Re-call on hand sanitizers

[yorkietalkjilly]

Originally Posted by Lovetodream88

Go read your first attacking post to me about not wearing a mask. The one where you said it was ok to harass people not wearing masks....... people are not wearing medical grade masks they are wearing fabric ones and if you read the boxes of the medical masks it says doesn’t protect against COVID. Have a good day I’m out.

And furthermore, no "jake-leg" or Harvard lawyer, no legal department in its right mind would boast their product protects against Covid-19 without inviting legal and government-spank disaster. So little is known about this disease, no prolonged, wide-area testing with double-blind testing, publishing of results, peer-review and long-term trials of any product have even had time to go through the rigors of trying to see what works best at preventing this disease's contagion spread. Certainly nothing has been approved by the FDA or anyone else as far as I know as being able to state it prevents or protects against Covid! No method, protocol or product is ever 100% against any disease with every patient, nor foolish enough to make public any statement that it says it will prevent or protect against it.

But using our medical and infectious disease experts' skills of analyzation, deduction, common sense and reason we can put our hopes in what our best medical minds advise about how other diseases very like this one are spread and follow their advise as they learn more.

https://www.google.com/search?q=prot...w=1332&bih=731

[yorkietalkjilly]

Originally Posted by Andy A

Good little video on masks and aerolization.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DNeYfUTA11s

I've seen that video before. I don't know of the video's bona fides or anything about who produced it, under what conditions, how it could have been made, who observed, what materials or products were used or any photoshopping, editing, all the whatevers people do to fact-check any products or production but it is amazing how much we spread of ourselves into the atmosphere around us of this video is even half true! Thanks for sharing it.

[Lovetodream88]

Originally Posted by yorkietalkjilly

Whatever my initial response was it is interesting that you see it as an "attack" rather than a reply to your post on this public forum. Why in the world would I want to attack or sanction harassing any member of this forum? I thought I was just replying to someone not trusting the science and failing to wear masks based on faulty information. I'm sorry you see that as an attack or supporting harassment rather than attempt to inform. I would never attack you or anyone here. Can't we discuss, disagree or debate w/out rather hostile overreactions and unbecoming insults from you? What's happened to you? I'm trying to help in any way I can, finding it very difficult with you.

You said above to read 'boxes of the medical masks", could you provide a link to whatever source document you are referencing?

Masks are never 100%, nor is sterilization, soap washing, vaccines, full protective suits with face shields and breathing systems or any protective measures involved in trying to prevent disease spread, even medical grade masks as I understand it, nothing really is ever 100% but helps contain disease spread. But masks help prevent our droplet-spread and help prevent all of it getting into our nostrils and mouths or our droplet-spread getting into others' nostrils and mouths. It's a simple ask or difficult ask in many cases of citizens but getting through to our younger citizens like yourself seems very difficult. Our best medical minds the world over advise wearing face masks or whatever nose, mouth, even eye-coverings to help prevent against Covid-19 pandemic contagion, no matter how you personally nitpick it or overreact.

Like I said go back and read your first comment to me on this subject. You said if I can’t wear a mask I was terrible for going out and that anyone not wearing a mask should be harassed. You said it not me. I am very passionate about this topic because there is a small percent who really can’t wear masks and I am one of them so I feel the need to stand up for those of us. Sadly those that just don’t want to wear a mask have made it worse for the ones that really can’t so we are harassed and shamed. Not going out in 5 to 6 months is just not safe for mental health. It has honestly turned me into an agoraphobic. I can’t even go to my therapist or any of my doctors because the fear of going anywhere. To many people have killed themselves due to this pandemic. Nothing has happened to me I am who I am and I feel extremely passionate on this subject. I have ALWAYS been one to stand up for the under dog. You are just unable to see it from another perspective and not only is that frustrating it angers me because you don’t seem to understand mental illness and the severity of it. With all the information available about mental health there is no excuse. You seem to think oh it’s easy put your mask on or just stay home and it’s not that simple. I have seen more corruption in our government this year then I could have ever imagined and sadly no health organization that has links to the government can be trusted at this point because many lies have been exposed.

