My dog hate's my son

[JiggityJig]

Completely aside from the dog issue, for a moment....are you sure your adult son moving in with you is the best thing for YOU, and for the other adults that live there?? It doesn't sound like there is a very good dynamic between you, and I could see it escalating and getting ugly.

You've received other good advice here, but to be honest, it sounds like you have a difficult problem on your hands. And whether or not it all BEGAN with your son, it does sound like at this point it's up to HIM (his attitude and approach) whether or not things can improve. If he doesn't really WANT things to be better with Quincy, they won't be, because above all, animals can sense our emotions.

[Cal]

Thank's to all, and for being so blunt. It did hurt my feeling's, I cried for awhile, but I'm feeling much better now. Seriously though, I really do appreciate the help.

I know I'm part of the problem. I promise that will change. I do understand what you guy's mean by let Justin be the one with the good thing's. But what you guy's don't understand is,,,,at this point, they can't be that close. Quincy will attack. He has to be put up.

On a recent episode of The Dog Whisper, a lady had a little bitty dog that would just attack all other dog's it saw. Cesar took one of his very socially adapt dog's to their home. Put the ladies dog on the floor, and it went nut's for a few second's, then when the bigger dog showed no interest, or fear, the little guy stopped.

So what do you think of this idea. I have to start somewhere. I have to have them be able to be in the same room with out Quincy biting. I thought if I put a muzzle on Quincy, put him on the ground, and let him throw his fit with out Justin getting bit. The muzzle would be just a very temporary thing. Hopefully Quincy would do the same thing as the ladies dog. Just kinda give up on the idea. Then I can start on the rest of the idea's.

I'm really at my rope's end here.

[Cal]

Originally Posted by JiggityJig

Completely aside from the dog issue, for a moment....are you sure your adult son moving in with you is the best thing for YOU, and for the other adults that live there?? It doesn't sound like there is a very good dynamic between you, and I could see it escalating and getting ugly.

You've received other good advice here, but to be honest, it sounds like you have a difficult problem on your hands. And whether or not it all BEGAN with your son, it does sound like at this point it's up to HIM (his attitude and approach) whether or not things can improve. If he doesn't really WANT things to be better with Quincy, they won't be, because above all, animals can sense our emotions.

Well you're right. It's not the best situation. Justin goes to collage and has a part time job. He can't afford a place on his own. He's alway's lived with his mom. She had a stroke a couple of year's ago, and is partially paralyzed, and he has been there to take care of her. And that's alot. She now need's to be institutionalized and he has no place to go.

So as long as he is in school, he can stay with me. I think I may have gave the wrong impression when I said I scream and yell at him. That's only when he aggravates the dog. Wouldn't you.

And you're so right about it being up to Justin. I'm going to call him and set thing's straight before he ever move's 1 thing in.

[JiggityJig]

Leaving your dog crated or muzzled does NOT sound like a good idea to me. Is there at least a room where he can be gated off when your son is active and moving around the house?

Then, when Justin is just sitting around watching TV or something, have him wrap up in a thick quilt or blanket, and let Quincy out. Personally, I would have your son remain completely passive and detached....not try to interact with Quincy at all, and just ignore if he tries to bite him through the blanket...just quietly pull the cover over his head if Q goes for the head. The important thing would be for everyone to stay calm and neutral....personally, I wouldn't even correct Quincy.

I'm certainly no expert, and I could be giving you horrible advice right now, but to me it just sounds like Q has NO trust for your son, is feeling protective towards you, and is just panicked by the fact that there is always all this tension and aggression in the air.

So I would think the first step would be to clear out all the angry feelings in the room....J towards Q, you towards J, etc....and just let Quincy work out some of his emotions in a situation where J will still be safe. SURELY, I'm thinking, that after awhile Quincy will stop attacking when he feels like there is no threat being poised in return, and no negative dynamics between you and your son...and then hopefully he'd feel in control, and stop attacking.

