I Am Thinking Of Breeding - Page 4 - YorkieTalk.com Forums

wnalegria · 08-14-2005, 03:31 PM

We keep going back to the same old sack of bones. I want to breed my dog- come hell or high water. I do not care what the results are- it is my God given right. Yep you are right. It is your right. Go right ahead and breed LP's
Bad bites and liver shunts go the gambit. Can you can lay your head down an night and be proud of what you have done.

When there is a problem with the puppy you knowingly breed and her grandchildren two generations later or more have severe problems you can hold your head up high and say Yes that was my contribution to the breed. I am so proud of what heartache I have caused to the offspring and to the owners of these dogs.

There are posts on this forum daily where the breeder gets blamed for the problems that a person had medically, physically and emotionally with a dog that they purchased every day. Some are legit some are a pile of horse manure.

People who state I am not wanting to show so that I don't have to follow the standard are just making excuses. Some of us have made the comment that the perfect dog does not exist- that is being thown around as a catch all to make it ok for your bad judgement. Some of you would not know a quality YT if it bit you on the ankle. If you are not part of the solution you are part of the problem. Should you be listed as a bad breeder on the bad breeder sites because you know what you are doing is wrong in breeding dogs that have faults that cause a health issue. If I am tweeking color/coat texture
size of the ears- or wanting a get out and go show attitude in my breeding program I am not causing any health issues. I can go to sleep at night and not worry have I done if I have done the right thing.

Wolftrap · 08-14-2005, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Olivier

How old is Coco ? Do you have a picture of her ?

Coco just turned 9 months old. Here is a picture of her. This is when she had her first heat. So she has her jean diaper on.

Wolftrap · 08-14-2005, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bkessler

I just have a question.. Do you have experience breeding?? If not, why do you want to breed her?? People are telling me I should breed Lily Mae because of her temperment and personality but i feel since I have no experience breeding and because I want to keep her as my family pet, i said no way... I just think the risks are way too high... i hope I am not offending you, I just was courious to know why you would want to breed your baby.. If you decide to do it, please do plenty of reseach and really make sure you know what you are doing, as i would not want you to lose your baby

No I do not have experience breeding but like everyone else I have to start somewhere. I have done a lot of research and before I even make a decision I am going to do PLENTY of more research before I subject my baby to this. I would not go into this blindly or take it lightly if this is what I decided to do. I have spoken to more than one vet that has said they did not see a problem with her being bred and I have asked a TON of questions. I have also been told by others that she would be good to breed because of her temperment. She is the sweetest most friendly dog and catches on to everything very quickly. I had NO problems training her at all as I know some say the breed is hard to train and from reading on here and meeting people with yorkies there are some that have 2 year olds that are still not trained. She is playful and is not afraid of strangers or other dogs

Yorkieville200 · 08-14-2005, 04:01 PM

As a Yorkie owner, I want to say "thank you" to the reputable breeders in this forum that continue to try to explain to all these "breeder wannabes" the importance of breeding to the standard. There is a standard for a reason. If you don't like the Yorkie standard, don't breed. Period.

Personally, I have bought each of my Yorkies from reputable breeders, that strive to breed to the standard. No, my Yorkies are not perfect, but they are beautiful and more importantly, they're healthy, thanks to their breeders.

I think, there are an awful lot of Yorkies in rescue, because people look at the pictures of the Yorkie, and when the dog doesn't measure up, they're disappointed. If you want a quality Yorkie, you have to go to a quality breeder.

I applaud the breeders in this forum that continue to "try" to educate us.

I don't breed. It's hard work, lots of education, research, and bucket loads of tears. (and extremely expensive!!!)

We set a high bar for breeders. We expect so much of them, but when they try to help us, we criticize. Not fair.

These are living beings that are being brought into the world. Does anyone really want to risk a health defect, just to breed their pet, once?

One of my Yorkies is show quality. The owner of her sire tried to convince me to breed her years ago. I declined because I just didn't feel I had enough knowledge. I was afraid to risk her or her babies.

I've had Yorkies for over 25 years, and I still continue to learn.

I hope the breeders in this forum won't give up on us.

Sheila

P.S. Kathy, my dad used to say (many) years ago, when I was growing up, "If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem." You brought back some fond memories in your post.

txshopper73 · 08-14-2005, 04:39 PM

[QUOTE=feminvstr]
Topline
Teeth
Temperment...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolftrap

"I have also been told by others that she would be good to breed because of her temperment."

