewers together you will always get all Biewers unless one of them has a Biewer looking splitter for a parent. |
Sure, and I'm not challenging you, because clearly you know a lot about this. I'm trying to understand better. Breeding dogs generally have many more children that people, so statistically, you should tend to the norm. It's one thing to have all three of your children be boys, but to have all dozen of your children be male would be very uncommon. It would seem to me that it would be pretty easy to produce partis if you want them. Do you know the post I'm referring to where someone said she was trying to produce partis but hadn't seen one yet? |
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But yes if you have two partis, you will get parties, recessive genes always breed true. However if you have a parti and a carrier, the odds are 50 50. so since i'm not getting any someone else must be getting 100%. LOL |
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JeanieK, Did you personally speak with the Mars people? Does anyone have any pictures of the Partis as puppies? I have never seen them. |
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Yes it is pretty easy to produce Partis if you want them, all you have to do is breed two Partis together. Some breeders are breeding "carriers" and the odds become 1 in four it will be a Parti. Some people probably are breeding what they think to be carriers, but are just regular yorkies. Remember the odds of producing a regular yorkie when you mate carriers together are also one in four. I'm not sure how they would know he's a carrier, unless the dog has produced a Parti before. |
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