Females try to kill each other!

[motherhen]

We really need some help with this problem. We have two adult females, that when one is pregnant, they get into horrible fights! I mean they actually try to kill each other. Today, I could't even get them seperated till there was blood on both of them. Calypso is jealous of any attention the male gives to Pandora. She has even killed the puppies of Pandora. She acts like she is married to our male! The dogs have the run of the house, and we have no way to keep them seperate, unless we would cage them all the time. We really don't like that idea at all -- but we like the idea of a dead dog even worse. It seems like the fights are mainly right after one of us gets home, or if someone comes over. Pandora is definetly the 'alpha' dog, but Calypso is much bigger and stronger. Do all females do this? When our female pups get older will we have the same problem, or is this unique to these two?

[DvlshAngel985]

Originally Posted by motherhen

We really need some help with this problem. We have two adult females, that when one is pregnant, they get into horrible fights! I mean they actually try to kill each other. Today, I could't even get them seperated till there was blood on both of them. Calypso is jealous of any attention the male gives to Pandora. She has even killed the puppies of Pandora. She acts like she is married to our male! The dogs have the run of the house, and we have no way to keep them seperate, unless we would cage them all the time. We really don't like that idea at all -- but we like the idea of a dead dog even worse. It seems like the fights are mainly right after one of us gets home, or if someone comes over. Pandora is definetly the 'alpha' dog, but Calypso is much bigger and stronger. Do all females do this? When our female pups get older will we have the same problem, or is this unique to these two?

Oh my, that sounds horrible. I'm so sorry. I really have no advice as I just acquired my first dog and he's a male. If there really are no other suggestions, would you consider re-homing one of them? The aggressor maybe? It could be that she would be happier in a home where she is the center of attention. Blood seems extreme to me, and maybe extreme measure need to be taken.

[motherhen]

Originally Posted by DvlshAngel985

Oh my, that sounds horrible. I'm so sorry. I really have no advice as I just acquired my first dog and he's a male. If there really are no other suggestions, would you consider re-homing one of them? The aggressor maybe? It could be that she would be happier in a home where she is the center of attention. Blood seems extreme to me, and maybe extreme measure need to be taken.

That is the only solution I can come up with also. Yes, it would be the jealous one - Calypso, that would be the one to go. Except for this problem, she is otherwise a shy and timid dog. She mothers all the new pups we have, cleaning them and watching out after them. She is a very good mother, but she is just too stinkin jealous! Of course I would be too, if'n my man brought home another female, had sex with her, and babies by her -- right under my nose!!!

[BanditSocks2]

If it's only when she's preggers would you consider not breeding anymore or using a baby gate to separate them? I'm not sure what your situation is, so I'm not sure if either is feasible. Also, you could maybe have a behavior specialist come in?? But I'm sure that's big $$! Or write to Ceaser Milan or Victoria!!

[motherhen]

Originally Posted by BanditSocks2

If it's only when she's preggers would you consider not breeding anymore or using a baby gate to separate them? I'm not sure what your situation is, so I'm not sure if either is feasible. Also, you could maybe have a behavior specialist come in?? But I'm sure that's big $$! Or write to Ceaser Milan or Victoria!!

Well, it's not when she's pregnant, it's when the other female is pregant. We can't afford to have any special things done. Who are Ceaser Milan and Victoria?

[kpstoybox]

Originally Posted by DvlshAngel985

Oh my, that sounds horrible. I'm so sorry. I really have no advice as I just acquired my first dog and he's a male. If there really are no other suggestions, would you consider re-homing one of them? The aggressor maybe? It could be that she would be happier in a home where she is the center of attention. Blood seems extreme to me, and maybe extreme measure need to be taken.

I agree...and so do dead puppies. I know it's not what you prefer to do...but I think it's time to seperate them for thier own protection.

[motherhen]

Originally Posted by kpstoybox

I agree...and so do dead puppies. I know it's not what you prefer to do...but I think it's time to seperate them for thier own protection.

We are trying, and hopefully this won't happen again. My main concern is --- do all females grow up doing this??? Do they fight with each other, when they are in heat or pregnant?

[livingdustmops]

You should ask mod to move this to the breeders section as it is a problem with breeding bitches. I have know breeders that have had to rehome one of their females. Not all females do this but you have to take large precautions and it might still end up in the death of one of your dogs.

