AKC or UKC?? which one?

[Mardelin]

Originally Posted by tegamom1

I too have a question for UKC exhibitors. When selling puppies and giving pedigrees, do you list the dogs as UKC Champion or just Ch.?

Mmmmm, I know it's customary in AKC registered dog's Pedigree to list AKC prior to the CH. Although, if you obtain the pedigree through AKC they do list AKC Championship only....So, as a breeder, if the dog is a Canadian Kennel Club, Mexican Champion, Best In Specialty winner and a ROM, it is your responsibility to add it in.

[topknot]

Originally Posted by Mardelin

Mmmmm, I know it's customary in AKC registered dog's Pedigree to list AKC prior to the CH. Although, if you obtain the pedigree through AKC they do list AKC Championship only....So, as a breeder, if the dog is a Canadian Kennel Club, Mexican Champion, Best In Specialty winner and a ROM, it is your responsibility to add it in.

You would think.... I have known people that had pups they were selling out of a UKC champion and did not bother to tell the buyer - they just stated the parent was a champion. No explaining. I think that is wrong and should be explained, especially since it is not the same and could be misleading. There are many people out there that do not know the difference. There is nothing wrong with stating that the parent was a UKC champion, and at least this way they could be up front.

[kalina82]

Originally Posted by topknot

You would think.... I have known people that had pups they were selling out of a UKC champion and did not bother to tell the buyer - they just stated the parent was a champion. No explaining. I think that is wrong and should be explained, especially since it is not the same and could be misleading. There are many people out there that do not know the difference. There is nothing wrong with stating that the parent was a UKC champion, and at least this way they could be up front.

its very wrong and misleading. It should say on the pedigrees what kind of champion the dog is so people aren't mislead. the clubs should do this...but then can't people make their own pedigrees using a program at home? they'd be able to get by that way...

[Sugar's Mom]

Originally Posted by kalina82

so if I were looking for that perfect puppy from championed parents i'd want them to be AKC champions instead of UKC chamions, right?

It seems like its easier to get a UKC championship then an AKC championship. like the UKC isn't as valuable as the AKC one. if something can be gotten in a weekend, instead of many weekends it can't be as valuable. Having both championships is great, but if you were to want one it would have to be the AKC one.

I've been on this site for 3 years now constantly reading and learning about the yorkie. I've seen numerous websites of breeders of all kinds, plus websites with just information on the breed. I've seen something on a few websites and mentioned by a few here that i always question. The majority of breeders on here all show AKC but there are a few that show only UKC even tho AKC is available to them. So these breeders show their dogs UKC and get them championed fairly young because its so easy. These young dogs aren't finished growing and changing (yorkies can continue to change up until 2 years old or later right?). So what happens if the dog becomes a champion at say 14 months old while its still growing and changing and then when its finished growing its not that perfect specimen of the breed? Now this person has this championed yorkie that she wanted to breed but this champion is no longer champion material? its no longer within standard for whatever reason. But she breeds it anyway and proclaims that the puppies are from a champion dam or sire. isn't this misleading to the buyer?

do you get what i'm saying or does this just not make sense at all. its just been in my head for a while so i thought i'd ask. i hope i'm not offending anyone cause that's not what i'm after.

The reason it is possible to get a championship in one weekend is that many of UKC weekends have six shows. two shows a day for three days usually. You need 100 points and three competetion wins for a UKC championship. I can't stand it when I see people putting down those of us that do show and value our UKC championship. it certainly hasn't been easier for me and I worked very hard. I really like it because of the family atmosphere. I have shown both venues. I also like being able to walk my dog into the ring and know that my dog has a chance and the win will not automatically go to Ms. So and So because she is a professional handler. That's all I am going to say because I can get on a roll when I hear people putting down how easy it is to finish a dog in UKC. The standards are the same and the judges have gotten very strict. They had enough sense to interpet the new color guidlines the correct way, the way they were meant to be taken and give puppies a longer time to change instead of DQ'ing six month old puppies the way some judges in AKC were doing. UKC is not availalbe in every state. I wish it were. it is really big a lot of places. I imagine I better hush now while I am ahead

[Sugar's Mom]

Originally Posted by kalina82

yeah i can see that the young AKC champions are worth more. its harder to get there and if that dog is going to champion young then it must really be something. and i agree that most dogs that do champion that young with AKC are probably from more seasoned breeders who have many champions in their lines.

my issues are about the UKC ones since those are less likely to have the same background that the AKC ones do.

