:thumbup:Excellent post!! If I were starting a "new" breed club, I would make damn sure the health of the breed was the #1 priority, or at least include it in the "health issues" of the breed. I think that the entire "package" needs to looked at, not just the production of color. The lack of concern/denial and un-willingness to test for unilateral deafness speaks volumns about The Colorful Yorkshire Terrier Club and its breeding programs and ethics. JMO

Oh yes, I know, the partis are here to stay so I better get used to it.

Many parti breeders are aware of deafness in parti colored breeds. There are numerous parti and solid white colored breeds that have little to no problems with deafness within the parti and extreme white colored dogs. The standard colored yorkie, is also listed as having inherited deafness problems, does every breeder BEAR test their traditional yorkies - I don't think so. At this time, since we've seen no deafness problems with the parti's, I don't feel that BEAR testing is necessary unless a breeder wishes to do so.

Yorkishire Terrier club isn't a "NEW BREED" club and it's not a club that will dictate rules and laws. It's a club that was started 3 months ago by two people who wanted to provide a "friendly" place for colorful breeders to come together and network, share ideas, story's and experiences. There is still much to do on the site and we are always looking for recommendations on how to improve it or what new educational information to add. We will run information on deafness and the piebald gene for those who may not be aware, so they can be on the alert and we will post links to piebald deafness genetic sites under the links for Alopecia.

As for standards, it's the same standard as the traditional yorkie but with the exception of coloring.

We can play the "What If" game and worry and dwell that something may happen, that actually won't happen. At this point, 10 years later, 5+ generations of parti's later, we are not seeing problems ... though we are on the lookout for any potential problems associated with color.

LOL

For a person with no interest or no bias and not wanting to bash the parti breeders, Woogie Man sure seems to be going out of the way to analize and pick apart what we say.

Sorry, I just reread my post at work and I meant to say "The Colorful Yorkshire Terrier club"

Thank you very much for all of your concerns, I hope that I have put some of them to rest.

Sue thank you for bring that up.

I too was going to mention that the yorkshire terrier is on the list of dogs that have heriditary deafness.

There has been no indication what so ever that deafness is any more of a problem in the parti colored yorkie, than it is in the traditional colored. If ever it becomes a problem, I will address the issue.

As far as testing my puppies, I have yet to have an parti puppies to test, and would see no reason to get them tested unless there was some indication of deafness.

Oh my gosh....this will be my last post in this thread because I now find it as more of an attack on the parti than informative like a couple claim it to be. My question to those breeders that have been so adamant about deafness and the parti Yorkie. It was said, in this thread, that a 'responsible' parti breeder would BAER test each and every puppy. It has not been good enough to tell you that there has been no association with the parti Yorkie and hearing problems and that we are comfortable with the research that we know from our line(s). This, for some reason, is not good enough.....you say we have to test our puppies. Then, I ask you, why do you not liver shunt test each and every one of your puppies that you produce? Will you now tell us that it's because you have researched your own lines??

Seriously, at this point, we all get it....you don't like the breeding of the parti color.

Tammy

Yes we get it. and according to yorkiekist, they get it that parti yorkies are here to stay. so we may as well all just agree to disagree.

Some of you have misunderstood; I'm not against parties, I against irresponsible breeding. Some people breed teacups, or ultra tiny yorkies, I have nothing against these adorable puppies, I am against the purposeful breeding of ultra tinies, for many reasons, and just as the teacup breeder would poo poo my concerns, parti breeders do also.


Some of you have said that there are many differences among the parti breeders, and I imagine this to be true. My question to you parti breeders, what are the questions a person should ask the parti breeder to increase their chances of obtaining a healthy pup? I think that there is probably a lot in inbreeding in the parti line, which is different than line breeding, and inbreeding always increases the chances of any disease. What questions should a buyer ask?

I would ask the same questions that I would ask any breeder. If they do their research on the yorkie they will know what concerns there are with Yorkshire Terriers.

My dogs are not closely related, so no inbreeding here. Can you say there is no inbreeding with trasditional yorkie breeders?

There are good and bad breeders in every breed of dogs and in every color of yorkie. You have to ask questions until you are comfortable that the breeder is breeding healthy dogs and that they will stand behind their dogs if a genetic problem does arrise.