There's more to a good yorkie besides tempermant. Kim listed only 3. I wouldn't breed just because my yorkie was friendly with everyone.

bkessler · 08-14-2005, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolftrap

No I do not have experience breeding but like everyone else I have to start somewhere. I have done a lot of research and before I even make a decision I am going to do PLENTY of more research before I subject my baby to this. I would not go into this blindly or take it lightly if this is what I decided to do. I have spoken to more than one vet that has said they did not see a problem with her being bred and I have asked a TON of questions. I have also been told by others that she would be good to breed because of her temperment. She is the sweetest most friendly dog and catches on to everything very quickly. I had NO problems training her at all as I know some say the breed is hard to train and from reading on here and meeting people with yorkies there are some that have 2 year olds that are still not trained. She is playful and is not afraid of strangers or other dogs

I just want to say, Coco is BEAUTIFUL!! She is precious!! I also want to commend you for doing all of your research before attempting to breed.. I hope I didn't start controversey but I just wanted to make sure.. In my eyes, you seem like you really care about your baby and want her to be happy... Good luck with whatever you decide to do

SoCalyorkiLvr · 08-14-2005, 06:06 PM

The one and only "reason" the YTCA breed standard exists is for people who care about showing. The "standard" calls for docked tails which I find cruel. The standard says they have to be black and tan or some variation thereof,.... I have a parti-color yorkie who came from "standard" parents and she no less of a yorkie than those that are the "standard" color. Breeders used to "cull" perfectly healthy puppies for being the wrong color according to the standard. For me that is wrong. The YTCA kicked Terri Schumsky out of the organization. The YTCA does not allow its members to be members of "pet" forums and they shun "pet" owners and anyone who is trying to gwt into breeding or showing and on and on and on.

I do not believe that anyone on here was condoning or advocating "breeding anything to anything" and not attempting to eliminate the genetic defects and other health characterisitics that it is possible to control. There are plenty of reputable breeders who do not hold strictly to the standard....they may not dock tails, they may breed parti colors or chocolates or they may like the short short snout, but that does not make them bad or in any way inferior to YTCA breeders. This is my only point.

This member has a female with a very "slight" underbite and her vet has advised her that it would be okay for her to breed her to produce pet yorkies. He or she obviouly does not feel the "fault" is a life altering one. Where is the crime?

Yorkie_Mama · 08-14-2005, 06:06 PM

People in this area know that i have breed Ta for years and call on me to help them Whelp a 11 yo boy called me about 5 months ago he breed his stud who was out of my lines to a girl dog with a crooked tooth slight set up bited with out consulting me 3 puppies had to be rushed to the vet that day to be put down.... if you can do this take the chance that the two gene pools your pulling from have mouth "bite flaws" some under bites are so extreem that the puppie has to be put down and if some are minor there should be a spay nut contract with them the more you breed the falut the more chances of puppies being put to sleep .. i know this sounds like a huge maby but im crying while writing this and that little boy is scard for a long time the bitch was fixed as soon as possible so this horror never happend again

Olivier · 08-14-2005, 06:10 PM

Why do peoples asked questions if they already know the answers ?

txshopper73 · 08-14-2005, 06:11 PM

Think about it this way. Coco has a slight underbite. The breeder gets a male or studs out. You don't exactly know what the stud dog has in his lines. Could be that his great grandfather had a slight underbite. Coco has her litter and maybe the litter will be fine or maybe she'll produce a pup that has an underbite that is so bad the pup will never be able to live a healthy life. As someone mentioned earlier, the bite won't get better, it will only get worse with generation after generation.

There is a breeder here in town that has bred her bitch with a slight underbite and I would never buy a pup from her. It is an obvious fault and cannot improve only get worse.

sylvan · 08-14-2005, 06:11 PM

If you are committed to becoming a yorkshire breeder I am sure there are many people on this forum who will be more than glad to help you locate a suitable female that is a good example of the standard. I would be happy to do what ever I can to help in any way.

