YorkieTalk.com Forums - Yorkshire Terrier Community


Welcome to the YorkieTalk.com Forums Community - the community for Yorkshire Terriers.

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. You will be able to chat with over 35,000 YorkieTalk members, read over 2,000,000 posted discussions, and view more than 15,000 Yorkie photos in the YorkieTalk Photo Gallery after you register. We would love to have you as a member!

Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please click here to contact us.

Go Back   YorkieTalk.com Forums - Yorkshire Terrier Community > YorkieTalk > Sick & Injured / Emergencies Talk
Register Blogs FAQ Calendar JavaChat Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 01-29-2012, 03:32 PM   #1
Yorkie Yakker
 
mzwenc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Pittsburgh
Posts: 36
Animal Smiley 019 Urgent! Help! Don't understand test results!

Hi everyone,

We were supposed to Spay Rosie on 1/26/12 but when they did the blood test, the vet said that her ALT was 111 which was high and should be concern about that. Therefore she insisted on getting a bile acid test done. So we did that and she said that it will take two days for the results to come back. She prescribed 2 pills and 1 antibiotic for her to take for a month to help lower the ALT. Then the vet emails me saying that she called me on 01/28/12 and it went to voicemail. (I never got a call from her and there was no voicemail) Apart from that, she wrote this in an email which I don't quite understand:

I tried to call you today but only got your answering machine. Rosie's bile acids test came in. Although her baseline is normal (it was 8, normal being below 10), however the post prandial (after eating) challenge part of the test was abnormal (the post result was 60, with normal less than 20).

What does it mean? Is she really sick? Is it genetics? Does anyone have any experience with this? I am so nervous. She is my first furbaby and i am so devastated that this is turning out the way it is.. thanks for your time
__________________
Rosie Poo ~( First Furbaby )~
We are ...
mzwenc is offline   Reply With Quote
Welcome Guest!
Not Registered?

Join today and remove this ad!

Old 01-30-2012, 09:19 AM   #2
Owned by a Gremlin
Donating Member
 
Taryn0405's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: The Mitten State!
Posts: 3,706
Default

Hopefully Crystal will come on here. But speaking from experience in having a bile acid test done to my baby, there are two tests one before food and one after (I'm sure you got this explanation as well).
If it was high after eating, then it may (key word may) be an indication that that liver is not functioning 100%
My advice would be to talk to your vet and have her/him explain everything to you. I always ask my vet to "dummy it down".
When Gizmo got his done, his post bloodwork was 27 which was above 20. However, my doctor believed that it was simply and upset tummy that spiked the liver count. I'm not saying this is the case with Rosie but it's something to go over with your vet.
I don't know how much you were told, but a bile acid test is done for a dog with suspision of a liver shunt. There are many postings on this forum about it. And many success stories from Yorkie parents after their little one has had the liver shunt taken care of surgically.
But that's getting way too fard ahead. My first step would be contacting the vet and having them explain everything.

Good luck, and keep us posted.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mzwenc View Post
Hi everyone,

We were supposed to Spay Rosie on 1/26/12 but when they did the blood test, the vet said that her ALT was 111 which was high and should be concern about that. Therefore she insisted on getting a bile acid test done. So we did that and she said that it will take two days for the results to come back. She prescribed 2 pills and 1 antibiotic for her to take for a month to help lower the ALT. Then the vet emails me saying that she called me on 01/28/12 and it went to voicemail. (I never got a call from her and there was no voicemail) Apart from that, she wrote this in an email which I don't quite understand:

I tried to call you today but only got your answering machine. Rosie's bile acids test came in. Although her baseline is normal (it was 8, normal being below 10), however the post prandial (after eating) challenge part of the test was abnormal (the post result was 60, with normal less than 20).

What does it mean? Is she really sick? Is it genetics? Does anyone have any experience with this? I am so nervous. She is my first furbaby and i am so devastated that this is turning out the way it is.. thanks for your time
__________________
Taryn Momma to Gizmo AKA Monkeyman
My husband, daughter, son, and dog make me who I am
"My goal in life is to be as good of a person my dog already thinks I am."
Taryn0405 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 10:44 AM   #3
And Rylee Finnegan
Donating Member
 
Ellie May's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Metro Detroit, MI
Posts: 17,928
Default

I'm sorry in advance for typos.

It sounds like you have a good vet. Preop blood work indicated that her liver may be under stress. Bile acid testing gives more information about how the liver is functioning. Your girl's result is high, but nothing crazy.

There is a long list of things that can cause liver function issues. Somewhat commonly in yorkies is liver shunt which you could google. As a general rule though, post prandial bile acids are higher than your girl's when LS is present. I wouldn't worry too much that this is the problem. Micro vascular dysplasia (mvd) is also common. This is a sort of microscopic shunting in the liver. The bile acids often fall in this number range when mvd is present. This would be medically managed.