Why this constant interrogation of the parti breeders. We have been through the entire list of why partis should not be bred, and none of the reasons have been valid reasons to not breed this color of yorkie.

so what is the real reason for badgering a particular group of breeders whom you know nothing about for breeding a particular color of dog that has no known health issues that are related to their coloring.

People that are this obeseed with something, have very personal reasons for being that way.

so now that we have dispelled all the concerns over the health of these dogs. What are your real reasons for your obsessions?

we have heard,

"they don't look like yorkies"
Why do you care, if you don't like the looks, then don't buy them

"they YTCA has disqualifed them"
We don't care. Our purpose at this time is not for showing

"They have health issues"
Where (other than the YTCA website) is it said that they have health issues

"they might be deaf"
that has yet to be proven

"you're ruining the breed"
we don't see it that way, we believe the YTCA is wrong for not allowing what is as natural part of the yorkie makeup.

"The parti color is not a part of the yorkie make up"
The AKC says it is

"you need to have the Mars wisdom panel done to prove they are yorkies'
Why? all parties involved agree that they are yorkies so there is no need to prove it.

the list goes on.

What it all boils down to is that we should not do it because a few of you don't like it

Well for your own sakes, Let it go.

I asked a fair question, and think I deserve a fair answer. I'm often asked for advice on questions a person should ask a breeder. I thought the parti breeders might have insight on the questions a person should ask a parti breeder. I hope some of you others choose to reply; this is a legitimate question.

Yes you did and I gave you a legitimate answer in my very first sentence.

I would ask the same questions that I would ask any other yorkie breeder.

Here are a few
What, if any genetice conditions are common with the yorkies?
How many breeding dogs do you own.
Are your dogs raised inside the home or in kennels.
Are they AKC registered
Are there any health conditions that are associated wsith the parti yorkies that are not common with the traditional yorkie
What, if any conditions have your dogs been tested for
Do you have a health guarantee
Are yorkies good with kids
Have they had their shots
Do you believe in deworming puppies that do not have worms
do you own both of the parents
Can I meet both of the parents

The list is long
is there anything particuilar that you are asking about. I'm sure I have probably missed a fews, that I will be bashed for.

Oh Ya how much do they cost? How big will they get?

This wasn't a trick question, and you have offered many excellent suggestions. I'm referring to specific questions one should ask a Parti breeder, you have said many times that there are some poor parti breeders, and I thought you could offer tips on how to select a responsible parti breeder. In this post you indicate you interviewed three parti breeders. What was the question you asked to inquire about the deafness? You say you found no incidence of deafness, what question did you ask? Do you mean to say you should only ask, "Are there any health conditions that are associated wsith (sic) the parti yorkies"


There are generic questions we should ask of every breeder, but there are certain questions, one should ask relating to that specific breed, and since a parti is not part of the standard, it would seem that there would be specific questions to ask the parti breeder. This would seem even more important if purchasing the dog as breeding stock.

Concerning the question, "Are there any health conditions that are associated wsith (sic) the parti yorkies"?

What is the answer a person should hear to help them decide?

ok.......this is JMO......but in reading the facts......and one of them being that there has not be any more evidence of deafness in partis than in standards.......i would say that is not a question to ask or to info to volunteer necessarily........the main question that i would think you would be appropriate in asking or informing some one about would be why they are who or what they are............because all in all from what i have seen with health issues of both the standard and the parti.......they both either have them or have risks of having them.............a question that i think would be appropriate to ask a parti breeder is what makes them not be to the YTCA standard........and if the breeder cant answer a simple question and yes if you are gonna breed them then it should be a simple question to ask...then you shouldnt be breeding them.......dont breed any breed of dog or cat or any animal as far as that goes if you dont know about that specific animal and it's breed.............we all love our animals and want the best in life for them.........just get yourself as informed as you can wether you are a pet owner or a breeder

Thank you for your post on this!

