breeding....show quality....?
 

Hi, I am just curious… in another post someone mentioned that if you were thinking about breeding then you need to get a show quality dog. I was just wondering what everyone else thought of this. I got my little bailey girl from a great breader and baileys parents were not show quality, (her grandparents were) and I have been searching for a sister for bailey for quite a while and have been to many sites and talked to many breeders who seem great (many right here on yt) and on most of these sites all the sires and dams that are listed are not show quality. From what I have learned (and im not claiming to know everything, that is why I am asking you all, because I know that there are so many very knowledgeable people in this group and I am still young and have a lot to learn before I actually breed) but… from what I have learned, a show quality dog is not a common thing and there are many yorkies that are not of show quality that would be fine to breed. I am by no means trying to criticize anyone and my intentions are not to offend anyone. I am just looking for peoples opinions on the subject because like I said, there are many great breeders right here on yt and not all of the dogs they breed are “show” dogs… I really appreciate any input you all may have and value your opinions. Again, I ask… Please please understand that I am only 20 years old and am very interested in breeding and all I am trying to do is gather information at this point so please no critisizm… Thanks so much again everyone!!!
-Kelsie-

I'm no expert, but I think the reason they say it should be show quality is that some breeders feel your dog should be shown and get some points before they are bred. If your dog got points it would prove that if it were bred it would be a dog that would produce pups that would better the breed. I hope this came out right.

Hi, i dont know about the states but here in Ireland people who are looking for yorkies look for IKC registered, the main thing that is checked is health problems, if mom or dad have health issues the buyers need to be informed. They say if they have a physical defect you shouldnt breed them. But not everyone wants a show puppy some people just want a beautiful yorkie friend!!! We bred our two youngest, (our third guy is a yorkie/cairn cross and was rescued so we have no real history on him) and they had beautiful puppies, it was hard sending them to their new homes!!!

i just sent you a pm. i explained it to you. i don't care to get into the age old debate of show people vs. regular breeders that is sure to happen

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breeding
 

Great questions!!!! Alot of newbies wouldnt even ask before they started breeding. But, its all up to you. I, personally think that its just as expensive to breed good quality dogs as it is to breed poor quality dogs. So, why not just breed good quality?? But, show quality dogs are not as easy to get ahold of and there are usually alot of restrictions placed on them by their breeder, and for good reasons. I would check out many kennels/yorkies breeders before I bought anything for breeding. Ask about health problems and health screenings that have been done by the breeder. Maybe find a mentor. Be honest and tell the breeder what you want to accomplish by breeding your yorkie. If the main goal is not $$$$$ and is for the love and betterment of the breed, you should do just fine. Good luck!!! Lynn

I'm not a breeder, but I believe the point of breeding is for the betterment of the breed.
From what I've read, if you don't show your dogs, it's good to at least get them evaluated and looked at to see if they are a good representation of the breed :)

I think that if you're interested in breeding, the best thing you can do is start attending shows and find a show breeder who is willing to mentor you. The purpose of breeding any breed should be to improve that breed and to breed to the standard. By breeding non-show quality (or pet quality) dogs, you are not breeding to the standard and definitely not improving the breed. The majority of breeders, including those on YT, are not show-breeders...that is why there are so many yorkies out there that do not meet the yorkie standard. That's also why so many of our yorkies have genetic problems. Yorkies are so overbred now that many don't even look like yorkies anymore.

here we go again with you. How can you be so naive as to say that unless we show, we are not breeding to the standard? Do you think we don't know the standard? Sure there are a lot of BYB out there but there are also some very, caring, ethical people that have good foundation dogs and know exactly what they are doing. For you to continue to make statements on these threads like you have recently is just plain wrong. a lot of what you say is good, then you ruin it all be making such blanket statements such as the one you just made.


By breeding non-show quality (or pet quality) dogs, you are not breeding to the standard

If you are breeding non-show quality dogs, that means that they have too many faults to do well in the show ring. So therefor they have too many faults to meet the standard. Therfor, you are not breeding to the standard! There are many others on here that would agree with exactly what I said. But if you are breeding non-show quality dogs, you are not bettering the breed.

did you ever consider that there are people that just are not interested in showing. doesn't mean their dogs can't. i have three right now that are not on my website and any of the three could "try' it in the show ring if I were inclined and had the money to show them. you are so full of misinformation that it just overshadows the good things you say. I really think that since you don't show, nor do you breed that you shouldn't even be giving advice in these types of threads. of course i also realize that opinions are like buttholes. everyone has one. and you are certainly welcome to voice "your opinion" on what breeding should be all about. Were it not for an average breeder, I am sure you wouldn't have your baby in your avatar. Did she come from a show breeder? if not, according to the things you are saying, you have just helped another BYb stay in business by purchasing her.

LOL how frustrating is that?? Just because you choose not to show your dogs does NOT in any way mean you are not breeding to standard....I respect your opinion, your lines, and your ethics....I am NOT a breeder nor do I pretend to know what the breeding world is about. I want to thank you for the kind words you have shared with MANY getting started in the breeding world. I see your frustration and trust me you have MANY ON HERE agreeing with what you said too.

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Never mind, I re-read that and it made no sense the way I tried to word it. I just think everyone is entitled to their opinion...show or no show. It's never stopped any of the rest of us from putting in our .02. Why start now.
I see the point...both sides and both points actually...

