Death from a Virus

[dwerten]

Originally Posted by ladyjane

My point in all of this is that warnings to all pet owners in bold capital fonts tends to frighten them. That is just not what I feel should be done since the majority of dogs can safely take some of these meds. Taking the case of one dog or a handful is not scientific in any way. Even doing a poll on YT is not scientific! Research has BEEN done and these meds are safe to use as prescribed. One thing to educate, another to harp and frighten imho.

Sure it is good for people to know contraindications and side effects of ANY med...whether for them or their pets. We all should be educated consumers.

Just seems that the focus is never on the good that these meds do...only the bad things that "may" have happened to one or two dogs. I have a difficult time believing that one dose of an NSAID would cause the harm that is being suggested. I suppose anything is possible. But..hey you can give any med to a person or animal and it can be a problem. That does not make it a dangerous medication. Same thing goes with some foods. People and pets can have adverse reactions to foods. We still need to eat and feed out pets.

I have dealt with many dogs in my life...especially in the past few years. They had many different conditions and some could not take certain meds. That is just the way it is...but does not mean I could lump them with all dogs and say that what they cannot take applies to all dogs. I guess I am simply not an alarmist unless it must be! I tend to take illness very serious, but I do not overreact and freak out...that is just not good for me or the pups I care for.

still waiting on the answer to this question

LJ did you give nsaids to your dogs on empty stomachs or to dogs with known liver disease or to dogs on steroids?

It is fine we can agree to disagree again. Until your dog has been affected it will make no difference to some people. When it happens to your dog then you will think differently as that is usually the case when it hits home it means more to you. It hit home for me and I did alot of research on it so I prefer to warn others and will continue to do so as I would want the same for me. I prefer to be aware than not aware like the owner whose dog is in the hospital for possible side effect to VECTRA 3D. I want to be aware to keep my dogs healthy but some want to burry their head in the sand and pretend it does not exist. I do not choose to do that as I like to make educated decisions when it comes to my health and my dogs. Some choose to just trust the vet and that has worked well for them and some not so well. That is what makes this a great place everyone is entitled to their opinion based on their experience and each of us can share that with others.

The poll for vaccines has been very informative just like i believe this poll will be as well. I want to see if what i feel is correct it is the main drug used after surgery or like Rhetts mama believes it is not.

[Rhetts_mama]

You really intend to run this into the ground, don't you?

For anything that even REMOTELY resembles accuracy in your "poll" you would need to include not only the med, but the type of surgery and the age of the dog as well as any existing health problems.

I give up and am walking away from this.

Once again, to the OP, I am so sorry this thread got hijacked in this manner. I take full responsibility for it since I was the first one to post the other questions.

[ladyjane]

There is a huge difference between educating people and scaring the witts out of them for no reason.

There is also a lot of research that is done and what you often react to is not based on scientific research.

Yes, we do disagree and I suppose will continue to do so. No worries.

This question that you keep asking that I am not going to answer has nothing to do with what I am saying....or actually has everything to do with it. You are making judgements all of the time and advising people based on one thing that you saw or heard..or things that you think may have happened. Again......you need to see the big picture, but I also know that people could tell you that until the cows come home, and you simply are not going to budge. So..yes, you will continue to scare the witts out of people and I will continue to try to help them in a less stressful way.

[dwerten]

Originally Posted by Rhetts_mama

You really intend to run this into the ground, don't you?

For anything that even REMOTELY resembles accuracy in your "poll" you would need to include not only the med, but the type of surgery and the age of the dog as well as any existing health problems.

I give up and am walking away from this.

Once again, to the OP, I am so sorry this thread got hijacked in this manner. I take full responsibility for it since I was the first one to post the other questions.

why do you feel this is hijacked as this dog very well could have died from pain medication as stated by OP? We are talking about pain medication.

The poll states surgery which means anything and what you will see is most people are going ot post NSAIDS as that is usually what is given like Crystal said.

