Originally Posted by BamaFan121s (Post 1782422)

At least where weight is concerned...

I hope that your pooches get a good report w/ the vet.:thumbup:

Originally Posted by EmrldShdwQueen (Post 1782438)

That's what I meant, the rest is yet to be seen...:p

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom (Post 1778572)

i am not going to say a whole lot in case this person is one of "those' but i would never buy from anyone that kept their dogs outside if I know it and if they are housed out with no heat or cooling, i would probably report them to animal abuse.

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s (Post 1782494)

I just noticed yoru avatar. That picture is so cute! I love licky pictures!:p

Originally Posted by niki35010 (Post 1782350)

Once again thanks! I finally finished all their baths last night and boy was that a job! They enjoyed it so much!!!! They are going for their first vet visit tomorrow and getting groomed!!! I have taken pictures but have to get them developed first so I can scan them on!!! Can't wait until you guys can see them! They haven't been bred that much at all! My oldest Fancy, is 3 and been bred twice...the other two are sisters and they have been bred only once each. My male is 6lbs. and my females are 6lbs and 7 lbs. They are precious.

Originally Posted by Chrissy0277 (Post 1779667)

Ughh that bothers me so much... Keeping your little dogs inside and keeping your big dogs outside in a kennel or even worse chained to a tree ALL THE TIME.
There are YT members that do this and it bugs me so much. Why isnt the big dog deserving of coming inside? I have big and little and my shepherd is completly inside too. Whats the point of even having the dog if your not going to keep them inside?

Originally Posted by blitz (Post 1781985)

One thing that strikes me hypocritical, however, is how so many (not all but many) breeders on here sell entire litters of puppies. What is the purpose of that breeding if you sell them all at 12 weeks? I would think $$$$$. Please tell me why else would a breeder sell an entire litter.

Originally Posted by MeganS (Post 1783611)

First, I read this whole thread and I'm glad to see you brought them inside...I hope you really did bring them inside and you will consider getting them fixed and retiring them.



Second, I saw this and i had to respond. I'm kind of confused. Why shouldn't breeders be selling their entire litters? If they keep dogs from every litter, their lives will become so hectic with taking care of their dogs that they won't be able to put in the endless hours needed for their breeding program.

When else should they be selling them? According to the YTCA, a reputable breeder sells no earlier than 12 weeks (I don't really agree with that, but that's what it says). 12 weeks is the age because that's when they've had all of their shots, that's when they're starting to be housebroken, and that's when they've learned all the social skills they need.

Good breeders are NOT in it for the $$$$, because there isn't really any $$$$. I'm not a breeder, and I have no intention on becoming a breeder, but I know a tiny bit about it from being on this forum, and just one litter costs a crap load of money. If the stud doesn't belong to the breeder, they need to pay stud fees. If it does, they need to pay to have ALL kinds of tests done on BOTH dogs (collapsing trachea, luxating pattella, liver shunt, etc.), they need to pay to take their bitch in for countless check ups while she is pregnant -- including x-rays/ultra sounds. They need to pay for bedding so that the bitch can nest. When the puppies are going to be born, the breeder needs to be ready to pay for a possible c-section (which I've heard can be about $1000). After they're born, the breeder needs to pay for the first vet visit (including the removal of dew claws and tail docking) and to get the female checked out. The breeder THEN, if they are keeping them until 12 weeks, needs to pay for 3 rounds of shots for on average about 6 puppies. and these are the costs when everything goes perfectly. What about when a sick puppy is born? When the mother can't deliver? When anything that can go wrong WILL go wrong? Not to mention, if the breeders have regular jobs, they need to take off of work in the days leading up to the delivery, and the days after.

When you put together all of this, it hardly seems fair to condemn breeders for selling their puppies. AND even if they do sell every puppy, more than likely they won't even break even with the amount they spent to bring the puppies into the world.

Originally Posted by hha (Post 1783684)

As usual Megan, you are too grown up for your age..;) but, actually, they're not done with their shots at 12 weeks..infact, here, they have to have 4 sets of shots, which I got Ginger at 11 weeks, and she still had to have 3 more sets of shots...:(

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s (Post 1783721)

It all depends on the breeder. There is no "set time" when pups get their shots...age wise that is. Not all breeders follow the same universal schedule for vaccinations.

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom (Post 1783816)

i fail to see what is hypocritical about a breeder selling the entire litter. If I kept all of mine, I would have to build ME a kennel and let the dogs have the entire house and not just my living room.

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom (Post 1783816)

i fail to see what is hypocritical about a breeder selling the entire litter. If I kept all of mine, I would have to build ME a kennel and let the dogs have the entire house and not just my living room.

Originally Posted by lisatodd (Post 1778595)

[COLOR="Red"]


:eek: :eek: :eek:

WHAT???? MAKE SOME EXTRA CASH?????

