Originally Posted by rbelland (Post 3177709)

I purchased a female yorkie to ad to my breeding program back in July, 2009. Her name is Jazzy and she came from Dee Sester. Dee's Lil' Yorkshire terriers.

I spoke with Dee to see if Jazzy would be of breeding quality, I realize at a younger age it is hard for one to know if the pup is breeding quality. I assumed with Dee's experience and knowledge that the information exchanged with me would be beneficial to my breeding program.

After Jazzy came home I posted a thread giving Dee's Yorkies a good review. Because I assumed Jazzy was everything Dee said, and would make a great addition to my breeding program.

Couple months later I gained some information about Open Font in her lines. Giving her the benefit of the doubt I e-mailed her regarding multiple open font issues she had in her lines. Her response was she had not had multiple dogs with open font, she then gave me her vet info. i then proceeded to contact her vet Dr.********, he was very reluctant to release info w/o her consent. And the impression I gained with speaking with him is that he only saw her dogs for health certs.

I then emailed Dee regarding info I received from her vet and info I gained regarding 1 previous pup (of Dee's breeding) with open font and 2 current pups (one of Dee's breeding and another pup that would be grand sired by Ceeby) that came from Ceeby's line (sire). So I brought that to her attention. Dee responded by telling me to go ahead and breed Jazzy once to see if the open font showed up. With so many open fonts showing up I told Dee I would not breed Jazzy.

That being said I felt that Dee was dishonest regarding the open font issue, I decided if Dee was being dishonest about that, what else would she be dishonest about. I decided to have Jazzy spayed and rehomed to ensure I would not have this problem.

I asked Dee if she was going to do anything about Jazzy. She made the comment she did not have the money nor would have it for 4 months. She also offered a replacement puppy after some time which I though may be be a good a good idea from a different dam/sire. But then referred back to the trust issue. We went back and forth for a while about the money and replacement puppy until I finally asked Dee not to contact me again.

She also sent an email to me asking if I did my research on her. I WILL take responsibility for not digging more into Dee's breeding program. However I believe she was being dishonest from the beginning knowing I was purchasing Jazzy for breeding. As a breeder WE are responsible for selling any dog with an open registration. I would think before a breeder would sell a pup with open registration they would know the lines and be honest with any faults.

I know open font is not the worst thing that could happen. But being that Dee was dishonest about that, what else was she not telling me about Jazzy's lines.

Jazzy has a wonderful new home now where she is loved daily. Jazzy does not have open font.

I am not posting this thread to be vindictive, it is just to make family's more aware of her breeding ethics and program. For my own future reference I will let a little more time lapse before I do breeder review to ensure that the pup is what the breeder states. I think it is also very important to wait on adding a breeding quality pup until they are much older.

This experience has tought me quite a bit. If there is one thing you can take out of this thread, DO YOUR RESEARCH!!!

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom (Post 3177888)

For the most part, I agree with everything Renee has said exceept a few points. Ceeby had one open font puppy about three years ago. That puppy was placed in a pet home with Genie, a Yt member here that did days of research on open font and still wanted her (Ms. Thang0 even tho I tried to give her deposit money back. So ms. Thang went to a loving pet home at a very reduced price and at the age of six months, her font had grown. Ceeby has sired forty puppies and this is the only open font puppy he has ever had. That puppy came from Kandy and ceeby. Then a grandpup was found to have had one along about october I think. The sire of that puppy was from an earluier breeding of kandy and ceeby. I have never sold a sick pup to anyone. it's true I did not have the money to give renee at the time and did tell her I would give her a replacement puppy from other lines. Then things began to happen behind the scenes that have not been made public here. I got mad as anyone would. here is what I know has been done. The pm's and emails started around. ALL my nursery threads were pulled and counted. All my for sale ads were pulled and counted to see how many puppies I have had or sold . Several of my previous buyers were contacted. My friend Rose, KyBlue on here, had bought an open font puppy from Pam Brammett and put her in a review here. Someone even tried to say that was my puppy and that Rose and I were in cohoots as they say. They had misread her review on pam I guess. other things were donee and said. Not saying renee did these things because I really don't know except for a few forwarded pm's who did what.

