Has Royal Canin gone insane?

[FidoTheYorkie]

Pheobe M, WOW , thats cheap!! I buy a 2 kilo bag of RC Mini light for 40-45 dollars ! that is expensive, but I buy that anyways cause its good food.
The food I buy is either made in north europe (sweden, norge, danmark or finland) or in Britain, its different than the RC in Usa I think.

These ingredients are in the food Fido gets, its in the same line as on the bag:

Dehydrated poultry meat,Maize,Barley,Rice,Vegetable fibres,Maize gluten,Animal fats,Vegetable protein isolate,Hydrolysed animal proteins,Beet pulp,Yeasts,Fish oil,Soya oil, Minerals,Fructo-oligo-saccharides, Sodium polyphosphate, DL-methioine, Borage oil, Egg powder, Green tea and Grape extracts.

Is any of this not good?
its ofcaurse most meat in this.
What is dehydrated poultry meat???

[Phoebe_m]

I live in Greece.Its a poor country. Can u live with 600€/month there?I dont think so .
Dehydrated poultry meat is dehydrated !! LOL ,without water,I cant explain it.
By the way,RC has as first ingredient rice as I see here...Its a good dog food,but not the best.Its too expensive ! I prefer to buy meat and cook ,its cheaper,but I dont have time for this ! So I choose another dog food.

My English are horrible so forgive me if u dont understand me

[butterfly]

Originally Posted by FlDebra

Not all of the Royal Canin Dog Foods have corn gluten in them. The Yorkshire Terrier Blend does have corn gluten but MANY others do not. For instance: MINI Toy Indoor Adult 25 has no corn. It is still a good Yorkie blend as the protein is more in line with what a toy housedog would require. I am still leery about long-term feeding of the super-high protein % foods. I wanted to try grain free but the only ones I saw locally had 42% protein -- sort of hard on the pancreas/liver. So, I stuck to one that included grain. I am testing Innova and Solid Gold at the moment. Mine LOVE Royal Canin but am hoping after being off it for a while they will forget and accept another food. I don't think RC is a bad food, but do think there are better ones. If my pups will just eat the other ones as well, I will be good to go.

What a dog can tolerate does depend on what has been going on recently too. I used to feed Canidae with absolutely NO problems, they all did well on it. Then I had them off all canned for quite a while. Reintroduced the same Canidae canned food and they got the runs. It wasn't the food -- it was what they had become accustomed to. I have a feeling this is often the reason for such different experiences with the same food. Part difference in dogs, and part difference in what they are used to at the time.

Hello,

I just wanted to say 'thanks' for all the information you have given, in many areas of topics. You do a lot of research and I'm sure it helps all of us.

My big guy 'Rico' has allergies (me too), he is a smooth coat chihuahua. He has a beautiful coat and I'm sure the Canin has to do with that. I mix in a little 'other stuff' in the mix. I cook a lot for my dogs too. Anyway, it really helped to see the mixes that do not have corn in case he has a problem with it sometime. We are on allergy shots with him.

Thank all of you for the input.

[mommacarrie02]

I just switched my 14 week old to Lifes Abundance. Tucker absolutely loves it, and it is great food for him! All natural, etc. He will even eat it as a traing treat!


Good Luck!

Carrie & Tucker

[Britster]

Originally Posted by FidoTheYorkie

These ingredients are in the food Fido gets, its in the same line as on the bag:

Dehydrated poultry meat,Maize,Barley,Rice,Vegetable fibres,Maize gluten,Animal fats,Vegetable protein isolate,Hydrolysed animal proteins,Beet pulp,Yeasts,Fish oil,Soya oil, Minerals,Fructo-oligo-saccharides, Sodium polyphosphate, DL-methioine, Borage oil, Egg powder, Green tea and Grape extracts.

Is any of this not good?
its ofcaurse most meat in this.
What is dehydrated poultry meat???

