Where to order vaccines

[concretegurl]

Originally Posted by Yorkiemom1

I am happy you admit that you "know your place". Good for you!

I know!

It takes an honest person fully in-sync with reality to know such things!

I've always admired her for that.

Can you imagine there are so many others out there who don't and otherwise would make snarky or snide remarks about someone who is so knowledgeable and admirable in their actions and choices...

[Yorkiemom1]

Originally Posted by concretegurl

I know!

It takes an honest person fully in-sync with reality to know such things!

I've always admired her for that.

Can you imagine there are so many others out there who don't and otherwise would make snarky or snide remarks about someone who is so knowledgeable and admirable in their actions and choices...

I agree completely! We must all know our limitations! Keeps us on safe ground with our decisions, and earns us the respect and admiration of our associates! I know it has served me very well in my life, and I expect it to continue!

[kjc]

Originally Posted by megansmomma

I too am a medical professional and know my place while speaking to the surgeons that I work with daily. Again, I think you are overstepping your profession as a nurse and mixing breeding, nursing and vet medicine into one lump.

Originally Posted by megansmomma

When you are a professional you do not need to boast of the knowledge that you hold. It will be seen clearly from the articulate and well thought out posts that are shared with other members. I hate when I try to read "information" that is filled with jumbled inaccuracies.

.....

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by concretegurl

I'm not a breeder.

Over/early vaccinating is horrid, in fact I know a few very reputable breeders who refuse to vaccinate their "stock" period and only vaccinate the pups at their vets before going to their forever homes because it is legal required.

Please get a vet that will give you a breeder discount, come to your home if possible, and follow the Dr. Dodd protocol (as the reputable breeders here follow, swear by, recommend and caution buyers about finding vets who agree).

In the least this lets you off the hook for lots of liability issues and safeguards you against issues with the vaccines themselves as well as proper documentation for the future of the pups and their adoptive families.

I have always been torn on this because I know (several family members and close friends) who do their own vaccinations. I don't like it I say so and then hold my tongue because my opinion was stated.

Rabies in CA cannot be given to individuals for self administration to pets strange as it is the only required vaccine thus I think that's very telling.

Feed store vaccines are usual multi vaccines and wholesale bulk-so they aren't always name brand and or specialty singles most vets recommend for small dogs-like Yorkies.

Let the vet do this research and stay current on what's recalled no longer reccomended and what has been found to be problematic-vet's get drug company updates, current research articles etc that breeders and others would have to regularly seek out.

I, as a buyer have more confidence in a breeder who leaves, dew claw removal, tail docking and vaccinating to their vet in the proper setting...not a DIY task to save $. <--just MHO.

I really think you haven't had a chance to talk to really great breeders, they are not giving shots, docking tails, and removing dew claws to save money. A really great breeder does study this, has a mentor who trains, and takes classes as well. Vets don't always have breed specific knowledge and a great breeder does. I must admit, I would not trust most breeders to do this, but then again, I would not buy a dog from most breeders.

[lynzy420]

Originally Posted by Yorkiemom1

Lambert and Revival vet supply....I personally would not buy vaccines from a feed store! You need to have the health records to record your vaccinations....you buy them at the same time you buy your vaccines. I use Pro-Gard 5...10 years, never had a problem, knock on wood....you stick the label from the bottle onto the record....Be advised, a lot of vets will insist the owners of the new puppies re-vaccinate the babies....I always tell my buyers to talk with their vet of choice and see if they will accept the vaccinations I have given....if not, rather than risk OVER VACCINATING the baby, they need to reconsider the vet choice. I always interview my new owners vets also, just to re-inforce that I am an RN who is very well aware of temperature ranges for vaccines, and I know how to give injections. I sign my health certs with my professional signature. In 10 years, I have only had one vet not work with the new owner, and new owner did not listen to my advise. He re-vaccinated the puppy, gave the baby Lepto. injection, the baby had an anaphylactic reaction, died on the way home from the vet....and then the owner wanted me to refund her money!

I'm a little confused probably but surely your not comparing your RN license to that of a Vet License are you? Surely the medical practice of human and animal is not to be compared, correct? I'm just afraid you may be to jaded and your information somewhat misleading, and perhaps a tad overstepping your professional boundaries?