I think I have only ever sold about five puppies with open registration and it will not happen again. As far as my vet, yes I gave Reneee the number. I always give everyone his number to call. I give my own vaccinations and etc. if my dogs are sick then yes they go the vet. Of course he is not going to give Renee or anyone all the information on all my dogs. only their dogs. it is a liability issue.

one of the last emails I had from renee, I had told her to go ahead and sell jazzy because i could not buy her back at that time. I asked Renee if she would send me a copy of cash's pedigree she got from AKC when I gave her his number. No response. When I saw she had sold Jazzy, I asked 'who to?' no response. At some point we blocked each others email. i don't know what all she wrote. When I saw that Jazzy was being spayed, I wrote her and told her that I would be praying for Jazzy, That is when she said she had told me not to contact her again. I haven't.

As far as being dishonest, no I did not tell renee about the open font puppy years before. Why would I? It closed and it never happened again.until the grandpup. As i said, I think that was thiss past october or early Novemeber . I was devasted and couldn't think what to do or anything else. I contacted Rose, Lucky lady, and told her because I sold Toby on open registration. She was very nice and we worked out for me to return his purchase price over a period of a few months. i did that because I had told her I would even tho she had bred Toby and sold a puppy out of him . and I would have given Renee her replacement puppy if I hadn't found out about all this other stuff. Whether or not she trusted me is up to her. kee Do you guys think breeders tell everyone every little thing that happens with their pups. I think not. These people that have puppies die at birth or soon after, such as Renee had and we have all had, do you honestly think that everyone that buyss a pup from those lines later down the road is going to be told, "Oh by the way, i had a pup die from these parents and I don't know why so something might happen to your pup down the line? I don't think so.

As far as I am concerned, renee has been dishonest also. remember her thread, lies, rumors and gossip? She posted that Ceeby had sired multiple open fonts. She didn't say his line, she said him. i called it to her attention and asked that she correct it. and her response, which I have was, " i know and I will' Well the correction was never made. This is all I have to say aand I will not be responding to anyone else in this thread.

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom (Post 3177888)

For the most part, I agree with everything Renee has said exceept a few points. Ceeby had one open font puppy about three years ago. That puppy was placed in a pet home with Genie, a Yt member here that did days of research on open font and still wanted her (Ms. Thang0 even tho I tried to give her deposit money back. So ms. Thang went to a loving pet home at a very reduced price and at the age of six months, her font had grown. Ceeby has sired forty puppies and this is the only open font puppy he has ever had. That puppy came from Kandy and ceeby. Then a grandpup was found to have had one along about october I think. The sire of that puppy was from an earluier breeding of kandy and ceeby. I have never sold a sick pup to anyone. it's true I did not have the money to give renee at the time and did tell her I would give her a replacement puppy from other lines. Then things began to happen behind the scenes that have not been made public here. I got mad as anyone would. here is what I know has been done. The pm's and emails started around. ALL my nursery threads were pulled and counted. All my for sale ads were pulled and counted to see how many puppies I have had or sold . Several of my previous buyers were contacted. My friend Rose, KyBlue on here, had bought an open font puppy from Pam Brammett and put her in a review here. Someone even tried to say that was my puppy and that Rose and I were in cohoots as they say. They had misread her review on pam I guess. other things were donee and said. Not saying renee did these things because I really don't know except for a few forwarded pm's who did what.

I think I have only ever sold about five puppies with open registration and it will not happen again. As far as my vet, yes I gave Reneee the number. I always give everyone his number to call. I give my own vaccinations and etc. if my dogs are sick then yes they go the vet. Of course he is not going to give Renee or anyone all the information on all my dogs. only their dogs. it is a liability issue.

one of the last emails I had from renee, I had told her to go ahead and sell jazzy because i could not buy her back at that time. I asked Renee if she would send me a copy of cash's pedigree she got from AKC when I gave her his number. No response. When I saw she had sold Jazzy, I asked 'who to?' no response. At some point we blocked each others email. i don't know what all she wrote. When I saw that Jazzy was being spayed, I wrote her and told her that I would be praying for Jazzy, That is when she said she had told me not to contact her again. I haven't.

As far as being dishonest, no I did not tell renee about the open font puppy years before. Why would I? It closed and it never happened again.until the grandpup. As i said, I think that was thiss past october or early Novemeber . I was devasted and couldn't think what to do or anything else. I contacted Rose, Lucky lady, and told her because I sold Toby on open registration. She was very nice and we worked out for me to return his purchase price over a period of a few months. i did that because I had told her I would even tho she had bred Toby and sold a puppy out of him . and I would have given Renee her replacement puppy if I hadn't found out about all this other stuff. Whether or not she trusted me is up to her. kee Do you guys think breeders tell everyone every little thing that happens with their pups. I think not. These people that have puppies die at birth or soon after, such as Renee had and we have all had, do you honestly think that everyone that buyss a pup from those lines later down the road is going to be told, "Oh by the way, i had a pup die from these parents and I don't know why so something might happen to your pup down the line? I don't think so.