That foods sounds pretty bad to me. I don't even know what 'dehydrated poultry meat' is. That's definitely not specific enough. Plus even though it's the first ingredient, once water is removed, as it must be to create a dehydrated product, the ingredient will weigh around 20% of its wet weight and would be more accurately placed somewhat further down the ingredient list (ingredients are listed in order of weight). It's usually best to look for a food that has it's first ingredient as a defined meat (i.e. chicken) followed by chicken meal, for example.

Maize is just another word for corn. I don't think barley and rice are terrible grains or anything, and lots of dogs do fine with them, but in a food with practically NO meat... they should have replaced the barley and rice with some sort of meat. Maize gluten would be corn gluten, bad, IMO.

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by Britster

That foods sounds pretty bad to me. I don't even know what 'dehydrated poultry meat' is. That's definitely not specific enough. Plus even though it's the first ingredient, once water is removed, as it must be to create a dehydrated product, the ingredient will weigh around 20% of its wet weight and would be more accurately placed somewhat further down the ingredient list (ingredients are listed in order of weight). It's usually best to look for a food that has it's first ingredient as a defined meat (i.e. chicken) followed by chicken meal, for example.

Maize is just another word for corn. I don't think barley and rice are terrible grains or anything, and lots of dogs do fine with them, but in a food with practically NO meat... they should have replaced the barley and rice with some sort of meat. Maize gluten would be corn gluten, bad, IMO.

I think you, might be a little confused on the concept of taking water out of food, and where it should be place on the list. If it's dehydrated and still at the top of the list it's has more pure protein then if it is hydrated poultry. Chicken and turkey are considered poutry. Here's a great site for learning more about dehydrated meat, and how to read a label. The Dog Food Project - Identifying better products

[Britster]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

I think you, might be a little confused on the concept of taking water out of food, and where it should be place on the list. If it's dehydrated and still at the top of the list it's has more pure protein then if it is hydrated poultry. Chicken and turkey are considered poutry. Here's a great site for learning more about dehydrated meat, and how to read a label. The Dog Food Project - Identifying better products

Oh, yeah, I think you are right about the dehydrated being different than just having regular 'chicken' or whatever as the first ingredient. My mistake. I've never seen such a thing on a dog food label before.

I still think it's a crummy ingredient list. Where is the rest of the meat? There's only one un-specified (I understand poultry is chicken or turkey, but I think it should definitely be specified. Some dogs have an allergy to chicken, but not turkey, etc). Overall, I would never feed the food.

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by Britster

Oh, yeah, I think you are right about the dehydrated being different than just having regular 'chicken' or whatever as the first ingredient. My mistake. I've never seen such a thing on a dog food label before.

I still think it's a crummy ingredient list. Where is the rest of the meat? There's only one un-specified (I understand poultry is chicken or turkey, but I think it should definitely be specified. Some dogs have an allergy to chicken, but not turkey, etc). Overall, I would never feed the food.

You should be able to read the overall protein on the side of the package. I'm not sure what you mean by rest of the meat, if this is the first ingredient it will probably have a very high overall protein content. I'm with you, I like it when they say exactly what the ingrediant is, and if a dog is allergic to chicken, this would not be a good choice.

[Britster]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

You should be able to read the overall protein on the side of the package. I'm not sure what you mean by rest of the meat, if this is the first ingredient it will probably have a very high overall protein content. I'm with you, I like it when they say exactly what the ingrediant is, and if a dog is allergic to chicken, this would not be a good choice.

I just mean I think a dog food should have more meat than just one ingredient. Overall protein is not going to come down to just the meat, though. The corn, etc, can up the protein percentages too, I believe. I'm not sure what you mean by that.

When I compare that ingredient list (which, btw, I have NO idea what particular food that is? I don't think FidoYorkie specified?) to something like Orijen, for example, it just looks so crappy to me, lol.

