Biewer & Parti-Yorkie---difference?

[TammyJM]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

Really...I thought it was a pretty basic concept myself. If a breeder is implementing black/gold to enhance a blue/gold coat, then how is that not "aiming to meet the standard?"

So it sounds like you are saying that it is okay to play around with the standard but of course, only if you claim to be "enhancing"?

[TammyJM]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

Didn't you see the picture I posted? Not that it matters to me if she meets the standard or not...she's spayed. What's the debate here, because I'm clearly in the dark about whatever it is? Whether or not Partis meet the standard for the YT? I thought everyone here knew that they didn't because of their coloring?

Yeah, saw that picture...didn't you read my words? I said YORKIE pictures...you know, the ones that you have bred.

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by TammyJM

Yeah, saw that picture...didn't you read my words? I said YORKIE pictures...you know, the ones that you have bred.

Oh, Yorkie pictures...so then because of her coloring, she's NOT a Yorkie? I thought that was the opposite of the point you were making?

And as far as "playing around with the standard," I guess that depends on what you mean. YOU were the one that brought up "enhancing," not me and used that terminology, not me. Nor did I say that I agreed or disagreed with it....

[TammyJM]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

Oh, Yorkie pictures...so then because of her coloring, she's NOT a Yorkie? I thought that was the opposite of the point you were making?

And as far as "playing around with the standard," I guess that depends on what you mean. YOU were the one that brought up "enhancing," not me.

So are you now denying that you even own Yorkies and that you breed? You know I am not talking about the Biewer picture that I posted.

And you asked where the debate started...go back to post #20 and that should answer that question.

[JeanieK]

Originally Posted by scrapindee

A parti-yorkie is an akc registered yorkie that cannot be shown in the ring.A Biewer is a rare breed dog. Registered either in the U.S. or Germany. Come look at the Biewer Breed Club of America for complete information: Biewer Breed Club of America Inc. BBCA

Also do a search here on YT as there has been a lot of discussion about Biewers and Partis.

Who said they cannot be shown. Please do not be giving out misinformation to people seeking knowledge. If you are going to answer a question, please make sure you have the facts.

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by TammyJM

So are you now denying that you even own Yorkies and that you breed? You know I am not talking about the Biewer picture that I posted.

Of course I own Yorkies...don't we all? Someone asked for a picture and I posted one. So to answer your question, yes I own Yorkies. And no, at the current time I do not solely own any Yorkies, or any other dog for that matter that resides in my home full time that I breed. Although again, I fail to see the relevance.

Originally Posted by TammyJM

And you asked where the debate started...go back to post #20 and that should answer that question.

Correction: I asked WHAT the debate was, not where it started. I'm fully aware of where it started--the same place it normally does: With the first post that states an opinion (or in this case FACT) that that differs from those of other members.

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by JeanieK

Who said they cannot be shown. Please do not be giving out misinformation to people seeking knowledge. If you are going to answer a question, please make sure you have the facts.

They can be shown? In all honesty, I'm not debating that...I just didn't know that had changed. So if that's the case it's honestly news to me. I thought they were still automatically DQ'd.

Let me ask you this question and get your opinion on it, and I'm not sure how to phrase it....do you think they should be shown WITH the standard colored blue/gold, or do you think there should be separate categories...a blue/gold AND a Parti? (Does that make sense?)

[JeanieK]

Originally Posted by SassyAnn101

After reading all that I still dont know the difference except for the Biewer has a tail, the Parti does not Either way they are Beautiful

Yup that is pretty much it.

And

The partis are AKC the Biewers are not.

[JeanieK]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

I wasn't stating that the color variation wasn't recognized by them. Of course it is or they wouldn't be registerable. I was pointing out that a standard for partis isn't recognized by them. And it's not. I stand by what I stated...there is no set and recognized standard for parti Yorkies.

They are yhorkies, they sre acdcepted as yhorkies by the AKC and the YTCA. Their color is considered a fault, but they still go by the yorkie standard with as color fault. If they were a separate breed, they would have a different standarsd, but since they are yorkies, they go by the yorkie standard. They are first and foremost,"yorkshire terriers", second parti colored yorkshire terriers.




Just as I always state, I agree that a large majority of Yorkies do not fit every single aspect called for by the standard. No argument there. I believe most are aware than lots of dogs are produced that don't meet the standard. I even already stated that the other colors you mentioned did not have a standard as well...which is the truth.
However, that was not the point of my post. My point was to correct the mistatement that there is a standard for Partis, when in fact there isn't.

