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Old 10-21-2014, 02:34 PM   #1
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Default Advice PLEASE! Ugh!

I am in quite a pickle. My 3 yr old 5 lb little girl is pregnant!!! And to top it off-- its only just been confirmed today and she's apparently due in a week-10 days... Oh my goshhhh.

I have no idea how this is my luck. I have her with me basically 24/7. Buttt a couple months ago i was in between moving and my parents had her for about 3 weeks. They have a yorkie. In tact. Some way...some how... Timing was oh-so-perfect to have her go into heat at that time. Its the ABSOLUTE only way this could have happened. & here's a KICKER... The only possible stud is HER BROTHER& LITTER MATE. I am 100% serious (


Now--mind you-- i had no idea she had gone through a heat or that any sort of weird activity had happened. A couple days ago i finally accepted that she definitely had something going on... And then came to the shocking conclusion that she might be pregnant. I couldnt beleive it. I then proceeded to do a puppy cut --going extra close to her tummy ( i keep her coat long so i hadnt even noticed her tummy) i feel so stupid!!! I did light palpation and kept a keen eye on her and confirmed my fears... As much as someone with my experience could. Ugh ugh ugh


Today was the vet visit-- and i was disgusted by the attitude from them. They are advising me to spay her NOW. Is this an actual option???!! It seems horrific. An xray confirmed three puppies. Oh and the vets terms were... " we will basically take out her uterus an the litter will be tossed out"
!thats right...!! TOSSED OUT??!? I almost lost it. The general attitude and knowledge i got from the vet made me positive i was the smartest person in the room. So uncomfortable. Ick ick ick.
Maybe im over reacting here.. But i just feel like its absolutely disgusting and horrific to think of killing pups so far along. I mean, my knowledge is limited, but if they are already calcified..she has got to be somewhere around 47 days or more...right??
Ive assisted a whelp before--everything went smooth..but this could go bad..but i have a little experience. Not much. But im comfortable and im willing to learn ALL I CAN and cram it into a few days.. I can and will if need be.


Maybe im wrong but my heart is breaking here. I do not want to risk anything happening to my little sugar-love. im so torn.
I have so many things in my mind
-will the puppies be defective because of brother/sister mating?
-is the "spay" an actual option here...what are the risks?
-should i risk he having the pups with her size??? ( money is not an issue..if c-section was needed..but i dont know much about it..could she be harmed??)
- why oh WHY...& HOW COULD I LET THIS HAPPEN.


Help please. I need real advice i can trust!! I need to make a decision




:S .....
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Old 10-21-2014, 05:01 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BarraKeata View Post
I am in quite a pickle. My 3 yr old 5 lb little girl is pregnant!!! And to top it off-- its only just been confirmed today and she's apparently due in a week-10 days... Oh my goshhhh.

I have no idea how this is my luck. I have her with me basically 24/7. Buttt a couple months ago i was in between moving and my parents had her for about 3 weeks. They have a yorkie. In tact. Some way...some how... Timing was oh-so-perfect to have her go into heat at that time. Its the ABSOLUTE only way this could have happened. & here's a KICKER... The only possible stud is HER BROTHER& LITTER MATE. I am 100% serious (


Now--mind you-- i had no idea she had gone through a heat or that any sort of weird activity had happened. A couple days ago i finally accepted that she definitely had something going on... And then came to the shocking conclusion that she might be pregnant. I couldnt beleive it. I then proceeded to do a puppy cut --going extra close to her tummy ( i keep her coat long so i hadnt even noticed her tummy) i feel so stupid!!! I did light palpation and kept a keen eye on her and confirmed my fears... As much as someone with my experience could. Ugh ugh ugh


Today was the vet visit-- and i was disgusted by the attitude from them. They are advising me to spay her NOW. Is this an actual option???!! It seems horrific. An xray confirmed three puppies. Oh and the vets terms were... " we will basically take out her uterus an the litter will be tossed out"
!thats right...!! TOSSED OUT??!? I almost lost it. The general attitude and knowledge i got from the vet made me positive i was the smartest person in the room. So uncomfortable. Ick ick ick.
Maybe im over reacting here.. But i just feel like its absolutely disgusting and horrific to think of killing pups so far along. I mean, my knowledge is limited, but if they are already calcified..she has got to be somewhere around 47 days or more...right??
Ive assisted a whelp before--everything went smooth..but this could go bad..but i have a little experience. Not much. But im comfortable and im willing to learn ALL I CAN and cram it into a few days.. I can and will if need be.