I know the Yorkie as a whole has alot of health issues and responsible breeders have dealt with them and breeding knowledge has definately improved over the 100+ years of Yorkie breeding. But what I am trying to say is that you may have 5 generations of partis. But they are inbred in the fact that the only parti gene every dog goes back to is one Nikko dog. You are quadrupleing up on one dogs genes only because of the color he can produce. And when only one trait(color) is bred for alot of other traits, desirable or undesirable, are left unchecked or may not be as important to the breeder. By continually purposely breeding in the parti gene, you are more likely to get bilateral or unilateral deafness, and unilateral cant be detected unless you BAER test. So, how do you know that you havent produced it?
Maybe this is an issue that you can discuss with your members and testing is a way to insure that you are, in fact, breeding beautiful healthy dogs. Maybe you can include a health problem page to your web-site that include all health related problems to the Yorkie and suggest that all members do testing for Lp, LS, LP, BAER, etc. It definately couldnt hurt and the parti breed would be healthier for it. JMO

I'm so glad I've kept my mouth shut :)

Donna Bird
Brooklynn's Yorkshire Terriers

I am proud of you too. :grin2: I will sit with you and share your popcorn. :2popkorn:

I just want to know what's wrong with the standard yorkie ie...blue and gold?? If you want a yorkie then why not want what they are suppose to look like? If you want something with color go with the Biewer? They are doing studies with the Biewer and trying to establish their own breed "away" from the yorkshire terrier. I guess being a standard yorkie show breeder I guess I just don't get why you would want to breed away from what a yorkie should look like and the breed standard whether or not if you agree with the YTCA...
I'm not bashing anyone...I have friends on here with Parti's even tho they know I disagree we are still friends and converse civilally on the subject.
And to think I wasn't going to say anything LOL...
Donna Bird
Brooklynn's Yorkshire Terriers

Donna, I said that I would not respond to this thread any longer, but I do want to answer you. I cannot speak for others and why they chose a parti Yorkie...I just know my own reason. I, personally, did not prefer the look of the Biewer (just my own opinion). There are a few that I love, but most that I saw were darker, larger and their temperament was not what I wanted. I LOVE the look of the parti Yorkie (I honestly think they are gorgeous) and I equally adore the Yorkie personality! It's not that I felt/feel that there is anything wrong with the traditional colored Yorkie...I own three. :) I know that I am partial because I cherish my Livi so much, but I think she is stunning.

(By the way, you know how I feel about you, Donna). :)

Tammy

I can tell you what some new breeders have told me. They live in states where the competition on pet quality yorkies is very high. Their breeding stock is generally pet quality, and they cannot sell their yorkies for even $500.00. They are getting pitched by some Parti breeders to add a "carrier " to their line, and once they start producing partis they can sell their offspring for as much as a show breeders dog or even more. This is very tempting to people who see no problem with breeding to earn some extra spending money. Even the carriers are selling for way more than a standard yorkie of comparable quality.

I know Tammy :) is why I said I have my parti friends :) (even tho I don't agree). I think all dogs are great because I am an animal lover in general :)
But I guess since I am a show/breeder it goes against what I believe what should be done. But as I see it, it's going to be done and there is nothing I personally can do about it but I just think personally it's sad the yorkie can't be bred according to standard set forth by the national breed club but with that said I love all dogs including mixed breeds and parti's ect :)
Tammy I love ya hon!!! :)

Donna

If that is happening it's a sad day for the yorkshire terrier :(

I think the popularity of the breed has also been it's detriment...so many people jumped on the yorkie breeding bandwagon.

Agreed! I'm really glad I don't breed much anyway. With my passion in the show ring, it's sad to see poorly represented specimans of the yorkie breed in the ring that win with handlers (long time handlers). I guess that is why I don't understand the breeding of anything other than the standard set forth by the YTCA.

Donna and Deb don't forget about those that seem to want to breed that so called tea-cup .....

You ready for NY yet :eek: gave you a gift :)

oh honey that grinds on my nerves worse, that dreaded word "teacup" UGH!

I'm not ready yet...maybe I'll be ready when I get there LOL

Donna

ditto .. I was not sure I wanted to put that word there with you :eek:

Radar can get you ready not to worry

Vickie you can put any word out to me :) You have a pass :) LOL LOL LOL

I'll get there lol...

Love ya I'm going home now!

hmmm Donna will have to think on that one...probably forgot most words anyway :animal36
lova ya back ... don't forget the Pizza