Harness Equivalent to Pinch Collar

[concretegurl]

Very sad.
Hope you arent posting next about your yorkie having ct, many have duely warned about using a collar for walking.

Why not pad a harness or get a custom fit harness and not risk your dog s health?

[concretegurl]

Oops cell phone double posted sorry.

[gracielove]

The collar issue is not just with Yorkies, though they do have a predisposition for weak trachea. Small dogs in general do not have the muscle tissue to protect the cartilage of the throat area. Very sad that a trainer would reject all proven information concerning a Yorkie because she has never tried other methods.
Anyone that needs a pinch collar to train a puppy is sadly lacking in proper training methods. They are usually reserved for very difficult training problems with large adult dogs. Even a traditional choke collar should always be kept loose except for a slight jerking motion needed to get the dog's attention. Even larger dogs can become injured from improper use of a choke collar.
Puppies in particular have no protection of the trachea area.
Collapsed trachea is very often a degenerative problem in a Yokie. The trachea may start out seemingly fine but as time goes on deteriorates. Use of a collar only speeds up the process.

[concretegurl]

I guess I should add scoobers wore a pinch collar because of his severe dog agression.

Not to train him to heal or walk in general.

It was literally only used to keep him from trying to kill other animals

[Lovetodream88]

If you really want to risk CT then I'm not sure you understand about the illness there is no cure and many dogs have to be put to sleep because of it and way before they are old. A good trainer would be confident in there ways and that they don't need to train a dog by hurting them. By the way talk to your vet over a trainer about CT because a trainer has had NO medical training. I really hope you reconsider.

[Taryn0405]

Damage by Choke Chains - Dog Obedience &Agility Training

There's a link explaining the dangers of choke chains/ training collars.

Coming from personal experience, I had a Cairn Terrier growing up, and she was about 13 lbs. We put a choke chain on her out of sheer 1st time dog owner ignorance. Needless to say, we took it off after watching her be a typical terrier and dart after squirrels or whatever in the backyard and nearly hanging herself.

When she passed away, we had a doggy autopsy done, and they found that her trachea has been partially collapsed. Our vet compared it to an x-ray done on her before we used the collar (we thought she swallowed a chicken wing when she was a puppy) and there is a noticeable difference between the open airway, and it now after the choke collar.

No on can tell you what to do, it is your dog. And you as the owner know what's best, however we speak out of experience and the daily posts that we see with "Help, my dog can't breathe..." or "Bessy is honking and is having trouble.." The best we can offer is how we would go about things in your circumstance.

Good luck.

Posted is a picture of my Cairn who passed. This was taken one months before she died. Although the choke collar didn't cause her death, I sure as heck kick myself for the nights that we couldn't figure out why she was gagging and couldn't catch her breath.

[mimodok]

Well, I didn't get a chance to really express my concerns about tracheal collapse with the trainer. The only reason they don't use them is because the handler usually has to work harder to train the dog. Also, they mostly train larger dogs that don't have many of these issues. They will train any small dog that comes through their door. But, they've found that people with small dogs typically don't invest in obedience school.

After talking with them, they've said they are willing to work with whatever is best for me and my dog. They did warn me that the front-leading harness I had chosen would hurt her arms over time so I should just choose a plain harness that fits her.

Since these people are used to training large dogs all day, they can be intimidating to talk to. I'm also a shy person. So the first time I mentioned harnesses and they said they weren't necessary, I backed down. After your insistence and some extra research, I had the guts to call back and insist on using a harness. I also remembered that one of the Yorkies I grew up with had the characteristic "goose-honk," which was why we always used a harness with him. I was a child when we started doing that with him so I had forgotten why we chose a harness and why he coughed like that.

I will get her a harness today and start using it.

[Taryn0405]

Originally Posted by mimodok

Well, I didn't get a chance to really express my concerns about tracheal collapse with the trainer. The only reason they don't use them is because the handler usually has to work harder to train the dog. Also, they mostly train larger dogs that don't have many of these issues. They will train any small dog that comes through their door. But, they've found that people with small dogs typically don't invest in obedience school.

After talking with them, they've said they are willing to work with whatever is best for me and my dog. They did warn me that the front-leading harness I had chosen would hurt her arms over time so I should just choose a plain harness that fits her.

Since these people are used to training large dogs all day, they can be intimidating to talk to. I'm also a shy person. So the first time I mentioned harnesses and they said they weren't necessary, I backed down. After your insistence and some extra research, I had the guts to call back and insist on using a harness. I also remembered that one of the Yorkies I grew up with had the characteristic "goose-honk," which was why we always used a harness with him. I was a child when we started doing that with him so I had forgotten why we chose a harness and why he coughed like that.

I will get her a harness today and start using it.

Glad you did the research!
And that you stood up for yourself!
Keep us updated on how everything works out.

[Bitsy]

Originally Posted by mimodok

Well, I didn't get a chance to really express my concerns about tracheal collapse with the trainer. The only reason they don't use them is because the handler usually has to work harder to train the dog. Also, they mostly train larger dogs that don't have many of these issues. They will train any small dog that comes through their door. But, they've found that people with small dogs typically don't invest in obedience school.

After talking with them, they've said they are willing to work with whatever is best for me and my dog. They did warn me that the front-leading harness I had chosen would hurt her arms over time so I should just choose a plain harness that fits her.

Since these people are used to training large dogs all day, they can be intimidating to talk to. I'm also a shy person. So the first time I mentioned harnesses and they said they weren't necessary, I backed down. After your insistence and some extra research, I had the guts to call back and insist on using a harness. I also remembered that one of the Yorkies I grew up with had the characteristic "goose-honk," which was why we always used a harness with him. I was a child when we started doing that with him so I had forgotten why we chose a harness and why he coughed like that.