I am sorry you take offense to this and feel it is run into the ground. I never feel that about any topic on here as I as well as others can learn from these threads even the ones that have difference of opinion. What is so wrong with that? We can have a difference of opinion and each of is in charge of the care of our own dog so we have the choice of what to do but I happen to like to learn both sides and understand why one may choose one thing over another. This is part of making a well informed decision is knowing both sides of something.

[Ellie May]

Originally Posted by Rhetts_mama

You really intend to run this into the ground, don't you?

For anything that even REMOTELY resembles accuracy in your "poll" you would need to include not only the med, but the type of surgery and the age of the dog as well as any existing health problems.

I give up and am walking away from this.

Once again, to the OP, I am so sorry this thread got hijacked in this manner. I take full responsibility for it since I was the first one to post the other questions.

It happens.
Hopefully Original Poster will ignore the debate and keep posting.

I agree with the above. Surgery is way too broad of a term. A dental is much different than LP repair! The vaccine thread is just to see how many people are still doing DHPP that answer polls on YT. Just an idea of how many here are following new research...

NSAIDs are the drug of choice post spay from what I have seen and there is nothing wrong with that for healthy dogs. For unhealthy dogs, the vet needs to do a little bit more considering...

[ladyjane]

Originally Posted by Rhetts_mama

You really intend to run this into the ground, don't you?

For anything that even REMOTELY resembles accuracy in your "poll" you would need to include not only the med, but the type of surgery and the age of the dog as well as any existing health problems.

I give up and am walking away from this.

Once again, to the OP, I am so sorry this thread got hijacked in this manner. I take full responsibility for it since I was the first one to post the other questions.

And, I am following right behind you.

To the OP: another thing you might do is buy your friend a plant and put a nice note on it. Someone did that for me recently when one of my fosters passed. The note said that she was thinking of me and that it was her hope that every time I looked at that plant I would think about the love that little Ozzy brought into my home. I totally LOVE that plant! I have it on my counter above my sink and talk to it every morning when I make my coffee.

[dwerten]

Originally Posted by Ellie May

It happens.
Hopefully Original Poster will ignore the debate and keep posting.

I agree with the above. Surgery is way too broad of a term. A dental is much different than LP repair! The vaccine thread is just to see how many people are still doing DHPP that answer polls on YT. Just an idea of how many here are following new research...

NSAIDs are the drug of choice post spay from what I have seen and there is nothing wrong with that for healthy dogs. For unhealthy dogs, the vet needs to do a little bit more considering...

but how many vets are doing blood work prior to spay or neuter to know if that pup is healthy? 6 Years ago I knew nothing and dd was spay by one vet and no blood work and dex by another vet and no blood work. How many times do we see that on here? What if the dog has liver disease? I was lucky as dd has mvd and did ok but what if i was not so lucky as I was never offered to do blood work for either of them as I have no problem spending money on vet care as you know from all I have spent. Why was this not offered to me?

[dwerten]

Originally Posted by ladyjane

There is a huge difference between educating people and scaring the witts out of them for no reason.

There is also a lot of research that is done and what you often react to is not based on scientific research.

Yes, we do disagree and I suppose will continue to do so. No worries.

This question that you keep asking that I am not going to answer has nothing to do with what I am saying....or actually has everything to do with it. You are making judgements all of the time and advising people based on one thing that you saw or heard..or things that you think may have happened. Again......you need to see the big picture, but I also know that people could tell you that until the cows come home, and you simply are not going to budge. So..yes, you will continue to scare the witts out of people and I will continue to try to help them in a less stressful way.

well all i can say is if it saves one dog from dying that has liver disease that vet gave nsaid then it is all worth it to me. I would much rather be conservative than see a dog die unnecessarily because I knew something yet kept my mouth shut because others disagreed.

And why not answer the question when asked is there something to hide? I have no problems answering when someone asks me one on here. And what about all the people I have helped on here?

[Ellie May]

Originally Posted by dwerten

but how many vets are doing blood work prior to spay or neuter to know if that pup is healthy? 6 Years ago I knew nothing and dd was spay by one vet and no blood work and dex by another vet and no blood work. How many times do we see that on here? What if the dog has liver disease? I was lucky as dd has mvd and did ok but what if i was not so lucky as I was never offered to do blood work for either of them as I have no problem spending money on vet care as you know from all I have spent. Why was this not offered to me?

