Is there a problem I am not aware of?

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by Wylie's Mom

I don't know...

I think ignoring people or refusing to help people in this section, or any section, because they don't align with your beliefs is disloyal to the breed no matter what your philosophy or level of expertise.

The potential for educating the poster is always there.

This is not the only section that can be frustrating and disheartening. What if everyone in the other sections thought "well, I'm going to stop posting and stop helping bc people aren't doing what I think is best" -- where would we be?

To each their own, but when creatures, human or furry, need help -- I choose to try to be there in one way or another, whether what they're doing is opposed to my beliefs or not.

Yes, but for so many, if they explain the thoughts that come with their particular philosophy and level of expertise, they get clambered by the rest. I don't see it as disloyal to the breed at all, and think of it as true loyalty to breed.

I don't think the breeding forum could be compared to other forums, but if someone wanted advise on the best way to spank a dog, and everyone yelled at me for suggesting the dog shouldn't be spanked at all, I think I would stop giving advice on the spanking forum.

[bjh]

Originally Posted by Zanders' mom

I'm not a breeder, sorry I can't offer advice. When I want an answer I do a search 1st to see if anyone has had a similar experience, to the one I am having, I have learned quite a bit from older threads. Just a suggestion, hope it helps.

That is very good advise. I wish more people did use the search feature. Many of us get tired of answering the same questions over and over. Somehow I wish we had more 'stickies' that covered the most frequently asked questions. I just don't think the newbies know about using the search feature.

[Woogie Man]

I've only been a member here for a year so that's as far back as my remembering goes. Even in that time, I've noticed some experienced breeders that don't post very often. I don't think that YorkieTalk suffers because of this, though. Most of the questions people ask are fairly common and any number of breeders can adequately answer them. In the case of the tougher questions, I do see a fair amount of input from experienced breeders. Not every question needs everyone's input but it usually seems to work out. As for 'enabling' goes, it's up to each of us to respond or not. For me, I'll respond if the dog is already pregnant or about to deliver because then it's about the welfare of the Mom and pups and not some person's motivations or their breeding program. While some just pop in with a question and you never hear from them again, there are some that stick around. Those that stick around can't help but learn, if by no other way than simple osmosis. They in turn may share what they learn with others. Isn't that the foundation of education and don't we all know that it's education that will make the difference in all aspects of animal welfare including yes, betterment of the breed? I may be overly optimistic but if you don't plant a seed, how can you expect anything to grow?

[Sugar's Mom]

Originally Posted by Wylie's Mom

I don't know...

I think ignoring people or refusing to help people in this section, or any section, because they don't align with your beliefs is disloyal to the breed no matter what your philosophy or level of expertise.

The potential for educating the poster is always there.

This is not the only section that can be frustrating and disheartening. What if everyone in the other sections thought "well, I'm going to stop posting and stop helping bc people aren't doing what I think is best" -- where would we be?

To each their own, but when creatures, human or furry, need help -- I choose to try to be there in one way or another, whether what they're doing is opposed to my beliefs or not.

this isn't the reason I stopped posting here. People are going to do what they want anyway/ Most of us long time breeders stopped posting because everywhere we turned to try to help, there was one or two people that always belitteled us. Those same people have never whelped the first puppy or held a dying baby next to their heart crying because it was dying or breathe life into one that was just whelped but needed help. never slept in the floor beside the whelping box a week before and a week after whelping. Yet, they always seemed to think they knew best. i gave up. people on here that have been on a while, know they can always count on me to help them. This is my last post in this thread and no doubt it will make some people mad but my thought is that unlesss you have walked in a breeders shoes, you have no business giving advice because believe me, reading what to do online or from a book does not prepare you for reality.