First thing to do is talk to the vet about the next step. The best option is probably a consult with an internal medicine specialist to try and get a diagnosis.

Sometimes drugs and such can make the bike aids go up also. Our vet may just want to retest in a month. Different vets' protocols vary. It may be a big problem but most likely it's not a huge deal. Try to relax until you talk to the vet. My dog's bike acids have been almost double that and she does fine.

Common scenario..although certainly not the only one..is a yorkietalk that has post bile acids in the 40-90ish range being diagnosed with mvd after specialist consult (a biopsy is needed for absolutely diagnosis but skipped a lot of times). They are managed for life on supplements and certain foods and particular attention is paid to drugs prescribed because they can be hard on the liver. They live long and happy lives.

So talk to your vet and don't focus on worst case scenario because that is likely not the case.

That ALT is a very low high. It is something to keep an eye on but no reason to panic.

I'm sorry that was a big ramble.
If I just confused you more or if you want something else explained, just pm me
__________________
Crystal, Ellie May (RIP), Rylee Finnegan, and Gracie Boo🐶
Ellie May is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 04:53 PM   #4
Yorkie Yakker
 
mzwenc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Pittsburgh
Posts: 36
Default

Thanks for the information. I spoke with the receptionist because apparently the vet was too busy. She told me that Rosie has a mild MVD and she is ok to spay tomorrow. They will use liquids to flush the anesthesia out so it doesnt affect her liver much. They highly recommend a biopsy. I asked if it was curable and they told me no. The biopsy will only verify that she does have a MVD. If we do the biopsy, the risks we are taking would be loss of blood, using a bigger tube, longer in anesthesia and other things she mentioned. Therefore I decided to not do the biopsy, I do not want Rosie to go through that. I figure that we will change her diet and monitor very closely. Do you think I am making the right decision? I want the best for her but if we are going to leave her open on the table for longer to confirm that it is a MVD and there is no cure I think we should just do changes on her lifestyle. Besides, the vet is charging me $320+ for her spaying and with the biopsy would be $600+. Is that how much it is supposed to be? I know that her health comes before money but I just don't want to get rip off. When we did her bile acid test they charged me for little things here and there.. even for her staying there while they examine her. I read a lot of posts regarding MVD and its scary but manageable. I hope everything goes well tomorrow
__________________
Rosie Poo ~( First Furbaby )~
We are ...
mzwenc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 05:34 PM   #5
YT 2000 Club
Donating Member
 
gemy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Etobicoke, ONtario, Canada
Posts: 12,279
Blog Entries: 2
Default

Well that is a hard one to advise on. It sounds like your vet is reasonably on top of LS issues, but I'm assuming this vet is no specialist. Ohio State University Hospital has a very good vet school and hospital ... it is where I would take my pup too, for a definitive diagnosis of MVD.

It sounds like you feel comfortable with your decision to not do the biopsy at this point. Let me ask you; is she staying in overnight - and if a problem were to occur at the vet clinic what are their resources there to deal with it? If she is staying overnight will someone be present 24/7 to monitor her?
__________________
Razzle and Dara. Our clan. RIP Karma Dec 24th 2004-July 14 2013 RIP Zoey Jun9 th 2008-May 12 2012. RIP Magic,Mar 26 2006July 1st 2018

Last edited by gemy; 01-30-2012 at 05:36 PM. Reason: typo
gemy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 05:44 PM   #6
Yorkie Yakker
 
mzwenc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Pittsburgh
Posts: 36
Default

Thank you for your concern Gemy She will be staying over night and the vet said that there is someone that stays there til a certain time. I wish I could be there with her but I am in a few hundred miles away and she is staying with my brother who is taking care of her. We decided to take her there because the vet actually cares and the ones where we live at just worry about the money. If anything happens (God forbid), they immediately transfer her to the Central Pennsylvania Veterinary Emergency Treatment Services. The vet told me that she has a lot of experience in spaying and that there should be no problems since they are going to be really cautious. It still makes me so nervous that I'm deciding not to do the biopsy and it scares me that I will regret in the future
__________________
Rosie Poo ~( First Furbaby )~
We are ...
mzwenc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 05:57 PM   #7
And Rylee Finnegan
Donating Member
 
Ellie May's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Metro Detroit, MI
Posts: 17,928
Default

I'm not sure that there is a right or wrong answer. I did elect to have my girl biopsied during spay, because it was a good chance to do it. There IS more risk to a spay this way. It IS more expensive. Some vets and internists will tell you it isn't necessary.