Please don't misconstrue what I'm saying or take it as a personal attack, I'm just a little concerned. Please clarify.

[Nancy1999]

I'm confused about all this talk about telling your vet what to do? As a pet owner, I told my vet I did not want yearly booster shots, I preferred to get titers. I also told him I didn't want the lepo shot on the advice of my breeder. Since when are giving shots some medical procedure? Diabetics give shots and little training is needed. Certainly an RN is qualified to give a shot and understand the dosage recommendations and need for quality control. All these things are legal as well. The only reason the rabies shot can’t be given by anyone other than a vet is because any time some disease effects the human population, special precautions have to be made to insure it’s done properly. Again, not saying that most breeders should give shots, but this wouldn’t affect my judgment on the breeder’s qualification as a good breeder one way or the other.

[107barney]

I don't have to tell my vet about not giving annual shots since they don't give annual shots. The vets doing annual shots are making business decisions. I feel bad for people who have to actually have this convo with their vets.

[lynzy420]

Originally Posted by 107barney

I don't have to tell my vet about not giving annual shots since they don't give annual shots. The vets doing annual shots are making business decisions. I feel bad for people who have to actually have this convo with their vets.

This

[jp4m2]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

I'm confused about all this talk about telling your vet what to do? As a pet owner, I told my vet I did not want yearly booster shots, I preferred to get titers. I also told him I didn't want the lepo shot on the advice of my breeder. Since when are giving shots some medical procedure? Diabetics give shots and little training is needed. Certainly an RN is qualified to give a shot and understand the dosage recommendations and need for quality control. All these things are legal as well. The only reason the rabies shot can’t be given by anyone other than a vet is because any time some disease effects the human population, special precautions have to be made to insure it’s done properly. Again, not saying that most breeders should give shots, but this wouldn’t affect my judgment on the breeder’s qualification as a good breeder one way or the other.

I totally agree with you on this. We rely on the vet for his expertise and training to advise us on the treatment(s) available for our pets but the final decision should be ours as to what we will and will not allow. I know many breeders choose to do their own vaccines for multiple reasons, not just to save money. One important reason would be to keep the pup free from disease/illnesses that could be contracted at the vets office. I would hope that the breeders who choose this route would have some training and guidance before doing so.

[megansmomma]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

I'm confused about all this talk about telling your vet what to do? As a pet owner, I told my vet I did not want yearly booster shots, I preferred to get titers. I also told him I didn't want the lepo shot on the advice of my breeder. Since when are giving shots some medical procedure? Diabetics give shots and little training is needed. Certainly an RN is qualified to give a shot and understand the dosage recommendations and need for quality control. All these things are legal as well. The only reason the rabies shot can’t be given by anyone other than a vet is because any time some disease effects the human population, special precautions have to be made to insure it’s done properly. Again, not saying that most breeders should give shots, but this wouldn’t affect my judgment on the breeder’s qualification as a good breeder one way or the other.

Nancy, I think that you missed what I was pointing out in my original post. So I will clarify further my observation and why I still hold the same opinion.

Below is the part of the original post that I took issue with and it was not regarding an RN giving vaccines. My issue is with the bold RED sentence.

Anyone can go to the local tractor supply and pick up a variety of vaccines to be used on their domesticated pets. But the part that is overstepping her scope as a nurse and that I take issue with is the part in RED. A vaccination record and a Veterinary Health Certificate are two totally different things. The VHC is to be signed by a Licensed Veterinarian and certified the HEALTH of a puppy.

Here is a link so that you can see what I am referring:

Health Certificate for US Pet Travel

Why is a CICU nurse stepping into the scope of practicing Veterinary Medicine. I don't care how well regarded you are on the floor of the CICU it's still practicing Veterinary Medicine without a license.

I am also taken aback by her website, where she once again uses her RN signature to promote the sale of her puppies. What does this have to do with breeding? It's a marketing ploy as far as I am concerned.

RoseHillYorkies

Judy Wright, RN
Owner of RoseHill Yorkies
Houston, Texas

[lynzy420]

Originally Posted by megansmomma

Nancy, I think that you missed what I was pointing out in my original post. So I will clarify further my observation and why I still hold the same opinion.

Below is the part of the original post that I took issue with and it was not regarding an RN giving vaccines. My issue is with the bold RED sentence.