As far as I am concerned, renee has been dishonest also. remember her thread, lies, rumors and gossip? She posted that Ceeby had sired multiple open fonts. She didn't say his line, she said him. i called it to her attention and asked that she correct it. and her response, which I have was, " i know and I will' Well the correction was never made. This is all I have to say aand I will not be responding to anyone else in this thread.

Originally Posted by rbelland (Post 3178228)

So let's put it out here...

Dwana's pup threw an open font (Ceeby's line)

Your thang 1 has/had an open font (Ceeby's line)

You had a pup on the ground that had/has Open Font (back to Ceeby's line)

If I am wrong you need to step in here and correct me. You had no intentions on telling me about anything. If you did you would not have been dishonest from the start when I questioned you about Open Fontanel.

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom (Post 3178311)

Yes, Dwana's pup sired an open font. my pup on the ground had a mother that was the littermate to Kc. That was a Kandy and Ceeby breeding. In fact, my first litter. Yes, Ms. Thang out of my second or third litter had an open font that closed as i stated. her mother was also Kandy. Kandy is spayed and has been in a pet home in N/J/ for the past two years .None of the other females he was ever bred to produced an open font. This defect can come from either the male or the female and in these cases, kandy and ceeby were the parents or grandparents.

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom (Post 3177888)

For the most part, I agree with everything Renee has said exceept a few points. Ceeby had one open font puppy about three years ago. That puppy was placed in a pet home with Genie, a Yt member here that did days of research on open font and still wanted her (Ms. Thang0 even tho I tried to give her deposit money back. So ms. Thang went to a loving pet home at a very reduced price and at the age of six months, her font had grown. Ceeby has sired forty puppies and this is the only open font puppy he has ever had. That puppy came from Kandy and ceeby. Then a grandpup was found to have had one along about october I think. The sire of that puppy was from an earluier breeding of kandy and ceeby. I have never sold a sick pup to anyone. it's true I did not have the money to give renee at the time and did tell her I would give her a replacement puppy from other lines. Then things began to happen behind the scenes that have not been made public here. I got mad as anyone would. here is what I know has been done. The pm's and emails started around. ALL my nursery threads were pulled and counted. All my for sale ads were pulled and counted to see how many puppies I have had or sold . Several of my previous buyers were contacted. My friend Rose, KyBlue on here, had bought an open font puppy from Pam Brammett and put her in a review here. Someone even tried to say that was my puppy and that Rose and I were in cohoots as they say. They had misread her review on pam I guess. other things were donee and said. Not saying renee did these things because I really don't know except for a few forwarded pm's who did what.

I think I have only ever sold about five puppies with open registration and it will not happen again. As far as my vet, yes I gave Reneee the number. I always give everyone his number to call. I give my own vaccinations and etc. if my dogs are sick then yes they go the vet. Of course he is not going to give Renee or anyone all the information on all my dogs. only their dogs. it is a liability issue.

one of the last emails I had from renee, I had told her to go ahead and sell jazzy because i could not buy her back at that time. I asked Renee if she would send me a copy of cash's pedigree she got from AKC when I gave her his number. No response. When I saw she had sold Jazzy, I asked 'who to?' no response. At some point we blocked each others email. i don't know what all she wrote. When I saw that Jazzy was being spayed, I wrote her and told her that I would be praying for Jazzy, That is when she said she had told me not to contact her again. I haven't.

As far as being dishonest, no I did not tell renee about the open font puppy years before. Why would I? It closed and it never happened again.until the grandpup. As i said, I think that was thiss past october or early Novemeber . I was devasted and couldn't think what to do or anything else. I contacted Rose, Lucky lady, and told her because I sold Toby on open registration. She was very nice and we worked out for me to return his purchase price over a period of a few months. i did that because I had told her I would even tho she had bred Toby and sold a puppy out of him . and I would have given Renee her replacement puppy if I hadn't found out about all this other stuff. Whether or not she trusted me is up to her. kee Do you guys think breeders tell everyone every little thing that happens with their pups. I think not. These people that have puppies die at birth or soon after, such as Renee had and we have all had, do you honestly think that everyone that buyss a pup from those lines later down the road is going to be told, "Oh by the way, i had a pup die from these parents and I don't know why so something might happen to your pup down the line? I don't think so.