Sometimes statements that people make are just that...statements of fact...not challenges. Why they are always treated as such is still a mystery to me. Stating that there is no standard for Partis is just that...a statment of fact.

It's pretty simple really. they are yorkies, and go by the standard with a color fault. Some day the fault will be lifted.

[SassyAnn101]

Originally Posted by GreenwoodBiewer

LOL.. actually.. I'm going to even make this MORE confusing.. my Parti boy KEPT his beautiful tail and ALL the Parti's that will be born at my home will keep those magnificant tails.. to mutilate that stunning part of these dogs is criminal in my mind and there is just no earthly reason to do it. Once you've seen these beautiful animals with a tail.. you'll never go back! (just my opinion of course)

-Diana

Oh I agree 100% I just got my first Biewer a few weeks ago, and I am
In Love with her tail

So does a parti with a tail make them a Biewer not reg. as a Biewer?
This is too confusing to my simple mind. When I look at pictures of Parti and Biewers they basically look the same to me. All Beautiful of course

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by JeanieK

It's pretty simple really. they are yorkies, and go by the standard with a color fault. Some day the fault will be lifted.

LOL...exactly. You are right...that is pretty simple.

[WinstonMom]

Originally Posted by Pinehaven

Oh my goodness ... You were misinformed that the parti colored yorkie is a result of a "genetic defect". The recessive genes for the parti color, have been in some of our dogs since the beginning of the breed, the gene is called the piebald gene.

The parti color is not a result of a defective, mutated or compromised gene as some genetically challenged/uneducated people have led you to believe, it's the result of a well known gene that produces white markings.

You need both mother and father to carry this spotting gene in order to produce the parti color, if only one parent carries the gene they will look traditional colored. If the carrier breeds to a non carrier, all of their pups will look traditional in color but 1/2 of the litter will carry the piebald gene, the other half did not receive a copy of the gene from their parti gene carrying parent. This can go on for many, many, many years and generations and will go undiscovered until the carrier offspring is bred to another parti gene carrier ... and than SURPRISE!

I am no Biewer expert ... but depending on which Biewer group you talk to, the Biewer is the same as a parti colored yorkie, in that they were produced from two traditional colored yorkshire terrier parents who both carried the parti gene. Unfortunately, this color was denied registration with their foreign kennel registry, so a club was started with their own registry, which allowed the parti colored biewers to be registered.

Please, before I start, I do not wish to offend any of the Biewer or parti breeders or owners. I think these dogs are quite beautiful. I have a strong educational background in genetics and I do find it odd, that if this piebald gene has been around since the beginning of the breed, let's say with Huddersfield Ben, born 1865, that two of these recessive genes did not manage to find each other until 1984 when the first Biewer puppy was supposedly born. Genetically speaking, this is strange. It would seem more likely that the gene was a more recent mutation than a gene that has been around since the beginning of the breed. Once again, please forgive me, I do not want to start a battle, just my thoughts.

[JeanieK]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

That's just it...you are NOT breeding to the set YT standard--you are following a standard with modifications. There is no set standard for YTs that includes parti coloring.

There are show breeders who admit to breeding dogs over 7 pounds, redlegged yorkies etc. How is that different from breeding the parti color.

The standard is set for judges to judge by, those breeders would never put an over sized yorkie or a red legged yorkie in the ring, but they breed them just the same.

if breeding two perfect yorkies together would produce perfect yorkies every time, there would be no issue, but the truth is, it is a balance of many things that make the perfect yorkie.

[JeanieK]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

So then any dog that *can be registered with AKC* meets standard? I think not. AKC registerable and meeting a standard are not synonomous with one another. Two completely different aspects altogether.

One could register a 10 pound Yorkie with AKC. But if you are breeding them, you can't truthfully say you are breeding to "a standard."

Show breeders do breed yorkies that are not within the standard if they are otherwise correct.

[AprilLove]

Originally Posted by SassyAnn101

Oh I agree 100% I just got my first Biewer a few weeks ago, and I am
In Love with her tail

So does a parti with a tail make them a Biewer not reg. as a Biewer?
This is too confusing to my simple mind. When I look at pictures of Parti and Biewers they basically look the same to me. All Beautiful of course

The Biewers have a written standard for conformation that also includes the tri-color and placement of the tri-colors in its standard.

a Parti with a tail, is still a Parti, but in having the tail, does not meet the YT standard as set forth by YTCA