How to raise a show prospect

[bjh]

I would appreciate input from some of you experienced show breeders on how to best raise your show prospects. At what age do you start letting them associate with your older dogs. Say if you have a litter of say 5 puppies, after they are weaned, do you let all of them stay together in one group or do you split them up when they get a little older. At what age would you split them up? It seems that if they establish a pecking order then maybe the one that looks the best conformation wise might end up being more intimidated and shy if they have bigger litter mates picking on them. I know that attitude is important in a show dog. Is attitude something that has to come natural or can it be taught? I know some show breeders keep each show dog in a separate exercise pen or crate but to me it seems sad to do that. I have also been told that when Yorkies are puppies you should just let them be puppies. At what age do you recommend starting leash training? I have heard several handlers say that we should not spoil our show dogs and we should treat them like dogs and not like children. Any input would be greatly appreciated.

[yorkiekist]

This is a great question!!!!!!!!! Inquiring minds want to know!!!LOL

[lwolfe]

Originally Posted by bjh

I would appreciate input from some of you experienced show breeders on how to best raise your show prospects. At what age do you start letting them associate with your older dogs. Say if you have a litter of say 5 puppies, after they are weaned, do you let all of them stay together in one group or do you split them up when they get a little older. At what age would you split them up? It seems that if they establish a pecking order then maybe the one that looks the best conformation wise might end up being more intimidated and shy if they have bigger litter mates picking on them. I know that attitude is important in a show dog. Is attitude something that has to come natural or can it be taught? I know some show breeders keep each show dog in a separate exercise pen or crate but to me it seems sad to do that. I have also been told that when Yorkies are puppies you should just let them be puppies. At what age do you recommend starting leash training? I have heard several handlers say that we should not spoil our show dogs and we should treat them like dogs and not like children. Any input would be greatly appreciated.

In my opinion, dogs are born with attitude.

There is a book call From Best Intentions to Best In Show by Pat Hastings that would be very helpful to you. This book shows you how to evaluate your pups physical, emotional qualities for show. There is also a DVD by Ms. Hastings called the Puppy Puzzle. I know quite a few breeders that use this system to evaluate show pups. I have read my copy many, many times.

[tjdmom]

Sorry, no advice from me but I just had to say I think that's a great question!

[PrestigeousYT]

I started to respond to this post before but the computer locked up.

I would appreciate input from some of you experienced show breeders on how to best raise your show prospects.


At what age do you start letting them associate with your older dogs.
I make this judgement as individual pups, some pups are ready to spend some time with the older dogs sooner than others so I watch the pups attitudes and condifidence and when I feel they are ready I let them hang out with the older ones only when I am sitting in the floor with them.

Say if you have a litter of say 5 puppies, after they are weaned, do you let all of them stay together in one group or do you split them up when they get a little older. At what age would you split them up?
I kept a litter this past year Toy, Kisses and Keeper who are 7 months old now. They still are in one room together. And I do crate them up at night time in a 3X3.

It seems that if they establish a pecking order then maybe the one that looks the best conformation wise might end up being more intimidated and shy if they have bigger litter mates picking on them. If you notice a real problem with one being picked on more and see that their behavior is changing then I think you should move it with another group. A lot of it is knowing your dogs, watching their behavior and making the decision what to change if you feel you need to seperate them. I do not like to keep show dogs in isolation. I heavy oil mine and some I wrap. Some will pull the others wraps out so you have to be sure you put the right ones together to keep from getting wraps pulled out. Again a lot of it is knowing your dogs and watching very carefully what is going on with your dogs.


I know that attitude is important in a show dog. Is attitude something that has to come natural or can it be taught?
I agree 100% with Laurie attitude is something they are born with. I love a dog with too much attitude, you can usually tame down that spunk enough to have it shine at the ring time in the ring. Sometimes its a job to get them to calm down but to take a dog with little or no attitude/spunk to me is not going to work. Because that is a drag to work with.
I know some show breeders keep each show dog in a separate exercise pen or crate but to me it seems sad to do that. My dogs are my pets first and foremost they do not live in solitary confinement. I don't like that, in my opinion you can raise a show dog with others again you just have to know which ones they can hang out with that won't tear up their coats etc.