As far as I am concerned, renee has been dishonest also. remember her thread, lies, rumors and gossip? She posted that Ceeby had sired multiple open fonts. She didn't say his line, she said him. i called it to her attention and asked that she correct it. and her response, which I have was, " i know and I will' Well the correction was never made. This is all I have to say aand I will not be responding to anyone else in this thread.

Originally Posted by blueskies (Post 3182287)

I have not been on here for quite awhile and just came across this thread. I know I may be frying myself in the oven posting this, but I am feeling particularly honest and like speaking my mind today, so I am going to post my feelings. This is a curious thread, because I have seen this breeder brag that she has sold many puppies on YorkieTalk, but yet no one has come to defend her. I have no beef with the breeder or the buyer, so this is merely an observation. I do, however, have an acquaintance who has had personal dealings with this breeder and was not happy. The dog that was purchased came to her in bad condition. I know this for a fact, this is not an exaggeration or idle gossip. I know many will request that I name this person and the dog that was purchased, but I will not because I do not feel right posting for someone else. Regardless, I felt I should mention that there are others with grievances. I wonder how many others have had not so good purchases from this breeder, on or off this forum? I noticed that other breeders who have sold puppies on YorkieTalk [with threads in this section] have many people to back up their good breeding practices. It was just odd to me that this breeder states in other posts how many of her puppies have been sold to YorkieTalk members, yet none have come to her rescue to dispute the statements made by the OP. I also went back and noticed that yes, in fact, there are some good reviews about this breeder within this section from over the past few years. However, I also noticed that all the threads were so curiously grouped together one after another, almost as if the buyers were asked to post by the breeder. Of course, that is merely an observation, and could be inaccurate. Just a thought. Now, on to the dispute in question. It does not make sense that the Buyer would block the address of the breeder. Something about that just seems........trivial? Especially from someone who was concerned about their dog and possibly working out a conclusion with the breeder. Something else noteworthy is that all of this is over the health concern of open fontanels in these dogs\' lines. While I feel this isn\'t the worst issue that a Yorkie line could contain, it is still worth mentioning and should be at the very least considered when choosing dogs for a breeding program. My concern would not be with a single tiny puppy who had a font issue, but with multiple dogs having it, I would certainly be suspicious and wary of future problems with more serious issues such as hydrocephalus. An open font is, in theory, a hole in the heat, is it not? That phrase just seems, I don\'t know.........scary. I also find it interesting that while the Breeder seems to note in this thread that an open font is not a serious concern, in a former post the Breeder expresses concern over this very same issue when someone else had the problem. This post was made back on 11-12-08 by Sugar\'s Mom: it is called an open fontanal and is a birth defect. usually, if it is the size of the tip of your little finger, it will gradually close up. if it is larger than that, it doesn\'t usually close and can lead to hydrocephalus which may result in death. You have to be very careful when caring for a puppy with this as any injury to the head can be fatal. if you find an open font in a puppy you have purchased, the breeder should be notified. Obviously it was a serious issue then, but it is not now. Interesting. My final note is this. I saw that it was mentioned that one of the puppies in question Gracie [Miss Thang] was sold at a reduced price due to her open fontanel that this breeder knew about from the beginning. According to her old threads, the puppy that she knew had an open font was originally at a hefty $2000 price tag and reduced to $1500 on page 4, just before it was closed and she was marked as sold to the YorkieTalk member. I also noticed that the member who purchased this puppy said nothing on this thread, despite having been on the forum in the last few days. I have to wonder if there is some kind of misunderstanding, possibly the breeder considers $1500 to be a reduced price? I don\'t. I find it admirable that the breeder returned the money for the one male, however, why the inconsistencies? Why did she not offer to return the money for the female mentioned on this thread? Oh, that\'s right, she did say it was because the OP bashed her after she blatantly lied to her about the issue in the lines. The breeder never disagreed or disputed that she in fact lied to the OP. So I suppose that part is true. She can make all the statements that she wants, but the fact remains: she lied to this buyer, who else will she lie to make a sell and keep her goose out of the fire? I have no ties to the OP or the breeder. I am not even an acquaintance of the OP, have never spoken to her. These are merely observations from an onlooker.