After consulting with your vet (not the staff), you should do what you and they think is best. It is generally assumed that Yorkies with bile acids in range indicate MVD. That might be okay. However, it isn't always true. There is at least one disease (rare but possible in dogs) that can raise the bile acids, but it has a different treatment plan than MVD to a certain extent (hepatic lipidosis).

Personally, with an asymptomatic dog, I wouldn't be too excited to be cutting into a liver. The other side to that is the fact that they will already be right there. I think this is only something your vet (or a specialist) can advise you on.

If there is a staff member there only until a certain time, then your pup will be left alone for part of the night. Because of the anesthesia wearing off, new pain meds being used, risk of the incision opening, possible breakthrough pain that needs to be managed, and problems related to dogs being unattended when an IV is placed, I would not leave her overnight.
__________________
Crystal, Ellie May (RIP), Rylee Finnegan, and Gracie Boo🐶
Ellie May is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 06:15 PM   #8
Yorkie Yakker
 
mzwenc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Pittsburgh
Posts: 36
Default

Thanks for your reply Ellie May. I think you are right, I don't want to leave her overnight but the vet insisted we do last time we were there. I will speak with her about it. My boyfriend wants to take her home after her spaying since he will be able to take care of her in case anything happens. Rosie is also not interested in her food since I bought her new bag of Iams puppy food. I asked the vet if we should change her diet to maybe for a low protein one and she insisted that we dont. I researched that Iams is not a good dog food but yet the vet recommended. I definitely want to change her diet when she gets back home. Currently she is on medication: amoxidropzentonil plus and metronidazole. Would medication such as heartgard/frontline affect blood tests or bile acid tests? Just curious
__________________
Rosie Poo ~( First Furbaby )~
We are ...
mzwenc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 06:23 PM   #9
Resident Yorkie Nut Donating YT 20K Club Member
 
ladyjane's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Texas
Posts: 26,842
Default

I would not leave my pup overnight in a facility where no one is there at night, especially after surgery. I know a lot of people do it, but it is not for me.

I hope that you can find a vet closer to you. There has to be a good vet in your area. Maybe if you ask around on YT you might find someone in the Pittsburgh area who has a vet they can recommend. You really need to have a vet close by that you can count on.

Hope that all goes well tomorrow. I agree that you and the vet need to discuss this at length. Good luck. I will keep Rosie in my thoughts and prayers.
ladyjane is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 08:24 PM   #10
Donating YT 30K Club Member
 
Patti's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Illinois
Posts: 35,509
Blog Entries: 6
Default

My Cali has mild MVD. Her bile acids were 0/84 and 0/50 ish if I remember correctly. I did the ultrasound and had a liver biopsy done when she was spayed. She was spayed at a Specialty clinic because they thought she may have a blockage and she needed the liver biopsy. The biopsy confirmed she had very mild MVD and needed no treatment. The cost for her surgery was over 2,000.00. But it was a board certified surgeon who did it and I felt very confident with her. In the end it probably made no difference that I had the biopsy, but it did confirm she had very mild MVD. I would not leave my babies where there is no vet on duty overnight. I'd rather take them home and watch them myself. Fortunately, I live 5 minutes from the ER specialty clinic. I hope everything works out for Rosie. It can be overwhelming to go through this. We are all here for you.
__________________
Cali Pixie Roxie : RIP Nikki; RIP Maya;RIP my sweet Dixie girl 1/17/08
http://callipuppyscastle.bravehost.com/index.html
Patti is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 10:39 AM   #11
Yorkie Yakker
 
mzwenc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Pittsburgh
Posts: 36
Default

I just want to thank everyone who provided me with useful information and helped me through this tough time. It is going to be a challenge going forward, however at least now I know what we are dealing with. We just picked up Rosie from the vet this morning and they said she was doing great. She barely ate while being there but she didn't need a cone to prevent her from licking her incision. We are going to switch her from Iams (she refuses to eat it unless she is starving) to Blue Buffalo. We mixed it so she would get used to it but she picks at it and only eats the BB and not Iams. As far as the vet informed me, she will need to be on medication and will need annual bile acid tests. Thank you for those wonderful thoughts and advise. I really appreciate it. I think I was freaking out way more than she was. I'm just glad she is ok for now.
__________________
Rosie Poo ~( First Furbaby )~
We are ...
mzwenc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 11:19 AM   #12
Owned by a Gremlin
Donating Member
 
Taryn0405's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: The Mitten State!
Posts: 3,706
Default

Glad to know you're little one is doing better. Remember, it's your right as a dog owner to have a vet explain things, and explain them until you understand it.