This is not a cesar of victoria issue because these dogs will fight to the finish and they will kill each other puppies. You really cannot put human emotions on this situation, it is about survival.

[BellaDonna]

If you can't keep them from hurting each other to the point of blood and actually killing puppies I think you definitely should re-home one but I wouldn't re-home the aggressive one because that would be passing on the problem. Since you intend to keep breeding why not just keep her and her mate and not subject another female to the chaos?
If she is like that with one female she will probably be like that with any other female. I wouldn't take the chance.

[DvlshAngel985]

Originally Posted by BellaDonna

If you can't keep them from hurting each other to the point of blood and actually killing puppies I think you definitely should re-home one but I wouldn't re-home the aggressive one because that would be passing on the problem. Since you intend to keep breeding why not just keep her and her mate and not subject another female to the chaos?
If she is like that with one female she will probably be like that with any other female. I wouldn't take the chance.

She did say that the aggressive girl is not aggressive to people, just the other bitch that is preggos. Take her out of that situation, have her spayed, and being the only spoiled diva in the family, she could do fine. Only the OP knows her girls well enough to know if Calypso would do ok being the only baby.

[motherhen]

Originally Posted by BellaDonna

If you can't keep them from hurting each other to the point of blood and actually killing puppies I think you definitely should re-home one but I wouldn't re-home the aggressive one because that would be passing on the problem. Since you intend to keep breeding why not just keep her and her mate and not subject another female to the chaos?
If she is like that with one female she will probably be like that with any other female. I wouldn't take the chance.

Chuckling here because you had no way of knowing that CHAOS, is the name of the male that she is jealous of!
I really think it's just because she is so close to Chaos, that is the problem. She has no problems with puppies that are NOT his! Not sure how she knows the difference but she does!

[motherhen]

Originally Posted by DvlshAngel985

She did say that the aggressive girl is not aggressive to people, just the other bitch that is preggos. Take her out of that situation, have her spayed, and being the only spoiled diva in the family, she could do fine. Only the OP knows her girls well enough to know if Calypso would do ok being the only baby.

She is very gentle under all other circumstances except with Pandora. With another family, being the 'alpha' female, she would be great. She is a beautiful dog, but it's just not working between these two. Thanks for all the pointers everyone.

[tammy8833]

my females will do this..we had one big fight...we had one pregnant and one who had just has babies..one lost eye sight in one eye and the other had gum repair.

i now keep them completely separated when there and babies and pregnancies..i crate and pen..and its the only safe way to do this for us..they get turns in and out their pens and crate..the agressor is in a full crate and has to be watched when let out

things go back to normal once the babies are weaned and gone

[Woogie Man]

I've never had this situation, but I would say it's not normal. I've only had 2 of my girls fight and it's never gotten anywhere near that vicious. And killing puppies???

I would absolutely not allow this fighting to happen, especially with a pregnant girl. You've obviously got a complex issue and a dangerous one at that. In your shoes, my first priority would be the safety of my pregnant girl and her pups. The whys of it all would be secondary.

You mention that Calypso is otherwise shy and timid. Yet she fights with a pregnant dog and has killed her pups. I have to wonder if a dog with that temperament should be breeding as temperament is genetic and will be passed on.

Whether or not can come to an ideal solution or not, you have to provide for your girl and her pups safety. That is priority #1.

[tammy8833]

Originally Posted by Woogie Man

I've never had this situation, but I would say it's not normal. I've only had 2 of my girls fight and it's never gotten anywhere near that vicious. And killing puppies???

I would absolutely not allow this fighting to happen, especially with a pregnant girl. You've obviously got a complex issue and a dangerous one at that. In your shoes, my first priority would be the safety of my pregnant girl and her pups. The whys of it all would be secondary.

You mention that Calypso is otherwise shy and timid. Yet she fights with a pregnant dog and has killed her pups. I have to wonder if a dog with that temperament should be breeding as temperament is genetic and will be passed on.

Whether or not can come to an ideal solution or not, you have to provide for your girl and her pups safety. That is priority #1.

dern i missed the part where she ate the babies

but i believe the hormones getting out of wack like that can be typical ..thats alot of flying hormones and things will and can happen..

if you have ever lived with two women on that time its can get ugly..and i would image the same for dogs...

as far as the mom eating the other litter..im thinking its a alpha like issue related to the natural in stinks in the wild