Originally Posted by blueskies (Post 3182287)

I have not been on here for quite awhile and just came across this thread. I know I may be frying myself in the oven posting this, but I am feeling particularly honest and like speaking my mind today, so I am going to post my feelings. This is a curious thread, because I have seen this breeder brag that she has sold many puppies on YorkieTalk, but yet no one has come to defend her. I have no beef with the breeder or the buyer, so this is merely an observation. I do, however, have an acquaintance who has had personal dealings with this breeder and was not happy. The dog that was purchased came to her in bad condition. I know this for a fact, this is not an exaggeration or idle gossip. I know many will request that I name this person and the dog that was purchased, but I will not because I do not feel right posting for someone else. Regardless, I felt I should mention that there are others with grievances. I wonder how many others have had not so good purchases from this breeder, on or off this forum? I noticed that other breeders who have sold puppies on YorkieTalk [with threads in this section] have many people to back up their good breeding practices. It was just odd to me that this breeder states in other posts how many of her puppies have been sold to YorkieTalk members, yet none have come to her rescue to dispute the statements made by the OP. I also went back and noticed that yes, in fact, there are some good reviews about this breeder within this section from over the past few years. However, I also noticed that all the threads were so curiously grouped together one after another, almost as if the buyers were asked to post by the breeder. Of course, that is merely an observation, and could be inaccurate. Just a thought. Now, on to the dispute in question. It does not make sense that the Buyer would block the address of the breeder. Something about that just seems........trivial? Especially from someone who was concerned about their dog and possibly working out a conclusion with the breeder. Something else noteworthy is that all of this is over the health concern of open fontanels in these dogs\' lines. While I feel this isn\'t the worst issue that a Yorkie line could contain, it is still worth mentioning and should be at the very least considered when choosing dogs for a breeding program. My concern would not be with a single tiny puppy who had a font issue, but with multiple dogs having it, I would certainly be suspicious and wary of future problems with more serious issues such as hydrocephalus. An open font is, in theory, a hole in the heat, is it not? That phrase just seems, I don\'t know.........scary. I also find it interesting that while the Breeder seems to note in this thread that an open font is not a serious concern, in a former post the Breeder expresses concern over this very same issue when someone else had the problem. This post was made back on 11-12-08 by Sugar\'s Mom: it is called an open fontanal and is a birth defect. usually, if it is the size of the tip of your little finger, it will gradually close up. if it is larger than that, it doesn\'t usually close and can lead to hydrocephalus which may result in death. You have to be very careful when caring for a puppy with this as any injury to the head can be fatal. if you find an open font in a puppy you have purchased, the breeder should be notified. Obviously it was a serious issue then, but it is not now. Interesting. My final note is this. I saw that it was mentioned that one of the puppies in question Gracie [Miss Thang] was sold at a reduced price due to her open fontanel that this breeder knew about from the beginning. According to her old threads, the puppy that she knew had an open font was originally at a hefty $2000 price tag and reduced to $1500 on page 4, just before it was closed and she was marked as sold to the YorkieTalk member. I also noticed that the member who purchased this puppy said nothing on this thread, despite having been on the forum in the last few days. I have to wonder if there is some kind of misunderstanding, possibly the breeder considers $1500 to be a reduced price? I don\'t. I find it admirable that the breeder returned the money for the one male, however, why the inconsistencies? Why did she not offer to return the money for the female mentioned on this thread? Oh, that\'s right, she did say it was because the OP bashed her after she blatantly lied to her about the issue in the lines. The breeder never disagreed or disputed that she in fact lied to the OP. So I suppose that part is true. She can make all the statements that she wants, but the fact remains: she lied to this buyer, who else will she lie to make a sell and keep her goose out of the fire? I have no ties to the OP or the breeder. I am not even an acquaintance of the OP, have never spoken to her. These are merely observations from an onlooker.

Originally Posted by rbelland (Post 3182445)

I wanted to say that Dee did offer to pay me back, but after having litters constantly she had no money then:rolleyes:. I got tired of it and asked her to not contact me again.

That brings up another topic. A reputable breeder with a health guarentee would have held back money for the year (however long health guarentee is). I know some people have contracts that state they will only replace the puppy, but I would think if one had problems they would do the right thing. No matter what the contract states. Or maybe that is just me?