SoCalyorkiLvr · 08-14-2005, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yorkie_Mama

People in this area know that i have breed Ta for years and call on me to help them Whelp a 11 yo boy called me about 5 months ago he breed his stud who was out of my lines to a girl dog with a crooked tooth slight set up bited with out consulting me 3 puppies had to be rushed to the vet that day to be put down.... if you can do this take the chance that the two gene pools your pulling from have mouth "bite flaws" some under bites are so extreem that the puppie has to be put down and if some are minor there should be a spay nut contract with them the more you breed the falut the more chances of puppies being put to sleep .. i know this sounds like a huge maby but im crying while writing this and that little boy is scard for a long time the bitch was fixed as soon as possible so this horror never happend again

What does that mean?

This is not an "extreme" case. This is very slight as the owner stated. I would never think anyone on here would breed a dog with a severe or extreme bite problem.

SoCalyorkiLvr · 08-14-2005, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by txshopper73

Think about it this way. Coco has a slight underbite. The breeder gets a male or studs out. You don't exactly know what the stud dog has in his lines. Could be that his great grandfather had a slight underbite. Coco has her litter and maybe the litter will be fine or maybe she'll produce a pup that has an underbite that is so bad the pup will never be able to live a healthy life. As someone mentioned earlier, the bite won't get better, it will only get worse with generation after generation.

There is a breeder here in town that has bred her bitch with a slight underbite and I would never buy a pup from her. It is an obvious fault and cannot improve only get worse.

My hypothetical included only a situation where she bred to a male who did not have the recessive gene for underbite in his DNA. I would never breed the dog under the circumstances you just outlined. That would be too risky.

SoCalyorkiLvr · 08-14-2005, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Olivier

Why do peoples asked questions if they already know the answers ?

To learn from the differing viewpoints hopefully.

sylvan · 08-14-2005, 06:19 PM

[QUOTE=SoCalyorkiLvr]The one and only "reason" the YTCA breed standard exists is for people who care about showing. QUOTE]

Oh, I'm afraid that's not quite true. The standard for any purebred dog exists as a definition of what characteristics that breed of dog exemplifies. It is not just a 'club' description and not just for people who care about showing. It is what it is.

08-14-2005, 06:06 PM	#53
Yorkie_Mama YT 500 Club Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Chico,California Posts: 597	just some of my personal experince People in this area know that i have breed Ta for years and call on me to help them Whelp a 11 yo boy called me about 5 months ago he breed his stud who was out of my lines to a girl dog with a crooked tooth slight set up bited with out consulting me 3 puppies had to be rushed to the vet that day to be put down.... if you can do this take the chance that the two gene pools your pulling from have mouth "bite flaws" some under bites are so extreem that the puppie has to be put down and if some are minor there should be a spay nut contract with them the more you breed the falut the more chances of puppies being put to sleep .. i know this sounds like a huge maby but im crying while writing this and that little boy is scard for a long time the bitch was fixed as soon as possible so this horror never happend again

08-14-2005, 06:11 PM	#55
txshopper73 Donating YT 14K Club Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Texas Posts: 14,226 Blog Entries: 1	Think about it this way. Coco has a slight underbite. The breeder gets a male or studs out. You don't exactly know what the stud dog has in his lines. Could be that his great grandfather had a slight underbite. Coco has her litter and maybe the litter will be fine or maybe she'll produce a pup that has an underbite that is so bad the pup will never be able to live a healthy life. As someone mentioned earlier, the bite won't get better, it will only get worse with generation after generation. There is a breeder here in town that has bred her bitch with a slight underbite and I would never buy a pup from her. It is an obvious fault and cannot improve only get worse. __________________ As always...JMO (Just My Opinion) Kimberley

08-14-2005, 03:31 PM	#46
wnalegria Donating Senior Yorkie Talker Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Indianapolis Indiana Posts: 815	We keep going back to the same old sack of bones. I want to breed my dog- come hell or high water. I do not care what the results are- it is my God given right. Yep you are right. It is your right. Go right ahead and breed LP's Bad bites and liver shunts go the gambit. Can you can lay your head down an night and be proud of what you have done. When there is a problem with the puppy you knowingly breed and her grandchildren two generations later or more have severe problems you can hold your head up high and say Yes that was my contribution to the breed. I am so proud of what heartache I have caused to the offspring and to the owners of these dogs. There are posts on this forum daily where the breeder gets blamed for the problems that a person had medically, physically and emotionally with a dog that they purchased every day. Some are legit some are a pile of horse manure. People who state I am not wanting to show so that I don't have to follow the standard are just making excuses. Some of us have made the comment that the perfect dog does not exist- that is being thown around as a catch all to make it ok for your bad judgement. Some of you would not know a quality YT if it bit you on the ankle. If you are not part of the solution you are part of the problem. Should you be listed as a bad breeder on the bad breeder sites because you know what you are doing is wrong in breeding dogs that have faults that cause a health issue. If I am tweeking color/coat texture size of the ears- or wanting a get out and go show attitude in my breeding program I am not causing any health issues. I can go to sleep at night and not worry have I done if I have done the right thing.