When he calmed down, THEN you could just calmly and silently hand him a treat, and you could all continue to just sit there and watch TV. I know this goes against Caesar's approach, but in the cases he works with, there is at least a loving owner and some degree of trust between animal/human. With your son, who is not Quincy's owner anyway, it sounds to me like Quincy needs to feel like he DOES have some degree of control over the situation....and I bet that when he does, he'll calm down, and stop being so aggressive.

And of course, this will be contingent upon your son CEASING his own aggressive actions and attitudes, and also, I think, on relations between YOU and your son staying calm and under control (no shouting, certainly no hitting, etc).

I'd do that couch thing several times, until Quincy was used to it and didn't attack anymore...then maybe try removing the blanket...then maybe try your son beginning to move around more and more, as Quincy was comfortable with it, etc. It sounds like you have a tough row to hoe, and it's certainly not going to get solved all at once. I think you need to look at taking things one step at a time.

Someone else may come along and disagree with me, but the way I'm looking at it, it seems like Quincy needs to be able to feel like he CAN protect you, if necessary, before he'll ever be able to feel comfortable around your son.

[FirstYorkie]

Originally Posted by JiggityJig

... but to me it just sounds like Q has NO trust for your son, is feeling protective towards you, and is just panicked by the fact that there is always all this tension and aggression in the air.

I agree wholeheartedly. This isn't about dominance; it's about trust. Punishing Quincy will only make the problem worse.

[RMKC]

Originally Posted by Sonashe

Your son asked for it... his aggression towards your son is understandable.

I'll be darn letting anyone mistreat my animals never the less a 21 yr old... he should know better.

Let him find another place to live...then he will know who is the dummy!

[browniesmom622]

i had something to say but im gonna follow the rule if you have nothing nice to say , say nothing at all

i feel for the dog its the humans fault (BOTH) and he gets punished in the end
hes just doing what hes taught & hes being tease poor baby

[FirstYorkie]

Originally Posted by Cal

. I thought if I put a muzzle on Quincy, put him on the ground, and let him throw his fit with out Justin getting bit. The muzzle would be just a very temporary thing. Hopefully Quincy would do the same thing as the ladies dog. Just kinda give up on the idea. Then I can start on the rest of the idea's.

I'm sorry that I was so blunt that it made you cry. I really am.

Personally, I'm not opposed to the muzzle idea. Make sure your son has treats in his pocket. Let Q with his muzzle out to do his thing (have a fit, as you put it). Once he calms down, your son can give him very small treats even while the muzzle is still on. You could check ahead of time to be sure that Q can eat a small treat while muzzled. I bet he can.

[I Love Bailey]

From reading your other posts, your dog was rescued and abused before you got him.
I think by crating him and muzzling him, he will feel threatened and act out accordingly.
Your son could remind him of a former owner who was not kind to him and by your son's behavior towards him it just reinforced it. Dogs do not forget people who are mean to them or intimidate them. Try going for walks (all 3 of you) maybe have the dog on a leash while sitting around or watching TV and play ball or some sort of game. Let the dog get used to your son, but your son has to not react violently to the dogs aggressiveness. Put one of your son's (old) shirts in the dogs kennel to let him get used to his smell, and have your son feed him a meal and give him treats.

These are just some suggestions, hope something helps...

[Sweetums]

Cesar Milan had several episodes where there were dogs who were hostile towards members of the owner's family. I would suggest you go to the Blockbuster online site, or if you have Netflix, go there. You can rent a season's worth of episodes at a time. One episode was a woman whose dog did not like her son and attacked him. Cesar said in one instance with the son that the dog considered the woman his property and she had to discourage the mother/son relationship between her and the dog, and discourage the aggressive behavior. Whenever the dog started to snarl at the son and go after him, Cesar made his PSSHT! noise to distract and stop the behavior. The woman wanted to immediately cuddle and comfort the dog, but Cesar said that in that state of mind (the dog's) it would be encouraging the behavior. You give affection when the dog is being calm, submissive not when it is an aggressive state of mind. Cesar repeated this method over and over each time the son sat close to his mother and the dog finally got the message, that it was to be submissive and not act like the owner of the woman instead of the other way around.