I saw the thread you are speaking of. I actually have it right in fron of me on paper.
I also have this POST - #12 #24
http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/bre...-fontanel.html

Originally Posted by rbelland (Post 3182494)

Not really sure what this means about ad's. But thought I would throw this out here. How to delete ad's. I am a bit confused.:confused::confused::confused:

http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/sit...words-ads.html

Originally Posted by Mardelin (Post 3182496)

Renee,

Don't know if you remember....but, at times we would have some words within our posts show up green. The post was speaking how to get rid of them.

Originally Posted by Mardelin (Post 3182496)

Renee,

Don't know if you remember....but, at times we would have some words within our posts show up green. The post was speaking how to get rid of them.

Originally Posted by blueskies (Post 3182287)

I have not been on here for quite awhile and just came across this thread. I know I may be frying myself in the oven posting this, but I am feeling particularly honest and like speaking my mind today, so I am going to post my feelings. This is a curious thread, because I have seen this breeder brag that she has sold many puppies on YorkieTalk, but yet no one has come to defend her.

It was never my intention to brag and most of the people I have sold puppiess to have long since left Yt because of the drama.

I have no beef with the breeder or the buyer, so this is merely an observation. I do, however, have an acquaintance who has had personal dealings with this breeder and was not happy.[COLOR="Red"]
[/COLOR

I would like to know who this person but I understand if you cannot break a confidence. I have only ever shipped a handful of puppies. They are vet checked for a health cert two or three days before they leave me. Then when the buyer picks them up at airport, they call me and let me know how the puppy arrived. THEN, when they take it to their vet, they also let me know what the vet said. I have had a couple that went potty on themselves in the crate. I have shipped a very few in cargo. I have personally flown some to the buyer, I have met people at my airport or they hae come here to my home to get them.

exaggeration or idle gossip. I know many will request that I name this person and the dog that was purchased, but I will not because I do not feel right posting for someone else. Regardless, I felt I should mention that there are others with grievances. I wonder how many others have had not so good purchases from this breeder, on or off this forum? I noticed that other breeders who have sold puppies on YorkieTalk [with threads in this section] have many people to back up their good breeding practices. It was just odd to me that this breeder states in other posts how many of her puppies have been sold to YorkieTalk members, yet none have come to her rescue to dispute the statements made by the OP. I also went back and noticed that yes, in fact, there are some good reviews about this breeder within this section from over the past few years. However, I also noticed that all the threads were so curiously grouped together one after another, almost as if the buyers were asked to post by the breeder. Of course, that is merely an observation, and could be inaccurate. Just a thought. Now, on to the dispute in question. It does not make sense that the Buyer would block the address of the breeder. Something about that just seems........trivial? Especially from someone who was concerned about their dog and possibly working out a conclusion with the breeder. Something else noteworthy is that all of this is over the health concern of open fontanels in these dogs\' lines. While I feel this isn\'t the worst issue that a Yorkie line could contain, it is still worth mentioning and should be at the very least considered when choosing dogs for a breeding program. My concern would not be with a single tiny puppy who had a font issue, but with multiple dogs having it, I would certainly be suspicious and wary of future problems with more serious issues such as hydrocephalus. An open font is, in theory, a hole in the heat, is it not? That phrase just seems, I don\'t know.........scary. I also find it interesting that while the Breeder seems to note in this thread that an open font is not a serious concern, in a former post the Breeder expresses concern over this very same issue when someone else had the problem. This post was made back on 11-12-08 by Sugar\'s Mom: it is called an open fontanal and is a birth defect. usually, if it is the size of the tip of your little finger, it will gradually close up. if it is larger than that, it doesn\'t usually close and can lead to hydrocephalus which may result in death. You have to be very careful when caring for a puppy with this as any injury to the head can be fatal. if you find an open font in a puppy you have purchased, the breeder should be

Something I copied and pasted when I first started breeding.

notified. Obviously it was a serious issue then, but it is not now. Interesting. My final note is this. I saw that it was mentioned that one of the puppies in question Gracie [Miss Thang] was sold at a reduced price due to her open fontanel that this breeder knew about from the beginning. According to her old threads, the puppy that she knew had an open font was originally at a hefty $2000 price tag and

reduced to $1500

She did not sell for that much.

on page 4, just before it was closed and she was marked as sold to the YorkieTalk member. I also noticed that the member who purchased this puppy said nothing on this thread, despite having been on the forum in the last few days.