Anyone can go to the local tractor supply and pick up a variety of vaccines to be used on their domesticated pets. But the part that is overstepping her scope as a nurse and that I take issue with is the part in RED. A vaccination record and a Veterinary Health Certificate are two totally different things. The VHC is to be signed by a Licensed Veterinarian and certified the HEALTH of a puppy.

Here is a link so that you can see what I am referring:

Health Certificate for US Pet Travel

Why is a CICU nurse stepping into the scope of practicing Veterinary Medicine. I don't care how well regarded you are on the floor of the CICU it's still practicing Veterinary Medicine without a license.

I am also taken aback by her website, where she once again uses her RN signature to promote the sale of her puppies. What does this have to do with breeding? It's a marketing ploy as far as I am concerned.

RoseHillYorkies

Judy Wright, RN
Owner of RoseHill Yorkies
Houston, Texas

A very deceptive marketing ploy and very unethical, IMHO. Wow, just wow.

And for the record and a side note, my husband and I (well usually my husband) administer allergy serum injections every 2 weeks, I am not an RN.

[kjc]

Originally Posted by Yorkiemom1

Lambert and Revival vet supply....I personally would not buy vaccines from a feed store! You need to have the health records to record your vaccinations....you buy them at the same time you buy your vaccines. I use Pro-Gard 5...10 years, never had a problem, knock on wood....you stick the label from the bottle onto the record....Be advised, a lot of vets will insist the owners of the new puppies re-vaccinate the babies....I always tell my buyers to talk with their vet of choice and see if they will accept the vaccinations I have given....if not, rather than risk OVER VACCINATING the baby, they need to reconsider the vet choice. I always interview my new owners vets also, just to re-inforce that I am an RN who is very well aware of temperature ranges for vaccines, and I know how to give injections. I sign my health certs with my professional signature. In 10 years, I have only had one vet not work with the new owner, and new owner did not listen to my advise. He re-vaccinated the puppy, gave the baby Lepto. injection, the baby had an anaphylactic reaction, died on the way home from the vet....and then the owner wanted me to refund her money!

Very good practice...

Originally Posted by concretegurl

I'm not a breeder.

Over/early vaccinating is horrid, in fact I know a few very reputable breeders who refuse to vaccinate their "stock" period and only vaccinate the pups at their vets before going to their forever homes because it is legal required.

Please get a vet that will give you a breeder discount, come to your home if possible, and follow the Dr. Dodd protocol (as the reputable breeders here follow, swear by, recommend and caution buyers about finding vets who agree).

I think the Rabies vaccine is the only one required by law in the USA.

Originally Posted by concretegurl

Rabies in CA cannot be given to individuals for self administration to pets strange as it is the only required vaccine thus I think that's very telling.

Rabies is required and can only be given by a vet in the USA because of it's zoonotic properties (infectious to humans). Giving the Rabies vaccine is no different than giving other vaccines, but care must be taken to not inject oneself or get stuck by the needle, and proper disposal/destruction of the needle, syringe, and vaccine container must be done as these also are a route of infection.

Originally Posted by concretegurl

Feed store vaccines are usual multi vaccines and wholesale bulk-so they aren't always name brand and or specialty singles most vets recommend for small dogs-like Yorkies.

There are no 'specialty' singles for small dogs. All vaccines made for dogs are strong enough to vaccinate a dog weighing up to 100 pounds. This is where the problem of 'overvaccinate' originates, and why Dr Dodds recommends only one vaccine per vet visit and one month between vaccines for dogs.

Originally Posted by concretegurl

Let the vet do this research and stay current on what's recalled no longer reccomended and what has been found to be problematic-vet's get drug company updates, current research articles etc that breeders and others would have to regularly seek out.

Good breeders work closely with their own vets. My vet has a 'Breeder call List' to inform those who breed of any changes in practices, meds and/or recalls.

Originally Posted by concretegurl

I, as a buyer have more confidence in a breeder who leaves, dew claw removal, tail docking and vaccinating to their vet in the proper setting...not a DIY task to save $. <--just MHO.