Both the girl I championed at 14 months and the one I championed at eight months in UKC were the first dogs from their lines to ever have been shown in UKC and both come from a long, long line of AKC champions. so you are wrong about that. i could throw some of the names in my pedigrees out there and everyone that shows would recognize them as well established show lines. I'm not talking about early generations either. My dogs are all AKC first and only the ones I show UKC are dual registered. None of my baby puppies are registered UKc Mary is right. UKC is a fabulous training ground for new exhibitors.

[Sugar's Mom]

Originally Posted by tegamom1

I too have a question for UKC exhibitors. When selling puppies and giving pedigrees, do you list the dogs as UKC Champion or just Ch.?

I have only sold one puppy that was UKC championed damed and that is just the way I put it. It really doesn't up the price of the puppy one bit. it wasn't a selling point. In my area, champion puppies don't bring anymore than pet puppies even if they are AKC champion sired. My friend and I (that has championed sired and damed puppies) have come to the conclusion that wonderful pedigrees don't mean a whole lot to people just looking for pets.

[Sugar's Mom]

Originally Posted by Mardelin

One must remember that Handlers are professionals....they are well known and there are judges that won't look down the lead. Handlers are well trained in the art of presenting a dog and can take a mediocre dog and Champion it. It's what a handler is being payed for. So, it's up to the breeders to breed and show the best respresentations of the breed and only take those dogs to the judges or give them to a handler to show. If we don't do this then the only ones we're fooling is ourselves, our breeding program and hurting the breed.

Since I've never shown UKC, I have a question for those that do. How many yorkie entries are present at a UKC show?

mary, it depends on the region. There are states like Virginia, North carolina Pennsylvania, Michigan, Ohio and Indiania that have as many yorkie entries as AKC shows and more than some AKC shows. Then there are areas where it is hard to get competetion wins unless you take a group placement. kentucky and Tennessee usually have low yorkie entries.

[Sugar's Mom]

The point breakdown for UKC shows is:

First Place- ten points
Best male or female - fifteen points'
best of winners-ten points
Total 35 points possible for one show. No points are awarded for Group or Best of Breed. You must have 100 points and three competetion wins under three DIFFERENT judges

So if you are doing a six show weekend, it is very easy to take home a champion if you have a nice dog.

[tjdmom]

Last time I checked about a year ago, there were no UKC shows in my area. We don't have all that many AKC shows either unless I want to travel over 3 hours. But I do wish there were more UKC shows around here as I've been told it's easier for new people to break into it. Also, am I correct that UKC doesn't allow all the hair products. I have heard that someone who really knows how to groom and really make use the products can make a dog with a less than perfect coat appear perfect. Does anyone know if that's true?

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom

The point breakdown for UKC shows is:

First Place- ten points
Best male or female - fifteen points'
best of winners-ten points
Total 35 points possible for one show. No points are awarded for Group or Best of Breed. You must have 100 points and three competetion wins under three DIFFERENT judges

So if you are doing a six show weekend, it is very easy to take home a champion if you have a nice dog.

[Mardelin]

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom

The point breakdown for UKC shows is:

First Place- ten points
Best male or female - fifteen points'
best of winners-ten points
Total 35 points possible for one show. No points are awarded for Group or Best of Breed. You must have 100 points and three competetion wins under three DIFFERENT judges

So if you are doing a six show weekend, it is very easy to take home a champion if you have a nice dog.