The other instance was an African American woman (just describing it a bit so you can perhaps find the episode amongst the various descriptions on Blockbuster or Netflix if you rent it) whose dog did not like the mother and the feeling was mutual. I am trying to remember, but I think the daughter was to bring the dog on a leash to the mother who was sitting calmly and just let them sit side by side without any interaction. If the dog tried to get aggressive, then Cesar made his PSSHT! sound and grasped the dog firmly on the shoulder just under the neck using his third finger and thumb to reprimand him. This is what he calls a "bite" grasp and is what other dogs do when one of the dogs in a pack misbehaves. You do not dig your fingers in too hard, just firmly grasp the dog there like your hand is a mouth and your fingers are the teeth and stop him.

The important part is to communicate the right energy. You have to act as pack leader. You have to "own" your dog and you have to mean business. And btw, a leash is very important. You can't really control your dog's behavior unless you've got it leashed. You don't have to keep the leash in hand, but if the dog is leashed, you can at least grab the leash as soon as the dog makes threatening moves.

The other key is that your son must cease all aggressive moves towards the dog immediately. Otherwise the situation will not be resolved. I would seriously tell your son that unless he stops all aggressive moves, he cannot move in with you, even if he has to live under a bridge. And if he agrees, he must also understand that he will be thrown out of the house if he breaks that rule.

Eventually, in the mother/daughter situation where the dog did not like the mother, the mother was able to just lightly pet the dogs head a few times while Cesar stood on one side and the daughter on the other. The dog tolerated it, and after practicing this knowing that any other behavior would not be allowed, the dog finally came to tolerate the mother and the mother finally began to see the dog as friendly.

But I highly recommend getting those episodes and watching how Cesar handles this problem.

[Cal]

Well I have great news. The first intervention went amazingly well. I heard Quincy barking, so I knew Justin was here. I went upstair's and my mom had all ready put him up. I said this ain't happening. I took Justin in the other room and laid down the law. Then I went and let Quincy out and held him. He barked a couple of time's, and I told him to stop. He did. What happened next I think was the key to everything. Justin's girlfriend was here. She wanted to hold the dog. So I gave him to her. He was sniffing Justin all over her. He was being really observitive as to where Justin was. But he wasn't freeking out. I waited awhile, then I had Justin give him a treat. Quincy was reluctant, but did take it. Then I had Justin give him one each time he walked by.

At one point Quincy was on his back getting a belly rub from Justin's girlfriend. Justin walked down the hall, and Quincy didn't budge. Justin gave him a treat. To me, Quincy was in his most vulnrable state, and didn't freek out.

I know it's not over, but I think it's off to a good start. Quincy never barked again, or showed any aggretion.

Here's a pic of Quincy watching Justin down the hall.

[I Love Bailey]

Good start! Quincy is a cute little guy. His coloring is beautiful!

[JiggityJig]

He's really turned into a handsome guy!

I'm glad things are off to a good start. It's interesting that having the girlfriend there as a sort of neutral buffer (between Q and Justin, and maybe between YOU and Justin!) seemed to help.

I'm glad your son was showing willingness to work on the problem in a positive way. I like the advice you got to try a leash if the aggression gets bad again....and also to just have them learn to tolerate each other in the same room, before Justin really tries to pet him or talk to him a lot.

Good luck!

[Sweetums]

Yay Cal! Way to go!

[FirstYorkie]

Originally Posted by Cal

Well I have great news. The first intervention went amazingly well.

Great start! Sounds you are on the right track. I would continue doing what you are doing and expand it to your son giving Quincy his meals, giving him new toys, etc, etc.

Keep up the good work!