ANYONE WANT TO JOIN ME WITH SOME :2popkorn: AND SOME :martini:

THIS IS GOING TO GET GOOOOOOOD

Originally Posted by tiggerr36792 (Post 1778880)

To the OP might I suggest that you sleep out there with them just one night and then come back and decide if they should stay inside or outside. Just a thought!

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom (Post 1783816)

i fail to see what is hypocritical about a breeder selling the entire litter. If I kept all of mine, I would have to build ME a kennel and let the dogs have the entire house and not just my living room.

Originally Posted by blitz (Post 1784073)

I am living under the assumption that breeding should be for the betterment of the breed. When a breeder sells an entire litter at 12 weeks, how does she know what she produced? How does she know what is pet quality? Mouths, coats, etc. all change and you can't be sure of what you have even at 6 months -- but you have a better idea.

If she sells the entire litter, how is she improving her own breeding program?

When she sells the entire litter, she has nothing to go forward with. I see it all the time -- entire litters for sale. This practice is breeding pets (on spay neuter contracts of course) for money not any other reason.

Another question, if you don't have room to keep any more puppies, why are you breeding your dogs?

JMO
If you don't have the room or need for any more, why are you breeding? Or are you selling yours to other breeders for their breeding program?

Originally Posted by blitz (Post 1784073)

I am living under the assumption that breeding should be for the betterment of the breed. When a breeder sells an entire litter at 12 weeks, how does she know what she produced? How does she know what is pet quality? Mouths, coats, etc. all change and you can't be sure of what you have even at 6 months -- but you have a better idea.

If she sells the entire litter, how is she improving her own breeding program?

When she sells the entire litter, she has nothing to go forward with. I see it all the time -- entire litters for sale. This practice is breeding pets (on spay neuter contracts of course) for money not any other reason.

Another question, if you don't have room to keep any more puppies, why are you breeding your dogs?

JMO
If you don't have the room or need for any more, why are you breeding? Or are you selling yours to other breeders for their breeding program?

Originally Posted by Ladymom (Post 1784145)

:goodpost:

Reputable breeders breed to improve their own line. That's why they will only have a couple of litters a year and hold on to a few of the most promising puppies until they are at least six months old to see if they can shown/judged to be a good enough representation of the breed to be added to their breeding program. The "pet quality" puppies in the litter are sold with a spay neuter agreement and limited registration. Often there is a waiting list for those puppies.

Originally Posted by blitz (Post 1784394)

Exactly. I believe a respectable breeder is breeding because they are looking for their dogs to improve their own line or are looking for that next great dog -- not to supply the pet population. Just because one keeps their dogs in the house, sleeping in their beds, etc. does not improve the breed or make a contribution to the future of the breed any more than a puppymill does or a byb. I see some websites advertising upcoming litters for sale and even advertising their newborn puppies and taking deposits.

Originally Posted by Ladymom (Post 1784495)

In Maryland it's even illegal to advertise with pictures of puppies under eight weeks old.

This is one of my favorite descriptions of a backyard breeder:

Every breed of dog recognized by the AKC has a written standard, a blueprint of what the dog should look like and act like. These standards were written so that all would know what a quality example of the breed is and strive to produce dogs that meet or exceed the standard in health, temperament and appearance. To be sure you are breeding dogs that meet these standards, your dogs must be judged by people who have a lifetime of experience among the breed. If your personal dog has not yet been in front of a judge, then you do NOT have an AKC standard dog, you have one that is pet quality and that is fine. AKC papers DO NOT signify a dog with Breeding quality standards!!!!!

A pet is to be loved, cherished, trained, cared for, spoiled and bragged about, but it is NEVER to be bred. No matter how cute or sweet the dog may be, if it is not up to the standard, you have no business breeding it. Even if you have a purebred dog this does not give you the right to breed it. Most purebred dogs are not breeding quality. If you breed your pet quality dog, you are a "backyard breeder", whether you breed the dog in your backyard, garage, living room or an expensive hotel room, the term is still backyard breeder.

http://www.21stcenturycares.org/backyardbreeders.htm

Originally Posted by hha (Post 1784514)

This kind of reminds me of like "who died and made you God"....Thank Goodness I'm not a breeder, I sure woulnd't want people telling me what is right and what is wrong..I think God gave everyone of us a mind so we could have our own opinions..

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s (Post 1784596)

Oh, I believe that religion and implications of breeders of "playing God" would be best left out of these conversations....:rolleyes:

Originally Posted by bchgirl (Post 1784651)

Throw in a couple of political statements and it would touch base on all the controversial topics here on YT...religion, politics, and breeding yorkies. :D

Originally Posted by hha (Post 1784514)

This kind of reminds me of like "who died and made you God"....Thank Goodness I'm not a breeder, I sure woulnd't want people telling me what is right and what is wrong..I think God gave everyone of us a mind so we could have our own opinions..

Originally Posted by Ladymom (Post 1784678)

One has only to look at the Amish puppymills in Lancaster County to see that belief in God has nothing to do with being an ethical breeder.