I have also been told that when Yorkies are puppies you should just let them be puppies.
Absolutely let them have fun and be a playful happy puppy.

At what age do you recommend starting leash training?
Start putting a light leash around their neck when they are 10 weeks old and let them drag it around the room You can order some that are like a very thin shoe string, only when you are sitting in the floor watching them and only them. They can get hurt if you do not watch them.

I have heard several handlers say that we should not spoil our show dogs and we should treat them like dogs and not like children. Any input would be greatly appreciatedLOL I remember Squeakers second show, he was 10 months old and the judge that gave him BOB told me Let him be a dog, don't spoil him like he is a child, he is a terrier and you shouldn't baby him. LOL well he has to be the most spoiled dog and he had no problem becoming a CH. again my dogs are my pets first and foremost. If I had to choose spoiling them and loving the heck out of them over being a show dog champion, I would choose spoiling them.

Deana
Prestigeous

[topknot]

JMO - I believe that show attitude is born in them. You cannot create that attitude. That is one reason getting that "special" show dog is so hard to come by. For example I have several that love to be in the ring! They love to go in and show. The love to show the judge they have it all, that "terrier" attitude! And judges love it! You can have a gorgeous, very sound dog, but without that "it" attitude -it will most likely take longer to finish him/her.

Training - I start early (around 3 months) just getting them use to the lead on. Never make it work for them. Make it fun!! And you must practice a lot. Just getting the lead on them a few times or once a week on them before a show - isn't going to prepare them. You also must get them use to the sounds and sights of a show (there are so many people and so much going on). It is a lot for them to absorb all of a sudden. Great reason why to have puppy class.

Some breeders do keep their show dogs apart - the reason is to protect their show coat. I do allow mine to be together, since I prefer that. My coats could probably be longer on my dogs if I did not let them play together, longe on my sofa, and sleep with me. Oh, well!

Reason not to over spoil you show dog - you do not want them to hate being in the carrier during transportation to and from the show. This is for safety reason - using the carrier while in a car. I make mine feel special while we are going to a show. I give them lots of attention and treats. I play with them a lot and we have fun! Infact one of my girls - love to go off to shows since she knows she even will get a french fry or two.

I do not know it all and still constantly learning and trying new things. You have to try and see what works best for you and your dog.
T.

[PrestigeousYT]

Tina
I agree when we go to a show its about the dog, we do not go out to eat with everyone we get something and hang out with the dogs.
So it is 100% fun time for our dogs.
I know some people have gotten upset because we didn't go hang out with the people we just feel its about our dogs. And that is more fun time for them.
We start puppy classes at about 5 months on going out to a real puppy class. We also have puppy class here in the yard in the spring and summer with our hopefuls. All of the socialization is so important.

Deana
Prestigeous

[bjh]

Laurie, thanks for your input, I will definitely be ordering the book and DVD.

Deanna and Tina, I greatly appreciate you input. It will be very helpful.

I have shown other breeds but the Yorkie is very challenging especially when it comes to showing. I think I have been making a mistake by letting my 12 week old pups join the 'gang' too soon. I have a male that is very 'strict' with puppies, he will not hurt them but he will dominant them and I think it can effect their personality. I also have a couple of females that are that way. I think I have a pretty good eye for judging conformation but I am still struggling in judging coats in young puppies. I know ideally all Yorkie coats should be silky but I do have some cottony and soft coated dogs back in my bloodline so I am getting some of each.

One last question about attitude. I have read that it is best to observe your pups while playing to see which ones are most outgoing. I always notice that some have really good tail carriage, keeping tail up while standing and sometimes there are some that leave their tails down while standing but have great tail carriage while gaiting. Would this effect your choices? Would 12 weeks be too early to tell if your pup will have attitude? Thank you all so much.

[YorkieRose]

Attitude can be seen at 5 and 6 weeks or as soon as they start standing...just keep watching them...if they do not have it at 12 weeks, it is unlikely it will magically appear at 6 or 12 months..but then again some people show ones with "barely" there attitutes..doesn't bother them.