I know Orijen doesn't do great for all dogs, nor does any food, and I know this may be a little above-and-beyond for dog food, but look at how great this ingredient list looks like in the Regional Red formula:

Fresh deboned wild boar*, fresh deboned lamb*, fresh beef liver*, fresh deboned pork*, lamb meal, peas, salmon meal, russet potato, herring meal, fresh whole eggs*, fresh deboned bison*, potato starch, fresh deboned salmon*, pacific whitefish meal, fresh deboned walleye*, salmon oil (preserved with mixed tocopherols), sun-cured alfalfa, pea fiber, dried organic kelp, pumpkin, chicory root, carrots, spinach, turnip greens, apples, cranberries, blueberries, licoric.... etc.

And then you look at this:
Dehydrated poultry meat,Maize,Barley,Rice,Vegetable fibres,Maize gluten,Animal fats,Vegetable protein isolate,Hydrolysed animal proteins,Beet pulp,Yeasts,Fish oil,Soya oil, Minerals,Fructo-oligo-saccharides, Sodium polyphosphate, DL-methioine, Borage oil, Egg powder, Green tea and Grape extracts.

I don't know. There's just no comparison really, IMO. I know this is obviously a debatable topic. But I don't know how anyone could think dogs were meant to eat barley, rice, corn and vegetable protein over higher meat contents. I clearly know a dog is NOT a wolf, especially not our Yorkies, but their genetically just about the same (99.8% taxonmically the same as wolves, the .2% accounting for size and appearance).

And to stay somewhat on topic, since this is a thread about RC, I pay $17.99 for 5.5lb bag of Orijen Regional Red and I see RC priced WAY higher than that in Petco. It just blows my mind.

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by Britster

I just mean I think a dog food should have more meat than just one ingredient. Overall protein is not going to come down to just the meat, though. The corn, etc, can up the protein percentages too, I believe. I'm not sure what you mean by that.

When I compare that ingredient list (which, btw, I have NO idea what particular food that is? I don't think FidoYorkie specified?) to something like Orijen, for example, it just looks so crappy to me, lol.

I know Orijen doesn't do great for all dogs, nor does any food, and I know this may be a little above-and-beyond for dog food, but look at how great this ingredient list looks like in the Regional Red formula:

Fresh deboned wild boar*, fresh deboned lamb*, fresh beef liver*, fresh deboned pork*, lamb meal, peas, salmon meal, russet potato, herring meal, fresh whole eggs*, fresh deboned bison*, potato starch, fresh deboned salmon*, pacific whitefish meal, fresh deboned walleye*, salmon oil (preserved with mixed tocopherols), sun-cured alfalfa, pea fiber, dried organic kelp, pumpkin, chicory root, carrots, spinach, turnip greens, apples, cranberries, blueberries, licoric.... etc.

And then you look at this:
Dehydrated poultry meat,Maize,Barley,Rice,Vegetable fibres,Maize gluten,Animal fats,Vegetable protein isolate,Hydrolysed animal proteins,Beet pulp,Yeasts,Fish oil,Soya oil, Minerals,Fructo-oligo-saccharides, Sodium polyphosphate, DL-methioine, Borage oil, Egg powder, Green tea and Grape extracts.

I don't know. There's just no comparison really, IMO. I know this is obviously a debatable topic. But I don't know how anyone could think dogs were meant to eat barley, rice, corn and vegetable protein over higher meat contents. I clearly know a dog is NOT a wolf, especially not our Yorkies, but their genetically just about the same (99.8% taxonmically the same as wolves, the .2% accounting for size and appearance).

And to stay somewhat on topic, since this is a thread about RC, I pay $17.99 for 5.5lb bag of Orijen Regional Red and I see RC priced WAY higher than that in Petco. It just blows my mind.

The food you listed sound excellent! I think some of the ingredients added are more to appeal to the human buyer than actually that beneficial to the dog, but nevertheless, it sounds like a great food.

[Britster]

I also want to add that the words "grain-free" are beginning to just be yet another gimmick in marketing. I saw a food recently at Petsmart (I think it was Nature's Recipe) that says GRAIN-FREE real big on the big, and it's filled with potatoes and lack of meat content too. I don't necessarily believe that potatoes, etc, are better than barley, rice, etc. It's just a different type of binding agent that is necessary to form kibble.