There is another username very similar. I contacted my buyer last night on facebook and she told me she has not been on YT in about two years because of the drama.

I have to wonder if there is some kind of misunderstanding, possibly the breeder considers $1500 to be a reduced price? I don\'t. I find it admirable that the breeder returned the money for the one male, however, why the inconsistencies? Why did she not offer to return the money for the female mentioned on this thread? Oh, that\'s right, she did say it was because the OP bashed her after she blatantly lied to her about the issue in the lines. The breeder never disagreed or disputed that she in fact lied to the OP. So I suppose that part is true. She can make all the statements that she wants, but the fact remains: she lied to this buyer, who else will she lie to make a sell and keep her goose out of the fire? I have no ties to the OP or the breeder. I am not even an acquaintance of the OP, have never spoken to her. These are merely observations from an onlooker.

Originally Posted by rbelland (Post 3182445)

I wanted to say that Dee did offer to pay me back, but after having litters constantly she had no money then:rolleyes:.

Thank you for posting this. I could have made payments to you but you wanted your money in a hurry. I just couldn't do that I hate to put ,y financial situation on here. I did not have puppies constantly in 2009. In fact, I only had one litter of pups to sell besides jazzy. That I can remember. I bred a couple of dogs but those pups were not ready until this year. We went into Credit Counseling in December of 2008 in order to pay our debts and not have to file bankruptcy. That tied us up for four years. We are just coming up on two years in December. If you want to contact me, I will give you the name of our counselor and the terms but I will not put that info on here. I can have you added into that if you wish.

I got tired of it and asked her to not contact me again.

That brings up another topic.
(however long health guarentee is). I know some people have contracts that state they will only replace the puppy, but I would think if one had problems they would do the right thing. No matter what the contract states. Or maybe that is just me?

I saw the thread you are speaking of. I actually have it right in fron of me on paper. The post mentioned here was copied and pasted. The link you provided was written by me.

I also have this POST - #12 #24
http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/bre...-fontanel.html

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom (Post 3182823)

I accidently deleted what you had written about holding money back for your contract when I tried to highlight it. But you are right. Breeders should keep money back. Hindsight is twenty twenty and I need the money to buy groceries and etc. it has been a very rough year and a half for us. Not making excuses just stating the facts. It kills me to post such personal info but I felt it needed to be done.

I truly am done this time. I will not be back on this thread no matter how bad I am bashed.

Originally Posted by rbelland (Post 3182834)

I am simply stating my experience with you. I am not bashing.

As far as the money is concerned, I had asked you if you could give me a good faith deposit back on Jazzy. You told me you did not even have that.

Kind of funny because when I purchased Jazzy you were so quick to get your deposit. It had only been a couple months. Actually, you sent a couple e-mails asking for it. I had no problem giving you the full price of Jazzy. IMO, I think you could have given me the same respect.

I know, I know your contract states you do not have to do anything. I get it, I really do. I read it in so many of your e-mails how could I forget.

Originally Posted by Mardelin (Post 3182865)

Renee',

Let me commend you on your courage in taking responsibilty in this situation. I understand your reasons for doing so was to help prevent others from not making the same mistake you did. Educate those in a hurry, the unsuspecting public; to research. Teach the responsibilities of good breeding practices and all that goes along with it. Ethics, honesty and most of all breeding the best of the best. Not doing so is only perpetuating the health issues that plague our chosen breed.

Originally Posted by BonBon (Post 3182891)

I'm in full agreement with Mary, Renee.

The ethics and moral integrity you've shown as a new breeder are impressive. It's unfortunate that some breeders who've been around for decades don't have your strength of character. Not only did you recognize a health flaw in Jazzy's line that should be bred and refuse to breed her, you made sure she was placed in a loving home after she was spayed. Thank you for setting such a high example for other breeders to achieve.

Bonny

Originally Posted by rbelland (Post 3182834)

I am simply stating my experience with you. I am not bashing.

As far as the money is concerned, I had asked you if you could give me a good faith deposit back on Jazzy. You told me you did not even have that.

Kind of funny because when I purchased Jazzy you were so quick to get your deposit. It had only been a couple months. Actually, you sent a couple e-mails asking for it. I had no problem giving you the full price of Jazzy. IMO, I think you could have given me the same respect.

I know, I know your contract states you do not have to do anything. I get it, I really do. I read it in so many of your e-mails how could I forget.