designer pups...???

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by cesar49

thank you for your kind words.. i dont deserve it..
actually i have learned a new lesson recently.. regarding gus gus..
i was confused about keeping him..
he is now 9 months old.. i was halfheartedly trying to sell him..
but after the incident.. he is going to be bonded to me forever
i am new to breeding and decided to keep one puppy..
gus was the cutest and smartest.. instant love..
but i placed all my other dogs as puppies at 3 months of age with no problems.. i could have sold more puppies easily..
it is best to sell them/ ,place them at 3 months..
do not keep a puppy unless you plan to keep it forever
we learned the hard way..
the story of gus gus is posted in the yorkie brothers and sisters section..
my yorkies did go faster and easier..
but the yorkipoo lovers are out there...
breeders need to be prepared to keep their puppies
and not sell to just anyone for sure..
with the price of gas.. people dont have the extra money
for any type of dog..... purebred or mix..and i like them both

I was wondering how many dogs you have placed, and if you keep in contact with the families afterwards to ensure dogs don't end up at the pound? I expect this of purebred breeders as well, so I hope you understand I'm not singling you out.

[cj125]

I was searching for the definition of "breeder" and below is what I came up with. The highlighted words were already there - I just cut and pasted. I did edit a few lines out.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


Breeder

A breeder is a person who practices the vocation of mating carefully selected specimens of the same breed to reproduce specific, consistently replicable qualities and characteristics.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Dog breeding is the practice of mating selected specimens with the intent to maintain or produce specific qualities and characteristics.
Breeding relies on the science of genetics, so the breeder with a knowledge of canine genetics, health, and the intended use for the dogs attempts to breed suitable dogs.

Purebred breeding
Mating animals of the same breed for maintaining such breed is referred to as purebred breeding. Opposite to the practice of mating animals of different breeds, purebred breeding aims to establish and maintain stable traits, that animals will pass to the next generation. By "breeding the best to the best," employing a certain degree of inbreeding, and selection for "superior" qualities, one could develop a bloodline or "breed" superior in certain respects to the original base stock. However, on the other hand, indiscriminate breeding of crossbred or hybrid animals may also result in degradation of quality.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Backyard breeding The term backyard breeder is a general term used in the USA to describe people who breed animals without selection for important genetic traits. Usually describes those who allow animals, particularly dogs or horses, to procreate regardless of physical or genetic health as opposed to breeders who intentionally screen and select their brood for important characteristics.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


My personal opinion is that...

Anyone "can" breed...
but not everyone is a "'breeder".

Just because you "can" do something...
doesn't mean you "should".

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by cj125

I was searching for the definition of "breeder" and below is what I came up with. The highlighted words were already there - I just cut and pasted. I did edit a few lines out.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


Breeder

A breeder is a person who practices the vocation of mating carefully selected specimens of the same breed to reproduce specific, consistently replicable qualities and characteristics.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Dog breeding is the practice of mating selected specimens with the intent to maintain or produce specific qualities and characteristics.
Breeding relies on the science of genetics, so the breeder with a knowledge of canine genetics, health, and the intended use for the dogs attempts to breed suitable dogs.

Purebred breeding
Mating animals of the same breed for maintaining such breed is referred to as purebred breeding. Opposite to the practice of mating animals of different breeds, purebred breeding aims to establish and maintain stable traits, that animals will pass to the next generation. By "breeding the best to the best," employing a certain degree of inbreeding, and selection for "superior" qualities, one could develop a bloodline or "breed" superior in certain respects to the original base stock. However, on the other hand, indiscriminate breeding of crossbred or hybrid animals may also result in degradation of quality.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Backyard breeding The term backyard breeder is a general term used in the USA to describe people who breed animals without selection for important genetic traits. Usually describes those who allow animals, particularly dogs or horses, to procreate regardless of physical or genetic health as opposed to breeders who intentionally screen and select their brood for important characteristics.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


My personal opinion is that...

Anyone "can" breed...
but not everyone is a "'breeder".

Just because you "can" do something...
doesn't mean you "should".

Excellent post, I hope everyone reads it, and tries to understand what it's saying, I can't tell you how many times I've read people say they don't think they are a back-yard-breeder because they allow their dogs in the house.

[cesar49]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

I was wondering how many dogs you have placed, and if you keep in contact with the families afterwards to ensure dogs don't end up at the pound? I expect this of purebred breeders as well, so I hope you understand I'm not singling you out.

yes i do.. they are all local, and i recently called to check on them.. i have placed eight puppies
i agree that this is the most important part of breeding.. placing them in safe homes with the right people.
the bybs and puppymills get the usda license and sell a young litter to a petstore. then the poor things are shipped like produce.. and end up caged in the backroom of a petstore .. its a wonder any of them are normal..