It was offered to me... Ellie was older though. Some vets just don't think young dogs need it (totally disagree).

I can only say what I would do and that is no surgery before bloodwork. And I can tell you that "I" would not use an NSAID with a BAT on a Yorkie, but that is a lot to ask of all owners and vets...

I'm being general though. Healthy dog...NSAIDs are fine. This could've been a complication from surgery for all we know. Or since a virus was involved, did it pick it up during surgery? Or? Or? It's all a guessing game right now.

[Ringo1]

It's a huge guessing game; the OP advised she had no idea what happened and all this speculation about nsaids causing the death is just . . . more speculation without any of the facts.

She asked how to help her friend who is sad over the loss of her dog; not to perform a cyber autopsy.

[kalina82]

Originally Posted by Rhetts_mama

For anything that even REMOTELY resembles accuracy in your "poll" you would need to include not only the med, but the type of surgery and the age of the dog as well as any existing health problems.

Originally Posted by Ellie May

I agree with the above. Surgery is way too broad of a term. A dental is much different than LP repair! The vaccine thread is just to see how many people are still doing DHPP that answer polls on YT. Just an idea of how many here are following new research...

exactly. there are SO many things to consider. meds, dosage, breed of dog, weight of dog, age of dog, other health issues dog has, type of surgery, full sedation vs. partial sedation, owners ability to medicate, was dog on previous NSAID or other medication, reactions to any other med in the past, and so many other things.... your poll will never be accurate and is pretty useless. the population of YT in minuscule compared to all the yorkie owners in the country which is small compared to all the dog owners in the country

[dwerten]

Originally Posted by kalina82

exactly. there are SO many things to consider. meds, dosage, breed of dog, weight of dog, age of dog, other health issues dog has, type of surgery, full sedation vs. partial sedation, owners ability to medicate, was dog on previous NSAID or other medication, reactions to any other med in the past, and so many other things.... your poll will never be accurate and is pretty useless. the population of YT in minuscule compared to all the yorkie owners in the country which is small compared to all the dog owners in the country

yep and the dhpp one I guess was useless too as it does not rate all the dogs in the country

We cannot educate every dog owner in the country but we sure can educate the pet owners that are on here and since liver disease is so prevalent in this breed then it is important to know what vets are prescribing to this breed for pain medication. Also this breed has alot of digestive issues and ibd dogs should not get nsaids either.

Op the best thing I think is when the death of one dog helps save the life of another so If your friend can get the facts to help possibly save another dogs life here and that her dog did not die in vain.

[kalina82]

Originally Posted by dwerten

yep and the dhpp one I guess was useless too as it does not rate all the dogs in the country

once again you missed the point. I am done.

[dwerten]

Originally Posted by kalina82

your poll will never be accurate and is pretty useless. the population of YT in minuscule compared to all the yorkie owners in the country which is small compared to all the dog owners in the country

Originally Posted by kalina82

once again you missed the point. I am done.

so how would dhpp poll be different than nsaid poll ?

Sorry I guess I missed your point again.

[wallypoopiepie]

Originally Posted by kalina82

there are over 70 MILLION dogs in the USA. once again i ask you to look at the big picture here and not the unprofessional, non peer reviewed websites on the internet. that's all I'm going to say on this matter.

So sad..I am a newbie here and have only posted a few times. I am almost afraid to for fear of being jumped on. But what the heck...

Why must you be so grumpy to this young lady, who I felt her information was quite helpful. It is also something that actually is a problem with NSAIDS in humans as well as animals.

So many things go undetected because most pet owners don't see a reason to take their dogs to the vet after they die and have a necropsy done. We don't think of this because they are animals.

If it was a spouse or a child, they would automatically do an autopsy because of age.

By the way, elderly are very rarely autopsied because it is considered natural death.

This however is not the case with animals.. So that is why you do not see thousands, millions of names on that list.

But that is no reason for crabby abby behavior toward another fellow human being with feelings. Think of the animals of course but lets stop, think and put human feelings first.

Have a great Monday