[yorkietalkjilly]

It's sort of burying the lead on this vital life-and-death subject but you characterized being given the scientific facts of our best medical minds by others as harassing, I was merely parroting you. Likely most don't see quoting the CDC and other experts on communicable diseases advice on mask-wearing as harassment of someone who deliberately chooses to go out among others w/out a mask out of fear of contagion spread. If you do, I am sorry you can't see I'm not trying to harass you personally but inform you and any readers better so that hopefully you'll self-quarantine and stay home if you cannot possibly bear a mask w/out losing consciousness or fainting. Otherwise, your reactions to mask-wearing may scare, discomfit you but won't kill you, but not wearing one may kill others.

Many others reading this thread could be easily sympathetic with your position and decide they are not so comfortable in a mask either, take medication for various mental conditions, don't like the closed-in feeling, breathing the warm air, their glasses steaming up, etc.,of mask wearing and decide not to wear one either. So bearing down on this issue could save lives as it's not really about us and our discomfort or our reactions but whether or not we might infect an innocent person with our germs if we choose to go out w/out masks. And suddenly maybe a family loses its mother or father, thanks to germs were unknowingly passed on.

I hurt that you are hurting and wish I could take a different course but this is vital to so many who must work to keep their jobs, keep their families afloat. And I do know that mental illness is very real, very disabling for many but stay home when you are not up to wearing a face-covering, at least give up your right to walk among us, just until we get a handle on how to stop this pandemic that is costing some their very lives, many, many others their livelihoods, ways to feed their kids. Please see that as bigger than yourself and your discomforts, however real, however awful to you. Find ways through your psychiatrist, counselors to modify your behavior, to cope better, stay away from harassing situations for the present and keep others safe. If your present providers are not helping you, seek out others who can. Keep pressing forward. But look beyond yourself on this one.

I sure hope if you, your family or your dogs have to have surgery that the surgeon and operating team are masked, gloved up, despite any discomfort, if for no other reason than to protect their patient from their germs.

[matese]

Originally Posted by Andy A

P.S. My post above is not directed at anyone here nor whether or not one should or should not wear a mask.

Thank you Andy,

this is a perfect video of mask wearing and which is the best mask for protection. Also seeing what comes out of the mouth of ppl just talking without a mask.

[Lovetodream88]

Originally Posted by yorkietalkjilly

It's sort of burying the lead on this vital life-and-death subject but you characterized being given the scientific facts of our best medical minds by others as harassing, I was merely parroting you. Likely most don't see quoting the CDC and other experts on communicable diseases advice on mask-wearing as harassment of someone who deliberately chooses to go out among others w/out a mask out of fear of contagion spread. If you do, I am sorry you can't see I'm not trying to harass you personally but inform you and any readers better so that hopefully you'll self-quarantine and stay home if you cannot possibly bear a mask w/out losing consciousness or fainting. Otherwise, your reactions to mask-wearing may scare, discomfit you but won't kill you, but not wearing one may kill others.

Many others reading this thread could be easily sympathetic with your position and decide they are not so comfortable in a mask either, take medication for various mental conditions, don't like the closed-in feeling, breathing the warm air, their glasses steaming up, etc.,of mask wearing and decide not to wear one either. So bearing down on this issue could save lives as it's not really about us and our discomfort or our reactions but whether or not we might infect an innocent person with our germs if we choose to go out w/out masks. And suddenly maybe a family loses its mother or father, thanks to germs were unknowingly passed on.

I hurt that you are hurting and wish I could take a different course but this is vital to so many who must work to keep their jobs, keep their families afloat. And I do know that mental illness is very real, very disabling for many but stay home when you are not up to wearing a face-covering, at least give up your right to walk among us, just until we get a handle on how to stop this pandemic that is costing some their very lives, many, many others their livelihoods, ways to feed their kids. Please see that as bigger than yourself and your discomforts, however real, however awful to you. Find ways through your psychiatrist, counselors to modify your behavior, to cope better, stay away from harassing situations for the present and keep others safe. If your present providers are not helping you, seek out others who can. Keep pressing forward. But look beyond yourself on this one.

I sure hope if you, your family or your dogs have to have surgery that the surgeon and operating team are masked, gloved up, despite any discomfort, if for no other reason than to protect their patient from their germs.

Yeah your still not getting it........ I’m not continuing to do this with you....... you don’t understand period and aren’t willing to try. Hope you never have mental illness or someone’s life doesn’t depend on you Understanding it...... some one like me who goes out a few times without a mask in the hopes it will save their mental health and keep them from killing themselves is not selfish period. Maybe everyone who is that terrified needs to stay home!!!!!! DONE!!!!