[bjh]

Originally Posted by Woogie Man

I've only been a member here for a year so that's as far back as my remembering goes. Even in that time, I've noticed some experienced breeders that don't post very often. I don't think that YorkieTalk suffers because of this, though. Most of the questions people ask are fairly common and any number of breeders can adequately answer them. In the case of the tougher questions, I do see a fair amount of input from experienced breeders. Not every question needs everyone's input but it usually seems to work out. As for 'enabling' goes, it's up to each of us to respond or not. For me, I'll respond if the dog is already pregnant or about to deliver because then it's about the welfare of the Mom and pups and not some person's motivations or their breeding program. While some just pop in with a question and you never hear from them again, there are some that stick around. Those that stick around can't help but learn, if by no other way than simple osmosis. They in turn may share what they learn with others. Isn't that the foundation of education and don't we all know that it's education that will make the difference in all aspects of animal welfare including yes, betterment of the breed? I may be overly optimistic but if you don't plant a seed, how can you expect anything to grow?

Well said. I like to remain optimistic too.

[Wylie's Mom]

Originally Posted by Woogie Man

Those that stick around can't help but learn, if by no other way than simple osmosis. They in turn may share what they learn with others. Isn't that the foundation of education and don't we all know that it's education that will make the difference in all aspects of animal welfare including yes, betterment of the breed? I may be overly optimistic but if you don't plant a seed, how can you expect anything to grow?

Exactly.

[Wylie's Mom]

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom

this isn't the reason I stopped posting here. People are going to do what they want anyway/ Most of us long time breeders stopped posting because everywhere we turned to try to help, there was one or two people that always belitteled us. Those same people have never whelped the first puppy or held a dying baby next to their heart crying because it was dying or breathe life into one that was just whelped but needed help. never slept in the floor beside the whelping box a week before and a week after whelping. Yet, they always seemed to think they knew best. i gave up. people on here that have been on a while, know they can always count on me to help them. This is my last post in this thread and no doubt it will make some people mad but my thought is that unlesss you have walked in a breeders shoes, you have no business giving advice because believe me, reading what to do online or from a book does not prepare you for reality.

This is true of any section. I could also claim "there are people in Health/Diet and Sick/Emerg giving advice who have no business giving advice" -- many people feel that way.

Still, if I was one of the people who felt that way - I wouldn't let it run me off the section. I'd still voice my beliefs...that's just me.

The point is, I think people have to choose whether they really want to help those in need or not - no matter how much it might rub you the wrong way. I choose to help, even when everything in me is screaming.

[bjh]

Originally Posted by Wylie's Mom

This is true of any section. I could also claim "there are people in Health/Diet and Sick/Emerg giving advice who have no business giving advice" -- many people feel that way.

Still, if I was one of the people who felt that way - I wouldn't let it run me off the section. I'd still voice my beliefs...that's just me.

The point is, I think people have to choose whether they really want to help those in need or not - no matter how much it might rub you the wrong way. I choose to help, even when everything in me is screaming.

[Brooklynn]

I don't give advice on anything I don't know anything about and my typical answer would be if I don't know is ask your vet or breeder. I may give an opinion but it's not advice if it's something I can't answer. What I still don't get is this....why is online, a forum ect... the first place someone comes too when their pet is really sick, have problems with whelping instead of calling their vet or breeder first? Is it because the vet may say bring them in and you can't afford a vet visit and if that's the case you shouldn't own a pet.
I've always called my vet first and then sought out someone online ect..to see if they've had the same similar experience. That's what gets me in a tizzy these days, because I've stopped answering the same questions over and over and getting my head bit off because it's not the answer they wanted

Donna

[yorkiekist]

The one thing I dont usually give out is veterinary advice. I am not a vet. I would feel horrible if I gave out wrong information. If a novice has a problem, I say go to the vet! I have seen numerous times on here"HELP, my 3 lb girl is in labor. what do I do?" I say go to the vet, even if its the emergency vet at 3 am. I am disappointed by the irresponsible breedings that are always on here. I dont mind giving advice to questions about breeding in advance of the big moment. But, it seems to fall on deaf ears most of the time or its not what they want to hear. After a while, I say to myself, whats the point? I am all for education though, even if it helps just one person or dog. I was happy to see, recently, that one person asked for a mentor before taking the plunge.