I'm definitely not all for one way or the other. I know certain dogs do better on certain formulas better than others. Some can tolerate grains, some can't. Grains scare me mainly because most recalls involving dog food involve grains, so I'd rather just eliminate the problem.

But I never focus on just reading 'grain-free' on a package, or 'meat filled' or ANY of those lines they use. I like to first, look at the ingredient list, then I like to research WHERE the food is coming from. Different facilities have different standards and there's only a select few that I trust. Sometimes a food can LOOK great on the ingredient list but then you find out that's it's made somewhere terrible, or there was tons of recalls, or whatever.

Same with protein... I don't think it's fair, as I've seen some people do, to try feeding a food that has, say, 35% protein in it. And the dog didn't do well on it. So now they go on to post like "high protein did not work for my dog!!" when they only tried ONE higher-ish protein food and it very well could have been a specific ingredient in the food and NOT simply the protein content on the guaranteed analysis. Two foods that both have 35% protein can be vastly different. I don't think it's fair to write off a high protein food for your dog because he failed on one. So food is definitely not a black or white issue for me.

[Britster]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

The food you listed sound excellent! I think some of the ingredients added are more to appeal to the human buyer than actually that beneficial to the dog, but nevertheless, it sounds like a great food.

Oh, definitely. I think that occurs in any dry dog food, really.

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by Britster

I also want to add that the words "grain-free" are beginning to just be yet another gimmick in marketing. I saw a food recently at Petsmart (I think it was Nature's Recipe) that says GRAIN-FREE real big on the big, and it's filled with potatoes and lack of meat content too. I don't necessarily believe that potatoes, etc, are better than barley, rice, etc. It's just a different type of binding agent that is necessary to form kibble.

I'm definitely not all for one way or the other. I know certain dogs do better on certain formulas better than others. Some can tolerate grains, some can't. Grains scare me mainly because most recalls involving dog food involve grains, so I'd rather just eliminate the problem.

But I never focus on just reading 'grain-free' on a package, or 'meat filled' or ANY of those lines they use. I like to first, look at the ingredient list, then I like to research WHERE the food is coming from. Different facilities have different standards and there's only a select few that I trust. Sometimes a food can LOOK great on the ingredient list but then you find out that's it's made somewhere terrible, or there was tons of recalls, or whatever.

Same with protein... I don't think it's fair, as I've seen some people do, to try feeding a food that has, say, 35% protein in it. And the dog didn't do well on it. So now they go on to post like "high protein did not work for my dog!!" when they only tried ONE higher-ish protein food and it very well could have been a specific ingredient in the food and NOT simply the protein content on the guaranteed analysis. Two foods that both have 35% protein can be vastly different. I don't think it's fair to write off a high protein food for your dog because he failed on one. So food is definitely not a black or white issue for me.

I so agree with this, I mean some dogs are allergic to grains, so you'd want to feed grain free, but I don't think there is any evidence out yet to suggest that this is best for all dogs.

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by Britster

Oh, definitely. I think that occurs in any dry dog food, really.

Well when I see apples and blueberries etc I wonder if it is just added to appeal to humans? I mean I give Joey fruit, but when I see it on the bag, I'm always a little suspicious.

Fruits & Vegetables
Fresh, unprocessed fruits and vegetables add vitamins, minerals and various phytonutrients. They are nice ingredients but by no means necessary and mostly only included in insignificant amounts. If a brand of food contains high quality protein, carbohydrate and fat sources but no fruits or vegetables, it's still a better choice than one with less ideal main ingredients that does have a few pieces of blueberries, peas or carrots added to make the ingredient list look more impressive. Sharing some of the fresh, unprocessed fruits and vegetables you eat yourself will add much more nutritional value to your dog's diet - just please do not give onions, grapes or raisins. The Dog Food Project - Identifying better products

[blufshbaby]

Isabella has been on RC since I got her from the breeder, 13 months ago. She has done very well, she's had no problems, Thank God! It is pretty expensive, but I think it's worth it, her coat is so pretty and her teeth are beautiful and no stomach issues. I'm sure it all depends on what works best for your baby.