Ahhhh! It's the point system...it's not contingent on the number of entries as in AKC, which varies from region to region.

AKC you can at times finish a dog in weekend, if it is an exceptional dog and a 4 or 5 day show. I just about finished one of my dogs, as a pup that way......he went back to back to back Majors in Kansas City. I need 1 point to finish him.

I know that Becki Evens Petersen finished her Beau in I think 3 AKC weekends, stiff competition and took Group Placings.

[Mardelin]

Originally Posted by tjdmom

Last time I checked about a year ago, there were no UKC shows in my area. We don't have all that many AKC shows either unless I want to travel over 3 hours. But I do wish there were more UKC shows around here as I've been told it's easier for new people to break into it. Also, am I correct that UKC doesn't allow all the hair products. I have heard that someone who really knows how to groom and really make use the products can make a dog with a less than perfect coat appear perfect. Does anyone know if that's true?

You can groom a dog to perfection, coat is just one aspect. However, it's the total package, it's what's under the coat, how it moves, it's ear set, eye set, showmanship.

[Mardelin]

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom

mary, it depends on the region. There are states like Virginia, North carolina Pennsylvania, Michigan, Ohio and Indiania that have as many yorkie entries as AKC shows and more than some AKC shows. Then there are areas where it is hard to get competetion wins unless you take a group placement. kentucky and Tennessee usually have low yorkie entries.

I only asked, because I thought maybe the point system was similar to AKC and you answered the question below, it's different.

I've witnesed at times some people come on and brag that their dog went WD, BOW and BOB at a AKC show. Well to someone that doesn't show....it's sounds wonderful. But, to those that do show, will go look up the show and find there were only 3 dogs entered and all belonged to that one person.....

[topknot]

My Gi finished in three weekends with an extra major when she was with Trish and Ken. It was amazing and blew my mind how fast she finished! No sooner than she was there she was ready to come home. This was in AKC shows. She had a very special attitude and had the total package. She loved the ring and so loved to get the judges attention. What a stinker!

In AKC shows most of the judges will go completly over your dog to feel their structure , and I have seen blow on their coats, place dogs together on the table, push on their head/topknot, or have them go back out and back several times to decide. It can be tough, but I am glad that they go to such lengths.

[topknot]

Originally Posted by Mardelin

I only asked, because I thought maybe the point system was similar to AKC and you answered the question below, it's different.

I've witnesed at times some people come on and brag that their dog went WD, BOW and BOB at a AKC show. Well to someone that doesn't show....it's sounds wonderful. But, to those that do show, will go look up the show and find there were only 3 dogs entered and all belonged to that one person.....

Mary, you are too funny. I check when I hear this and know the dog and in most cases there were not that many dogs, very few showing. But that is okay, since it may make them feel so proud for a moment. We know - all we have to do is check the results. Computers are amazing!

[Mardelin]

Originally Posted by topknot

My Gi finished in three weekends with an extra major when she was with Trish and Ken. It was amazing and blew my mind how fast she finished! No sooner than she was there she was ready to come home. This was in AKC shows. She had a very special attitude and had the total package. She loved the ring and so loved to get the judges attention. What a stinker!

In AKC shows the judges will go completly over your dog to feel their structure , and I have seen blow on their coats, place dogs together on the table, push on their head/topknot, or have them go back out and back several times to decide. It can be tough, but I am glad that they go to such lengths.

I saw your Easy. You know when your dog is winning in Texas/Oklahoma/NM circuit your dog is special. Tough competition there, some of the top winning dogs in the country, in all breeds. Most don't like to travel there because of that.


I know when my Denny went back to back to back in Kansas City it blew my mind. I was up against some heavy hitters that weekend and was so proud that I did it. My Denny was not a showman, he was a circus clown (he was sent up to Trish's for bootcamp). But, exceptional conformation, he knew when the judge was coming down the line and he'd stack himself and would give them a look that would melt anyone's heart.