[yorkietalkjilly]

Originally Posted by Lovetodream88

Yeah your still not getting it........ I’m not continuing to do this with you....... you don’t understand period and aren’t willing to try. Hope you never have mental illness or someone’s life doesn’t depend on you Understanding it...... some one like me who goes out a few times without a mask in the hopes it will save their mental health and keep them from killing themselves is not selfish period. Maybe everyone who is that terrified needs to stay home!!!!!! DONE!!!!

Then let me ask you a question: Would you stay home if the Covid-19 mortality rate in the 25 - 85 age range were 90%, a virtual death sentence to most everyone infected, giving you and your loved ones only a 10% chance of survival should you get Covid-19 or inadvertently pass it on to your mom, dad or grands? Just wondering what it would take to get you to put others' well-being ahead of concerns about your own self.

[yorkietalkjilly]

Originally Posted by Lovetodream88

Yeah your still not getting it........ I’m not continuing to do this with you....... you don’t understand period and aren’t willing to try. Hope you never have mental illness or someone’s life doesn’t depend on you Understanding it...... some one like me who goes out a few times without a mask in the hopes it will save their mental health and keep them from killing themselves is not selfish period. Maybe everyone who is that terrified needs to stay home!!!!!! DONE!!!!

Taylor, if you are that near the edge, you belong under care, where you can get some personal, intensified help, medication, counseling. My mom suffered from mental illness, had to be hospitalized for over 2 months in an institution with intense treatment, counseling, even shock therapy. She suffered greatly from her mental illness and I had to quit my first job to stay home and care for my 6 year old brother when I was just 18 as my father had to work at his business, his own company. So I ran the house, cared for Tim and his first year of school, kept up with mother on the phone, talked with her doctors about her treatments, progress, taking Tim to visit her when we could, cook the meals and do the shopping. Daddy worked 16 hour days, came home too tired to even eat.

When she came home, she just sat for two weeks barely talking and then slowly began to return somewhat to herself. Daddy was working very hard to make his new business prosperous as it was so new so much of mom's care was up to me, such as keeping up with her meds, getting her to her psychiatrist appts., helping her in any way she needed, even when she regressed. We eventually got through it, she was markedly better, could relax, wasn't nearly so fearful, nervous, so obsessed with one thing or the other that she couldn't sleep but it took about two years for her to become mom again. And she stayed mom, my mom, for the rest of her life after her intense treatment program, good counseling, proper medication and a lot of love on all our parts.

Daddy's business did great, he hired more people, expanded and he was so happy to be able to buy and build my mom a new home in the neighborhood of her choosing, move her and new furniture she picked out, into her dream house and she was so happy, so different than those last bad years before her treatment. Get yourself real help before it's too late. You are worth it, girl! You matter to one and all, to me. We're in your corner. We may disagree on things sometimes but I want you to get yourself help rather than going out and about un-masked if you feel suicidal. But you have to make the first move to reach out for help.

[Lovetodream88]

Originally Posted by yorkietalkjilly

Taylor, if you are that near the edge, you belong under care, where you can get some personal, intensified help, medication, counseling. My mom suffered from mental illness, had to be hospitalized for over 2 months in an institution with intense treatment, counseling, even shock therapy. She suffered greatly from her mental illness and I had to quit my first job to stay home and care for my 6 year old brother when I was just 18 as my father had to work at his business, his own company. So I ran the house, cared for Tim and his first year of school, kept up with mother on the phone, talked with her doctors about her treatments, progress, taking Tim to visit her when we could, cook the meals and do the shopping. Daddy worked 16 hour days, came home too tired to even eat.

When she came home, she just sat for two weeks barely talking and then slowly began to return somewhat to herself. Daddy was working very hard to make his new business prosperous as it was so new so much of mom's care was up to me, such as keeping up with her meds, getting her to her psychiatrist appts., helping her in any way she needed, even when she regressed. We eventually got through it, she was markedly better, could relax, wasn't nearly so fearful, nervous, so obsessed with one thing or the other that she couldn't sleep but it took about two years for her to become mom again. And she stayed mom, my mom, for the rest of her life after her intense treatment program, good counseling, proper medication and a lot of love on all our parts.