[Wylie's Mom]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

Yes, but for so many, if they explain the thoughts that come with their particular philosophy and level of expertise, they get clambered by the rest. I don't see it as disloyal to the breed at all, and think of it as true loyalty to breed.

We'll have to disagree, then, on this one.

I think the ultimate disloyalty to the breed is to see something that is harmful to the breed, and say nothing.

[manolos mom]

Originally Posted by Brooklynn

I don't give advice on anything I don't know anything about and my typical answer would be if I don't know is ask your vet or breeder. I may give an opinion but it's not advice if it's something I can't answer. What I still don't get is this....why is online, a forum ect... the first place someone comes too when their pet is really sick, have problems with whelping instead of calling their vet or breeder first? Is it because the vet may say bring them in and you can't afford a vet visit and if that's the case you shouldn't own a pet.
I've always called my vet first and then sought out someone online ect..to see if they've had the same similar experience. That's what gets me in a tizzy these days, because I've stopped answering the same questions over and over and getting my head bit off because it's not the answer they wanted

Donna

Donna, I agree but sometimes even these Vets dont have the right answer for this breed. I have gone thru 3 Vets and finally found one that will atleast do research and phone other vets to get an answer. We all have seen small pups dying on this Site and the Vet does not act aggressively and the pup dies. Maybe thats why some come online to talk first to be prepared with questions for their Vets. I have learned so much on this site because people have taken the time to give me some answers.

[manolos mom]

Originally Posted by Wylie's Mom

We'll have to disagree, then, on this one.

I think the ultimate disloyalty to the breed is to see something that is harmful to the breed, and say nothing.

[Brooklynn]

Originally Posted by manolos mom

Donna, I agree but sometimes even these Vets dont have the right answer for this breed. I have gone thru 3 Vets and finally found one that will atleast do research and phone other vets to get an answer. We all have seen small pups dying on this Site and the Vet does not act aggressively and the pup dies. Maybe thats why some come online to talk first to be prepared with questions for their Vets. I have learned so much on this site because people have taken the time to give me some answers.

That's why you have a mentor/breeder as well and educate yourself and your vet before even owning a pet. I asked my yorkie mentor her advice on a vet and she sent me to a great vet on yorkies/toy breeds. It's all about educating yourself before jumping feet first
I also use another vet who I'm educating on yorkies from what I've learned from my other vet and my breeder/mentor. Believe it or not some breeders know more than vets LOL...I have been known to diagnose my own dogs because I know them so well but of course they are taken to the vet first before I do anything but 80% of the time I'm right. Of course I'd never give anyone medical advice because I'm not a vet but vets do learn from experinced breeders.
I made my mistakes along the way and when I try and give advice it's because I made the mistake first and learned from it. And it's when it's not what they want to hear my head gets bitten off and when you get bitten one too many times you learn to not put your hand in the mouth that bites.
So when I can answer a question it's because I've btdt and learned from it. I see on here many times if it's not what they want to hear they get of the defensive so I just remove my hand so it won't get bitten any longer

Donna Bird
Brooklynn's Yorkshire Terriers

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by Wylie's Mom

We'll have to disagree, then, on this one.

I think the ultimate disloyalty to the breed is to see something that is harmful to the breed, and say nothing.

If that were true, why would anyone ever encourage people to breed dogs that weren't to standard? We can say we love the breed, but what does that mean exactly, is it just the name Yorkshire Terrier we love, or the fact, or the fact that their parents were supposedly yorkies. How is encouraging people to breed yorkies that don't look like yorkies, helping the breed, or showing a love for the breed? These newbie breeders don't ever sell with limited registration, so the puppies go into the hands of more byb's. I rarely ever read about people saying a certain person should not breed a dog because he's not to standard. I occasionally read that an ultra small dog shouldn't be bred, and that seems to be acceptable to say, but no one says much about the other qualities. Several years ago, I read about it more, and I'm glad we still have a few who speak up, but I sure can understand why others can't take it.