Quite a few breeders are trained by their vets to perform these procedures. These are minor procedures compared to whelping the pups at home.... Vets offices have many dogs and cats coming in on a daily basis, many of which are sick. To bring unvaccinated puppies into this environment is always a risk, as viruses are airborne and can infect even if the vet's office is clean and immaculate. Even when the puppies are carried in, there is still a risk that the breeder could bring home something infectious on their clothes or shoes. Not only do they save money doing this.... they may also be saving the lives of their puppies.

Originally Posted by megansmomma

I too am a medical professional and know my place while speaking to the surgeons that I work with daily. Again, I think you are overstepping your profession as a nurse and mixing breeding, nursing and vet medicine into one lump.

IMHO, it is a big lump.

All human medicine and more is tested on Horseshoecrab blood before it ever goes into production.

Horseshoe Crabs - The Useful Horseshoe Crab

The Veterinary Profession is always looking to human medicine/procedures to find ways to better treat our pets.

The Vet ER I worked at 20 years ago had all kinds of equipment donated from local hospitals, from infant incubators for small critical patients, to EKG machines and Pulse Oximeters, Endoscopes, IV supplies and pumps, etc., which now is fairly commonplace (or should be) at many vet practices/clinics.

Stem Cell therapy is becoming an available treatment for our pets also. Funny though as it was first tested on animals before being used in human medicine, and now it's coming back to be utilized in the Vet Med field.

9/11 Search and Rescue Dog Receives Stem Cell Therapy at Va. Clinic

Burke Vet Performs Stem Cell Therapy on Dogs with Hip, Knee Problems - Burke, VA Patch


To 'draw a line' between human and animal medicine would be severely limiting to both fields.

Also, when I worked at the human hospital, I remember hearing countless stories of nurses intervening in patients treatment, usually involved an error in medication or amounts in the charts.... takes a sharp nurse to catch and verify those kinds of errors.

[lynzy420]

KJC, then I can go to my VET for medical care? Or I can take my pups to my Dr.?

[megansmomma]

1. The Vet ER I worked at 20 years ago had all kinds of equipment donated from local hospitals, from infant incubators for small critical patients, to EKG machines and Pulse Oximeters, Endoscopes, IV supplies and pumps, etc., which now is fairly commonplace (or should be) at many vet practices/clinics.



2. To 'draw a line' between human and animal medicine would be severely limiting to both fields.

3. Also, when I worked at the human hospital, I remember hearing countless stories of nurses intervening in patients treatment, usually involved an error in medication or amounts in the charts.... takes a sharp nurse to catch and verify those kinds of errors.[/QUOTE]

Since I have already clarified my previous posts I will now address the above.

1. It's been 20 years since you worked in a vet office. Medicine is a continually evolving science. You state that you have previous experience but you are 19 years and 364 days out of the loop of to the current trends. Were you a certified Vet Tech? Do you keep your professional credential up to date and current? Do you take continuing ED courses. You keep tossing it out that that you worked in a Vet office and inquiring minds want to know. There are a lot of different positions and many are on-the-job training like Kennel Attendant and dog walker.

2. I have already addressed this previously

3. Of course it takes a sharp nurse and that is what they are trained to do. But at the same time this does not allow a nurse to sign a HEALTH CERTIFICATE in Veterinary Medicine. I have to ask, when you worked in a hospital what was your profession? Are you a nurse as well? There are plenty of positions in a hospital as well and they are wide ranging from valet to neurosurgeon.

[kjc]

Originally Posted by 107barney

I don't have to tell my vet about not giving annual shots since they don't give annual shots. The vets doing annual shots are making business decisions. I feel bad for people who have to actually have this convo with their vets.

03-29-2011, 03:05 PM #160 107barney
Donating YT 500 Club Member


Update on Barney and Leptospirosis
Someone asked about Lepto today in diet and health so I thought I'd update my thread.

Barney was treated with doxycycline for two weeks for the leptospirosis infection. My vet and I discussed giving the vaccine and decided against it. She was playing phone tag with the laboratory and the specialist to obtain more information because she just had a hard time believing he had the infection and that his positive result was more likely due to a prior vaccine. ...

... I think their individual lifestyles do not support the vaccine and I am going to go with the recommendation of my regular vet over the specialist on this. I hope I don't make a mistake, but if I do, then it is certainly not because I did not give this a whole bunch of time and consideration and that is what I believe to be in my dogs' best interest at the end of the day.

I hope this thread helps others. Thank you all for your support.
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