08-14-2005, 04:01 PM	#49
Yorkieville200 YT 2000 Club Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: IL Posts: 2,179	As a Yorkie owner, I want to say "thank you" to the reputable breeders in this forum that continue to try to explain to all these "breeder wannabes" the importance of breeding to the standard. There is a standard for a reason. If you don't like the Yorkie standard, don't breed. Period. Personally, I have bought each of my Yorkies from reputable breeders, that strive to breed to the standard. No, my Yorkies are not perfect, but they are beautiful and more importantly, they're healthy, thanks to their breeders. I think, there are an awful lot of Yorkies in rescue, because people look at the pictures of the Yorkie, and when the dog doesn't measure up, they're disappointed. If you want a quality Yorkie, you have to go to a quality breeder. I applaud the breeders in this forum that continue to "try" to educate us. I don't breed. It's hard work, lots of education, research, and bucket loads of tears. (and extremely expensive!!!) We set a high bar for breeders. We expect so much of them, but when they try to help us, we criticize. Not fair. These are living beings that are being brought into the world. Does anyone really want to risk a health defect, just to breed their pet, once? One of my Yorkies is show quality. The owner of her sire tried to convince me to breed her years ago. I declined because I just didn't feel I had enough knowledge. I was afraid to risk her or her babies. I've had Yorkies for over 25 years, and I still continue to learn. I hope the breeders in this forum won't give up on us. Sheila P.S. Kathy, my dad used to say (many) years ago, when I was growing up, "If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem." You brought back some fond memories in your post.

08-14-2005, 06:06 PM	#52
SoCalyorkiLvr BANNED! Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 8,246	The one and only "reason" the YTCA breed standard exists is for people who care about showing. The "standard" calls for docked tails which I find cruel. The standard says they have to be black and tan or some variation thereof,.... I have a parti-color yorkie who came from "standard" parents and she no less of a yorkie than those that are the "standard" color. Breeders used to "cull" perfectly healthy puppies for being the wrong color according to the standard. For me that is wrong. The YTCA kicked Terri Schumsky out of the organization. The YTCA does not allow its members to be members of "pet" forums and they shun "pet" owners and anyone who is trying to gwt into breeding or showing and on and on and on. I do not believe that anyone on here was condoning or advocating "breeding anything to anything" and not attempting to eliminate the genetic defects and other health characterisitics that it is possible to control. There are plenty of reputable breeders who do not hold strictly to the standard....they may not dock tails, they may breed parti colors or chocolates or they may like the short short snout, but that does not make them bad or in any way inferior to YTCA breeders. This is my only point. This member has a female with a very "slight" underbite and her vet has advised her that it would be okay for her to breed her to produce pet yorkies. He or she obviouly does not feel the "fault" is a life altering one. Where is the crime?

08-14-2005, 06:10 PM	#54
Olivier Donating YT 2000 Club Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Canada Posts: 2,999	Why do peoples asked questions if they already know the answers ?

08-14-2005, 06:11 PM	#56
sylvan YT 2000 Club Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Eastern PA Posts: 2,484	If you are committed to becoming a yorkshire breeder I am sure there are many people on this forum who will be more than glad to help you locate a suitable female that is a good example of the standard. I would be happy to do what ever I can to help in any way.

08-14-2005, 06:19 PM	#60
sylvan YT 2000 Club Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Eastern PA Posts: 2,484	[QUOTE=SoCalyorkiLvr]The one and only "reason" the YTCA breed standard exists is for people who care about showing. QUOTE] Oh, I'm afraid that's not quite true. The standard for any purebred dog exists as a definition of what characteristics that breed of dog exemplifies. It is not just a 'club' description and not just for people who care about showing. It is what it is.