Maybe im wrong but my heart is breaking here. I do not want to risk anything happening to my little sugar-love. im so torn.
I have so many things in my mind
-will the puppies be defective because of brother/sister mating?
-is the "spay" an actual option here...what are the risks?
-should i risk he having the pups with her size??? ( money is not an issue..if c-section was needed..but i dont know much about it..could she be harmed??)
- why oh WHY...& HOW COULD I LET THIS HAPPEN.


Help please. I need real advice i can trust!! I need to make a decision




:S .....
You should ask this in the General forum, sometimes over a 100 people are on it at a time.

First off--you should not blame yourself for the accidental mating of your yorkie--what's done is done, and you shouldn't continue beating yourself up about it--this of it as a small blessing--three little lives are inside of your yorkie!

Next: 5 pounds is not that small--it is actually the average weight for yorkies. http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/bre...ng-weight.html

For the brother/sister mating, see here: http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/gen...hy-babies.html

If you were disgusted with the vet, I think you should go to another vet and get a second opinion, maybe even a third. Only way to be sure. Are you doing an at-home birth, or are you doing it at the vet?

Some dog websites on pregnancy & labor:

Stages Of Canine Labor - When Your Dog Gives Birth

http://www.marvistavet.com/html/givi...o_puppies.html

Dog in Labor Sign & Stages
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Old 10-21-2014, 05:10 PM   #3
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American College of Theriogenologists


My advice is to find a reproduction specialist; above is the website. And you have no time to lose.


You are in a difficult situation for sure. 7-10 days out from a whelp date... The fact that she is 5lbs is not as important as her overall health and the size of the puppies versus the pelvic ring. The vet should have given you an indication if the pups could safely be birthed.


The sister brother mating is very ill advised - I personally would abort the litter if the ovariohystercomy would not put her at undue risk. That risk being compared to going through with a whelp.... And with a brother sister mating you are doubling up on any recessive genetic traits that are with-in their line.


You definitely need an experienced second opinion from preferably a reproduction specialist.


On the vets attitude I am sorry but he was being blunt, whether he discussed the risks of a very late spay abortion versus whelping I have no idea.


Your gal is 3years old and you kept her intact - she has gone through at least 3-5 heats since you have had her. Surely as a responsible owner you have tracked those heats to know when she is next due to come into season. Yet you sent her off into a home with an intact male. Did she cycle early very early based on her previous heat cycles? Like it or not these facts might have colored your vets attitude.


As I said you are in a hard place with scant time to make a decision. For me that decision first would be on the medical risks to my female, second the health of any litter she might or may not successfully birth.
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Old 10-21-2014, 07:23 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gemy View Post
American College of Theriogenologists


My advice is to find a reproduction specialist; above is the website. And you have no time to lose.


You are in a difficult situation for sure. 7-10 days out from a whelp date... The fact that she is 5lbs is not as important as her overall health and the size of the puppies versus the pelvic ring. The vet should have given you an indication if the pups could safely be birthed.


The sister brother mating is very ill advised - I personally would abort the litter if the ovariohystercomy would not put her at undue risk. That risk being compared to going through with a whelp.... And with a brother sister mating you are doubling up on any recessive genetic traits that are with-in their line.


You definitely need an experienced second opinion from preferably a reproduction specialist.


On the vets attitude I am sorry but he was being blunt, whether he discussed the risks of a very late spay abortion versus whelping I have no idea.


Your gal is 3years old and you kept her intact - she has gone through at least 3-5 heats since you have had her. Surely as a responsible owner you have tracked those heats to know when she is next due to come into season. Yet you sent her off into a home with an intact male. Did she cycle early very early based on her previous heat cycles? Like it or not these facts might have colored your vets attitude.