I will get her a harness today and start using it.

Good for you! I'm really proud of you. It is difficult to speak up to "experts", but you did the right thing. You are the voice for your pup. Good luck!

P.S.... I love Buddy Belt harnesses. They sell pads to put in them if your dog is sensitive. A user here named Maximo sells them.

[gracielove]

I understand your desire to train your baby properly. All dogs should be taught at least basic obedience. I hope these people are able to really help you considering that their expertise is really with large dogs. Maybe you could contact a Yorkshire Terrier Club in your area and get some information about groups that work with smaller dogs. Sometimes these types of groups are out there but are just a bit harder to find.

I just want to show you this particular harness. (it is available in various styles and colors) The main thing is that because the D ring is seated right on the shoulder blades or higher it gives you very good control over the dog. There is no pressure on the trachea but it does give the handler the advantage.
Ultra Easy ChokeFree & PawRider Pet Seatbelt Adapter (USA)
Some harnesses would not be helpful for training but if you can find one that gives you this type of control it will help you in your ability to get your puppy's attention and keep him going in the right direction.

I'm so glad your not going to risk your dog's health by training with a collar.

[concretegurl]

A good trainer will know breed specific training not just general dog training methodology.

For example a Yorkie and a laso can be trained the same but a good trainer will use different methods, same with a lab and pit they can be but a better trainer will use breed specific methods for a much better outcome.

[yorkietalkjilly]

Never head of such drivel as a trainer that would insist on a pinch or choke collar to train a little Yorkie. Training any dog, even a big, powerful dog to leash starts with its head not its neck and starts indoors or the back yard and no one should need a torture device to train a big, powerful dog to leash if done properly unless they want to cut corners or just enjoy that type training. And to insist you need a pinch collar on anything but a big, wild dog to get it from one place to another before you've had time to start any training, is just silly to me. Once you have had some time with a dog, a good trainer should not need a pinch/choke collar at all ever. Anybody that needs anything but a show lead as far as something that goes around the neck or a harness for a dog to walk or train it, is just cutting corners or doesn't know how to train a dog properly. As I say, leash training is really head training and once you've got your dog's head and heart, it's not going to pull that you can't correct the behavior with words or just stopping your walk and giving the dog some commands or your hands if it's jumping around from an extremely unusual provocation such as a cat fight just ahead or something. Placing your hands quietly on the dog - one on the chest and one on the back and a little eye contract will quiet a dog that's gone a little ballistic to something going on around it, kicking its prey drive into overdrive. You sure don't need some type pinching device around anything but a wild dog's neck and you really don't even need it then. And you really will never need something like that on a tiny little Yorkshire Terrier!

[Lovetodream88]

Originally Posted by mimodok

Well, I didn't get a chance to really express my concerns about tracheal collapse with the trainer. The only reason they don't use them is because the handler usually has to work harder to train the dog. Also, they mostly train larger dogs that don't have many of these issues. They will train any small dog that comes through their door. But, they've found that people with small dogs typically don't invest in obedience school.

After talking with them, they've said they are willing to work with whatever is best for me and my dog. They did warn me that the front-leading harness I had chosen would hurt her arms over time so I should just choose a plain harness that fits her.

Since these people are used to training large dogs all day, they can be intimidating to talk to. I'm also a shy person. So the first time I mentioned harnesses and they said they weren't necessary, I backed down. After your insistence and some extra research, I had the guts to call back and insist on using a harness. I also remembered that one of the Yorkies I grew up with had the characteristic "goose-honk," which was why we always used a harness with him. I was a child when we started doing that with him so I had forgotten why we chose a harness and why he coughed like that.

I will get her a harness today and start using it.

Thank you and I'm sure your yorkie thanks you too. My Callie just got diagnosed with CT and even though it was a mild case it took a lot for me not to break down and cry in the vets office because there is no cure and I didn't understand why someone would want to temp there dog getting something like that. I don't think I would trust a trainer who told me CT was no issue when they tell you that one harness can hurt there arms I would talk to your vet.

[mimodok]

This is just a basic obedience course that has 5 sessions, one each week. Once I get Mishka through the basics and used to the idea of training, I think I can teach her any additional training on my own. I may look into Yorkie clubs or something in my area also though.

For now I've gotten Mishka a comfortable step-in harness. It was the smallest thing I could find. Once she grows out of it I'll look into the Buddy Belt or PawRider that you linked.

We took her on her first walk with the harness and she did great. At first she pulled, but I corrected her with a "tug and release" each time she tried. If she wasn't getting it, I'd just stop walking until she was paying attention to me again. She caught on really quick and the rest of the walk was perfect.

I agree that this obedience school isn't the best. But, I believe it's one of the best available to me in my area. I do agree with the use of some negative reinforcement training. But, the pinch collars do seem a bit extreme--especially for toy breeds.

[Lovetodream88]

Originally Posted by mimodok

This is just a basic obedience course that has 5 sessions, one each week. Once I get Mishka through the basics and used to the idea of training, I think I can teach her any additional training on my own. I may look into Yorkie clubs or something in my area also though.

For now I've gotten Mishka a comfortable step-in harness. It was the smallest thing I could find. Once she grows out of it I'll look into the Buddy Belt or PawRider that you linked.

We took her on her first walk with the harness and she did great. At first she pulled, but I corrected her with a "tug and release" each time she tried. If she wasn't getting it, I'd just stop walking until she was paying attention to me again. She caught on really quick and the rest of the walk was perfect.

I agree that this obedience school isn't the best. But, I believe it's one of the best available to me in my area. I do agree with the use of some negative reinforcement training. But, the pinch collars do seem a bit extreme--especially for toy breeds.

Are you telling her how good she is when she is doing it right and giving her a treat?