[yorkiekist]

Thanks so very much for all of your expert opinions on this!!! Sometimes I feel like "what am I doing wrong"? Or "why cant I get some attitude from this puppy"? You guys are so informative!!!

[lwolfe]

Originally Posted by bjh

Laurie, thanks for your input, I will definitely be ordering the book and DVD.

Deanna and Tina, I greatly appreciate you input. It will be very helpful.

I have shown other breeds but the Yorkie is very challenging especially when it comes to showing. I think I have been making a mistake by letting my 12 week old pups join the 'gang' too soon. I have a male that is very 'strict' with puppies, he will not hurt them but he will dominant them and I think it can effect their personality. I also have a couple of females that are that way. I think I have a pretty good eye for judging conformation but I am still struggling in judging coats in young puppies. I know ideally all Yorkie coats should be silky but I do have some cottony and soft coated dogs back in my bloodline so I am getting some of each.

One last question about attitude. I have read that it is best to observe your pups while playing to see which ones are most outgoing. I always notice that some have really good tail carriage, keeping tail up while standing and sometimes there are some that leave their tails down while standing but have great tail carriage while gaiting. Would this effect your choices? Would 12 weeks be too early to tell if your pup will have attitude? Thank you all so much.

If you ask a judge what is the first trait they look for when judging a dog and 99.9% will say breed type. Does this specimen look a Yorkshire Terrier? Can this dog do the job he was bred to do? Looking at a picture of a Yorkshire Terrier you will see a regal elegant dog but the truth is these little dogs are true terriers bred to do the work of a ratter. They MUST be inquisitive and confident

A dog that is outgoing, playful and confident will hold up his tail and ears(unless there is a phyical reason why he can not).

[Ladyhawk]

I believe the attitude is born in them but must be nurtured to progress to adulthood. My Carly has such beautiful structure and gaits like a dream but as soon as she realizes that she is being watched she shuts down. She'll prance here and play with the other dogs but it was not nurtured in her as a pup and she has become so timid due to lack of socialization. When I got her at 7 1/2 months she was already scared to death of the world. Preston on the other hand doesn't care for strangers touching him but he has been socialized and he isn't afraid. He struts around and he knows that he is something else. He's always been a demanding baby and I must admit that I've catered to him a bit as not to crush his spirit. Denali loves to meet people and it makes her alot more fun to show where Connor only does it because I ask him to. He'd rather be at home with his gals. I watch those puppies constantly from the time they start moving to see personality and spirit. It really is hard to get everything in one package with this breed. That's what makes it such a challenge and keeps drawing me back in.

[bjh]

I am just curious how many of you, when you pick a show prospect, do you always just know 'This is the one', or do you go back and forth wondering if you made the right choice. Have many of you had any pleasant surprises, where you doubted your judgment and then suddenly your show prospect suddenly blossoms?

[TeddyandTiffy]

This thread to me is very intresting with lots of info. for us who are wondering about all this like me!! I love to learn and to read it here is so great to see that U Show Breeders are willing to share U're wisdom with us!!! Thanks so very much! Hugs

[Brooklynn]

I have a hard time evaluating my puppies for show...What I like in my show prospects end up too little LOL....when I purchase it's always one that is over a year old so I know then what they look like, act like and if they will be good in the ring...Like Cammie and Radar both were 18 months when I bought them.
Harvey is my first home bred champion and he was a good square dog, ear set wasn't what I liked but he had everything else and finished rather quickly.
Attitude is born in them. I always lead train when they are older and have found this to work for me. I don't put a lead on my puppies until they are almost 6 months old. I watch them play in the yard, walk, run, and stand. If I see something I like then I keep one and then I put a lead on them when I get ready to take them to show. I have found them to be easily trained and not afraid to walk because they are older and if they were born for the ring then it shows when I do put that lead on. Krissy showed so well but she ended up too small and now Molly is just a natural in the ring and I didn't put a lead on her till she was 6 months old and she acts like she owns the ring! But that's how I do things and it's worked. I start stacking them on the grooming table at 3 months. I totally believe in letting them be puppy's first and when I do find that spark and what I'm looking for that's when I start with the basics in training for the ring
Donna