As I said you are in a hard place with scant time to make a decision. For me that decision first would be on the medical risks to my female, second the health of any litter she might or may not successfully birth.
and if you do not spay her now you need to before she goes into another heat if you don't lose her. Keeping a non breeding female intact is not a good idea there are infections they can get when left intact that can kill them.
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Old 10-21-2014, 10:30 PM   #5
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Thank you all for your input!
I have an appointment at her old vet out of town on thursday. Its gunna be one heck of a wait.. ( we recently moved)so, initially i chose to opt for a vet in town.. But given the circumstances.. A good long drive to a vet i know and trust will be worth it-- ive been with them for years.

As far as the heat monitoring.. Her d.o.b. is jan 5 2012 ( not exactly 3... But soon to be)Admittedly yes, if it would have been on my mind, i would have realised she was due for a heat. Thats on me. Theres was just so much goin on at the time. As far as her cycles go, she didnt have her first heat until almost a year old, and continually had what i considered irregular heats. They were about 7 months apart & basically silent. Another shame on me for not spaying... I know. This would have been her 4th heat.. I have also an older yorkie, her heats, as i remember them were CLEAR AND IN THE OPEN. diapers an liners and all the works. My little Nova(girl of discussion) hardly bleeds or shows any signs. My parents probably were none the wiser. Not thier fault. I should have been on top of things and made them aware. Again, alot was going on and i just completely had it out of my mind.
This whole thing is such a mess-- im well aware of the horrors my negligence have brought upon her.

All said and done.. All that really matters in the end is that she is safe. I couldnt bear losing her. She is my world. I have alot of info to go through and hopefully i wil have a well informed mind going into the vet on thursday. Whichever decision i make here... Theres a tough road ahead. Please keep my poor girl in your prayers.

Thanks again
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Old 10-22-2014, 04:18 AM   #6
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Praying for your baby girl.
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Old 10-22-2014, 04:26 AM   #7
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Here's to hoping the vet visit is enough to help you make a decision! Keep us posted please!! Well wishes.
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Old 10-22-2014, 07:37 AM   #8
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OMG - what a terrible predicament you, and your sweet baby girl, are in. I have zero experience in the questions you are asking, but thought to drop in to say I wish that you don't keep beating yourself up on this. What's done is done. I know, easy for me to say, but honestly, try your very best. So glad that you are making the trip to the vet you've been with for years!! Hoping you get some helpful info there. Sending LOADS of positive thoughts to you, and your girl, for the best outcome for all involved.
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Old 10-22-2014, 09:25 AM   #9
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A vet you trust is great but you really need to not waste time and go to a reproductive specialist.
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Old 10-22-2014, 10:15 AM   #10
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Whatever the outcome is I pray that you have both yours and your parents dogs altered so that future accidents like this do not happen again. What a terrilbe situation to be in when there are no good answers. If it were me I would terminate immediately. The chances of having a litter of puppies under these circumstances IMO is just not worth all the risks. Hopefully, your vet appointment today guides you in this direction.
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Old 10-22-2014, 10:26 AM   #11
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I am wondering, don't they do C-sections on dogs when the pups are too big to birth? Well that may be an option for you! Trust your vet and have peace about this.
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Old 10-22-2014, 11:53 AM   #12
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Sorry Xrays can only tell minimal information. They won't tell if there is LS or LP, or Chiaria, or the other 21 genetic diseases that Yorkies are prone to.


X rays can tell relative size of puppies and if they should be able to go through the birth canal.
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Old 10-22-2014, 12:42 PM   #13
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X-rays show bones that's it for the most part unless the bone has a defect you will not know if these puppies are going to have deformities of some sort or if they will have any of the other genetic issues that yorkies have.
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Old 10-22-2014, 02:50 PM   #14
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There is more risk for her to have the pups then spay. I think a vet with heart would think of that. Im God Fearing too but I see nothing wrong with terminating a dog pregnancy. Dogs are in our care and we have to make the best decisions regarding their care and well being. God put animals on earth for us to do that.
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Old 10-23-2014, 11:32 AM   #15
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You've been given lots of good advice! A Specialist would truly know what would be best.
Personally my thoughts are a spay and abort now. The risk for your Mama is high giving birth and taking care of puppies.
It may even be more humane to abort, since the brother/sister breeding may give the puppies a lifetime of suffering with genetic issues. And.. she'd be spayed for future visits with her brother.
Not a good scenario for sure!
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