[yorkiekist]

Originally Posted by cesar49

stop putting words in my mouth i never said yorkie poos have standards

do you have a REAL question? yorkiekist?

What is that supposed to mean??????? I thought my questions were very nice and very polite.

[cesar49]

Originally Posted by yorkiekist

What is that supposed to mean??????? I thought my questions were very nice and very polite.

sorry yorkiekist.. i think i meant yorkieisme
please forgive me

[yorkiekist]

Originally Posted by cesar49

sorry yorkiekist.. i think i meant yorkieisme
please forgive me

Its cool

[ButterflyKisses]

Nancy - you said: The belief that mixing breeds makes for healthier or smarter is false

The below is from wikipedia - it goes along with what three different vet's have told me when I have ask them about the breeding of good quality purebred dogs:

Some dog hybrids are now being selectively bred. The term designer dogs is often used to refer to these mixes and crosses. The practice causes much controversy; opponents cite the often exorbitant prices charged for what may just be a mutt.

While the trend to produce hybrid or designer dogs is considered new it is, in fact, a continuation of the centuries-old practice of selective breeding. Basically every breed of dog is a "mutt" in the sense that every type of dog was created by interbreeding different types of dogs to produce a breed with a certain set of desirable characteristics. All dog breeds were bred for a particular purpose, usually some form of hunting, herding, or guarding. These tasks have been largely replaced by the need to produce healthy dogs with good temperaments as domestic companions or pets. Breeding two different breeds often allows the best traits of both parents to pass through.
Hybrid dogs, created by breeding two purebred dogs of different breeds (crossbred), have the advantage of heterosis, or hybrid vigor, and are often stronger and healthier than either of the parents. This advantage is lost when two hybrids are bred in the attempt to create a breed. The best way to continue taking advantage of hybrid vigor is from the breeding of two different purebred breeds.[/COLOR]

[yorkieisme]

Originally Posted by cesar49

HELLO ...again.. i say.. i do believe in akc standards.. never said i didnt..
i dont think you are really reading my answer

Nope I read it and all of the rest of the stuff you posted on not being of AKC standard when someone breeds a 3lb animal, while you are breeding designer animals. I was trying to get you to realize that you also break the "silent rules" of breeding to the standard. So why is it okay for you to do this, but not for others? Are you trying to produce a new breed? All I was asking is what are you TRYING to get from producing yorkiepoos? What makes them different then the other designer breeds, or purebreeds? Simple question with simple answer. I noticed that you come off very rude when questions are asked of you and about your program, but you are the first one to throw the stone.

Have a Good Day,
J

[jrsygal37]

Originally Posted by cesar49

until they shut down all the puppy mills, we should all go get a rescue dog
and stop breeding..

Don't your breed not only pure breeds but also mixes (Yorkie Poos specifically)? Huh. Good advice just confused. Elaine

[DvlshAngel985]

Originally Posted by cj125

I was searching for the definition of "breeder" and below is what I came up with. The highlighted words were already there - I just cut and pasted. I did edit a few lines out.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


Breeder

A breeder is a person who practices the vocation of mating carefully selected specimens of the same breed to reproduce specific, consistently replicable qualities and characteristics.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Dog breeding is the practice of mating selected specimens with the intent to maintain or produce specific qualities and characteristics.
Breeding relies on the science of genetics, so the breeder with a knowledge of canine genetics, health, and the intended use for the dogs attempts to breed suitable dogs.

Purebred breeding
Mating animals of the same breed for maintaining such breed is referred to as purebred breeding. Opposite to the practice of mating animals of different breeds, purebred breeding aims to establish and maintain stable traits, that animals will pass to the next generation. By "breeding the best to the best," employing a certain degree of inbreeding, and selection for "superior" qualities, one could develop a bloodline or "breed" superior in certain respects to the original base stock. However, on the other hand, indiscriminate breeding of crossbred or hybrid animals may also result in degradation of quality.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Backyard breeding The term backyard breeder is a general term used in the USA to describe people who breed animals without selection for important genetic traits. Usually describes those who allow animals, particularly dogs or horses, to procreate regardless of physical or genetic health as opposed to breeders who intentionally screen and select their brood for important characteristics.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


My personal opinion is that...

Anyone "can" breed...
but not everyone is a "'breeder".

Just because you "can" do something...
doesn't mean you "should".