Oh I agree with Sugarsmom on this one. Just because you choose not to show your dogs does not mean you are not breeding to standard, Thats just crazy to think your dog is only standard if they are showing. lol

Thank you. i know I do. I have received a hundred pm's since the other thread was closed and also about this one...... I can tell you right now that this person is not making any friends it seems. I am not going to say anything else to her in this thread because the Op and I have been sharing pm's. The only purpose this thread will serve now is to start an argument and be closed. it it were a real show person or even a breeder saying all these things, it would have a little more credibility but there will always be those that say if you don't show, you can't breed. Thanks for your support. I am done.

I did say that if the dog isn't shown, it should at least be evaluated by a show breeder or judge. Obviously not everyone is going to be interested in showing, but the dog should at least be evaluated to meet the standard. I never said anything about her having to show the dog anyway. I said the dog should be show-quality (ie. would do well in the show ring IF shown). And just because I don't show or breed doesn't mean I don't know anything about it. I've had conversations with both cat and dog show breeders, and all of them have had basically the same outlook and purpose to breeding...and they all say the purpose to breed is to better the breed. I've also been a member of dog and pet-related forumes other than YT for years and have gained a TON of knowledge about the show world and what a reputable breeder is. And no my dog did not come from a show breeder. She was given to me as a gift for Christmas three years ago. And no I don't believe she came from the best breeder out there, but I didn't buy her. And she's a WONDERFUL pet, I think she's adorable, and I love her more than anything. But I can see her faults. I wouldn't trade her for anything though.

Like I said, being show-quality does not neccessarily mean the dog has to be shown! It just means the dog has to meet the standard. And who cares about making friends...If I think someone isn't a reputable breeder, that's my opinion.

No!!!!! I don't think for a minute people know what the standard looks like.

What would be so hard to have your dog looked over by a professional judge who works with the breed all the time.....anyone who is interested in breeding quality does just that.

I like everyone opinions but the making friends comment was kind of rude..... debate without personal attacks please!!:D

See..that's all I'm saying. I'm not saying you have to show, but you should at least make sure the dog is show-quality and would do well if shown. Even if the dog is not shown, it should be show-quality to breed

eek ... i had no idea that this post would open up such a can of worms! I thank you all for your input... I think the main reason arguments are started on here is not because of what is being said, but THE WAY it is said... There are alot of people in here with TONS of knowledge and then there are others, like me who are young and curious and sometimes people innocently post questions and are bombarded by people with VERY strong opinions... I think maybe if some of us were a little kinder in the way that we approched innocent questions there would be much less bickering... Thank you both that pm'ed me... you each had your own opinion but you were both very helpful and were non threatening and I appreciate that very much!
Thanks to you all for the opinions and I really hope we dont continue to bicker on this thread...

I wasn't personally attacking anyone. It was honestly a general statement. She made the comment that I wasn't making friends, and I just said I wasn't concerned with making friends. I'm here to give my opinion and if someone doesn't agree with me and doesn't want to be my friend then that is fine. I don't always agree with everything my friends do but that doesn't stop me from being friends with them. I really didn't mean anyone in particular by the friends comment. I don't mind debate at all (obviously :) ) but I really do try to keep from being outright rude.

With all of your comments that you have posted recently, I guess it's safe to assume that your Lacy came from a show breeder . ??

Can you imagine how many people would be without their beloved Yorkies if there weren't people that bred "pet quality"? I know,I for one, would be without my precious Harley and Livi.

Just a thought....

From what I have heard (and once again I am just a stupid newbie trying to gather as much knowledge as possible) Good breeders will not sell their "show quality" pups to anyone but people who are going to show... ls this true?

I agree...I don't think you have to show but you can at least get your dogs evaluated by an expert.:thumbup:
I also am of the opinion that the 'no one likes you' and likewise comments are uncalled for and could be excluded from this discussion. They serve no purpose.:(

Oh I know.. I wasn't talking about your statements but the ones that were made TO YOU! you are sharing your opinion gracefully w/o being rude and others are sharing thiers with a personal attack to the people they don't agree with

Not every dog that meets the standard is show quality. Show quality is the best of the best and that is why they deserve to be in the ring. Just because they are not show quality does not mean they arent bred to standard as you are implying. I think that is the point Sugars mom is trying to get across.

If you read one of my previous posts, you'll see that I said that Lacy was given to me as a Christmas gift three years ago so I didn't buy her. Yes, many of us would be without our pets if these breeders didn't exist. I wouldn't trade Lacy for the world, but I don't agree with breeding pet quality dogs

only bad thing about that is, from what I have been reading on another thread, a lot of the judges don't even know the standard anymore. so is it any wonder people get confused. i don't believe anyone is taking issue with remarks being made that people should have their dogs evluated by a judge. that is a great thing to do and I don't believe anyone is taking issue with the statement that all breeders should breed tobetter the breed. that's true. they should. the part I have a problem with is her saying that you shouldn't even breed unless you show because you don't even know the standard. Well, pardon me, but i do know the standard. i know it well and was just a few minutes ago studying in more detail. I study the standard every day and try to commit it to memory as best I can. There is not a day goes by that i don't learn something new. it's just like with me being a retired R.N., when i first graduated, I thought I knew more than the doctors but it wasn't until I actually got the hands on that I knew just how little I did know that's the way I feel about a lot of this stuff on here.