Daddy's business did great, he hired more people, expanded and he was so happy to be able to buy and build my mom a new home in the neighborhood of her choosing, move her and new furniture she picked out, into her dream house and she was so happy, so different than those last bad years before her treatment. Get yourself real help before it's too late. You are worth it, girl! You matter to one and all, to me. We're in your corner. We may disagree on things sometimes but I want you to get yourself help rather than going out and about un-masked if you feel suicidal. But you have to make the first move to reach out for help.

When I had just turned 13 I was hospitalized for a weekend. Sadly when I was diagnosed at 8 there wasn’t a big thing of treating children so nothing really started until I was 13. My grandmother has significant mental illness and had been hospitalized at least once when she was much younger and I think before my mother was born. My grandmother refuses to get help so I’m having to live with dealing with my own mental illness but try to live dealing with her extreme depression and it’s hard. I have messaged my therapist with hopes of restarting, she has her own office by herself and has started a sanitizing system. My other doctors right now are ok doing telephone and virtual appointments for now.

[yorkietalkjilly]

Originally Posted by Lovetodream88

When I had just turned 13 I was hospitalized for a weekend. Sadly when I was diagnosed at 8 there wasn’t a big thing of treating children so nothing really started until I was 13. My grandmother has significant mental illness and had been hospitalized at least once when she was much younger and I think before my mother was born. My grandmother refuses to get help so I’m having to live with dealing with my own mental illness but try to live dealing with her extreme depression and it’s hard. I have messaged my therapist with hopes of restarting, she has her own office by herself and has started a sanitizing system. My other doctors right now are ok doing telephone and virtual appointments for now.

Oh, honey! Don't depend on grandmother or anyone else. You need to tell someone that you are so depressed you are having suicidal thoughts, even going out in public to try to help yourself feel better when you are so nervous/phobic you cannot bear to wear a mask, then coming home a potential carrier of this disease o pass the germs to your family, for all you know. Thinking of killing yourself over the temporary isolation of quarantining is far from normal and shows you need to tell someone about this who can get you help tonight.

Unless you reach out immediately and connect with someone who actually recognizes you are in real pain and suffering and cares enough to get you help now, you are at great risk. Just the fact that you've thought of ending your very life over a temporary situation that won't last, will one day pass, shows you are suffering. But there could be more, worse diseases in the future than Covid-19, possibly more deadly so you must be able to cope with the future. Don't settle for anything but someone who can get you help for the pain you are in now, before it kills you! Just Google Suicide Help Line for your city and reach out right now, make yourself do it and don't take "no" or "I'm too busy sanitizing my office to see you during a crisis time for you"! That's akin to malpractice, if not the very definition of it if you shared your true feelings with that therapist and got the brush off!

You need to find real help, someone with the skills to help you, medicate you if necessary to help change any bad brain chemistry, calm your fears, help you learn real coping skills, how to modify your behavior and your thinking in a way that can help to change your outlook on life. There is so much help out there, people who truly care, eager to help. The brain itself is so elastic, so capable to creating new, different, better pathways for our thoughts if we know what to do to start the process off, perfect it day by day as we practice new thinking, get real care our minds and bodies need. Medication with skilled counseling and learned coping skills this day and time are all also often an eventual cure for many.

No one should be left to suffer as you are, alone, depressed, suicidal thoughts at times. It's beyond me how you've been allowed to get this down living with family and around friends unless you are skilled and adept at hiding all of this from them somehow. Anyone that clever can learn to change, given the correct help and pathways.

If you can't bring yourself to do it, send me a message with your city and I'll find you someone to connect with, a person with the training, knowledge and background who will know how best to assess you and decide the best course of action for you now. If at first we don't succeed, keep trying, calling, insisting on help! I'll send you a message with my phone number now if you'd rather call me. Don't wait on this, Taylor. Act to get help tonight - at least make the first call and take it from there. Deal?

[yorkietalkjilly]

Originally Posted by yorkietalkjilly

Then let me ask you a question: Would you stay home if the Covid-19 mortality rate in the 25 - 85 age range were 90%, a virtual death sentence to most everyone infected, giving you and your loved ones only a 10% chance of survival should you get Covid-19 or inadvertently pass it on to your mom, dad or grands? Just wondering what it would take to get you to put others' well-being ahead of concerns about your own self.

Please disregard this question, Taylor, and let's shelve further discussion on this until things are better for all of us, which they will be one day. Thanks, Joan, for the hand-sanitizer recall notice.