I too think this is an excellent post! It clearly states the difference between purebred and mixes and doesn't put anyone in a bad light, except fot the BYB and puppy mills (sorry but they deserve to be put in a negative light). I think it helps to illuminate that a good breeder, whether for mixes or purebreds, puts thought and effort into their selection process which is an indication that this person assumes the responsibility of the outcome. Whereas BYB and puppy mills don't put much thought and can have an negative outcome from a breeding (sick puppies ) without taking any responsibility for it. Again, great post!!!

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by ButterflyKisses

Nancy - you said: The belief that mixing breeds makes for healthier or smarter is false

The below is from wikipedia - it goes along with what three different vet's have told me when I have ask them about the breeding of good quality purebred dogs:

Some dog hybrids are now being selectively bred. The term designer dogs is often used to refer to these mixes and crosses. The practice causes much controversy; opponents cite the often exorbitant prices charged for what may just be a mutt.

While the trend to produce hybrid or designer dogs is considered new it is, in fact, a continuation of the centuries-old practice of selective breeding. Basically every breed of dog is a "mutt" in the sense that every type of dog was created by interbreeding different types of dogs to produce a breed with a certain set of desirable characteristics. All dog breeds were bred for a particular purpose, usually some form of hunting, herding, or guarding. These tasks have been largely replaced by the need to produce healthy dogs with good temperaments as domestic companions or pets. Breeding two different breeds often allows the best traits of both parents to pass through.
Hybrid dogs, created by breeding two purebred dogs of different breeds (crossbred), have the advantage of heterosis, or hybrid vigor, and are often stronger and healthier than either of the parents. This advantage is lost when two hybrids are bred in the attempt to create a breed. The best way to continue taking advantage of hybrid vigor is from the breeding of two different purebred breeds.[/COLOR]

Here's the quote I have from Wikipedia:Dog hybrid - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A dog hybrid is the offspring of parents of two different purebred dog breeds, more commonly called a crossbreed or crossbred in animal breeding. Crossbreeding (parents of two different purebred breeds) results in offspring that may be stronger and healthier than either parent, an effect called hybrid vigour, but only if both parents are genetically sound. Many dog crossbreds (hybrids) have been given fanciful or portmanteau names, as in Labradoodle (purebred Labrador Retriever crossed with purebred Poodle.) Further generations of crossbreds bred to crossbreds lose the advantage of hybrid vigour, although they may still be called by the hybrid name, and may eventually be recognized as a separate purebred dog breed.

That little word "may" is extremely important, it is not the same as saying "will." Also notice the other words in bold, "but only if both parents are genetically sound. So in other words this hybrid vigor MAY occur, but ONLY if the parents are genetically sound. People who mix breed seldom test for genetic problems. Also, notice the statement, "that this advantage is lost when the two hybrids are bred in an attempt to create a breed," this means that as soon as the breeder attempts to breed the offspring again, the advantage of hybrid vigor is lost.

[Harley_chik]

Originally Posted by yorkieisme

Are you trying to produce a new breed? All I was asking is what are you TRYING to get from producing yorkiepoos? What makes them different then the other designer breeds, or purebreeds? Simple question with simple answer.

I have yet to come into contact with a breeder or owner of one of the designer mutts that can answer any of these questions adequately. I think the real reasons are cash and novelty. The answers they usually get are flat out lies. The one that get me is the dogs are hypoallergenic. If you cross a dog like a Lab(that sheds like crazy) with a Poodle, there is no way you are going to get an entire litter of nonshedding dogs. To think otherwise is absurd. Sure maltipoos and yorkiepoos are low shedders but the breeds used to creat them are too. I also don't like the hybrid vigor theory. That theory comes from livestock breeding. Anyone else thinking of puppymills and USDA? Livestock are produced for commercial reasons and looks don't play much of a role. Anyone who compares dogs to cattle isn't someone I want to buy a dog from. Most of the purebreds used for producing designer dogs come from petstores and BYB's. How can you be producing healthier dogs, when you're starting out with poor genetics.

One more thing, I'm hard pressed to think of a single AKC recognized breed that was created from crossbreeding, just using two different breeds. Most were created using several different breeds with a clearly defined purpose in mind. There was no "I wonder what it would look like if I crossed these two breeds" or "why don't I breed my female with any old male I can find."

[mscat]

"It is all about money." Bottom line .

[Woogie Man]

Originally Posted by Harley_chik

One more thing, I'm hard pressed to think of a single AKC recognized breed that was created from crossbreeding, just using two different breeds. Most were created using several different breeds with a clearly defined purpose in mind. There was no "I wonder what it would look like if I crossed these two breeds" or "why don't I breed my female with any old male I can find."

The Silky Terrier is a cross between the Australian and Yorkshire Terriers. They were recognized by the AKC in 1959. Since then, they have amended their rules so that crosses between 2 recognized breeds would not be recognized as a purebred.