Prayers that your baby feels better and has a speedy recovery.
__________________
Taryn Momma to Gizmo AKA Monkeyman
My husband, daughter, son, and dog make me who I am
"My goal in life is to be as good of a person my dog already thinks I am."
Taryn0405 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks



Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off




Google
 

SHOP NOW: Amazon :: eBay :: Buy.com :: Newegg :: PetStore :: Petco :: PetSmart


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 06:45 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright ©2003 - 2018 YorkieTalk.com
Privacy Policy - Terms of Use

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353 354 355 356 357 358 359 360 361 362 363 364 365 366 367 368 369 370 371 372 373 374 375 376 377 378 379 380 381 382 383 384 385 386 387 388 389 390 391 392 393 394 395 396 397 398 399 400 401 402 403 404 405 406 407 408 409 410 411 412 413 414 415 416 417 418 419 420 421 422 423 424 425 426 427 428 429 430 431 432 433 434 435 436 437 438 439 440 441 442 443 444 445 446 447 448 449 450 451 452 453 454 455 456 457 458 459 460 461 462 463 464 465 466 467 468 469 470 471 472 473 474 475 476 477 478 479 480 481 482 483 484 485 486 487 488 489 490 491 492 493 494 495 496 497 498 499 500 501 502 503 504 505 506 507 508 509 510 511 512 513 514 515 516 517 518 519 520 521 522 523 524 525 526 527 528 529 530 531 532 533 534 535 536 537 538 539 540 541 542 543 544 545 546 547 548 549 550 551 552 553 554 555 556 557 558 559 560 561 562 563 564 565 566 567 568 569 570 571 572 573 574 575 576 577 578 579 580 581 582 583 584 585 586 587 588 589 590 591 592 593 594 595 596 597 598 599 600 601 602 603 604 605 606 607 608 609 610 611 612 613 614 615 616 617 618 619 620 621 622 623 624 625 626 627 628 629 630 631 632 633 634 635 636 637 638 639 640 641 642 643 644 645 646 647 648 649 650 651 652 653 654 655 656 657 658 659 660 661 662 663 664 665 666 667 668 669 670 671 672 673 674 675 676 677 678 679 680 681 682 683 684 685 686 687 688 689 690 691 692 693 694 695 696 697 698 699 700 701 702 703 704 705 706 707 708 709 710 711 712 713 714 715 716 717 718 719 720 721 722 723 724 725 726 727 728 729 730 731 732 733 734 735 736 737 738 739 740 741 742 743 744 745 746 747 748 749 750 751 752 753 754 755 756 757 758 759 760 761 762 763 764 765 766 767 768 769 770 771 772 773 774 775 776 777 778 779 780 781 782 783 784 785 786 787 788 789 790 791 792 793 794 795 796 797 798 799 800 801 802 803 804 805 806 807 808 809 810 811 812 813 814 815 816 817 818 819 820 821 822 823 824 825 826 827 828 829 830 831 832 833 834 835 836 837 838 839 840 841 842 843 844 845 846 847 848 849 850 851 852 853 854 855 856 857 858 859 860 861 862 863 864 865 866 867 868 869 870 871 872 873 874 875 876 877 878 879 880 881 882 883 884 885 886 887 888 889 890 891 892 893 894 895 896 897 898 899 900 901 902 903 904 905 906 907 908 909 910 911 912 913 914 915 916 917 918 919 920 921 922 923 924 925 926 927 928 929 930 931 932 933 934 935 936 937 938 939 940 941 942 943 944 945 946 947 948 949 950 951 952 953 954 955 956 957 958 959 960 961 962 963 964 965 966 967 968 969 970 971 972 973 974 975 976 977 978 979 980 981 982 983 984 985 986 987 988 989 990 991 992 993 994 995 996 997 998 999 1000 1001 1002 1003 1004 1005 1006 1007 1008 1009 1010 1011 1012 1013 1014 1015 1016 1017 1018 1019 1020 1021 1022 1023 1024 1025 1026 1027 1028 1029 1030 1031 1032 1033 1034 1035 1036 1037 1038 1039 1040 1041 1042 1043 1044 1045 1046 1047 1048 1049 1050 1051 1052 1053 1054 1055 1056 1057 1058 1059 1060 1061 1062 1063 1064 1065 1066 1067 1068 1069 1070 1071 1072 1073 1074 1075 1076 1077 1078 1079 1080 1081 1082 1083 1084 1085 1086 1087 1088 1089 1090 1091 1092 1093 1094 1095 1096 1097 1098 1099 1100 1101 1102 1103 1104 1105 1106 1107 1108 1109 1110 1111 1112 1113 1114 1115 1116 1117 1118 1119 1120 1121 1122 1123 1124 1125 1126 1127 1128 1129 1130 1131 1132 1133 1134 1135 1136 1137 1138 1139 1140 1141 1142 1143 1144 1145 1146 1147 1148 1149 1150 1151 1152 1153 1154 1155 1156 1157 1158 1159 1160 1161 1162 1163 1164 1165 1166