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Old 02-13-2010, 12:09 PM   #1
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Default cushings (yorkie tested borderline positive)

my 10 1/2 y.o. yorkie just tested borderline positive for cushings. the vet says he is becoming a cushings dog. the vet is not anxious to start him on meds yet. anybody have any opinion on this?

my dog periodically pees in the house, though so far he only does this if i am away from home for a few hours. (is that cushings or separation anxiety?) his hair is thinning. no scratching or itchy skin yet. so far he drinks about 4 ounces of water within a 5 hour period.

i have read real horror stories about mitotane. what about anypril? im nervous about beginning med therapy because i dont want him to get worse symptoms. any ideas for me?
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Old 02-13-2010, 12:31 PM   #2
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Sorry to hear about your baby. My Pom came down with Cushing's right about that age. The medicine was so strong and we had to take her off of it as it wasn't working and it caused her to have liver disease which they reversed with meds but we could no longer treat her Cushing's. She did pretty good for 2 years until her heart failed a year ago.
Her symptoms were extreme hunger, excessive drinking and peeing, large amount of hair loss on her sides and tail and body sores and itchy skin. I would definately have a internal medicine specialist see him. It is a very difficult disease to mange but many have had success with newer meds. The last six months they put her on anypril and it really helped make her last 6 months better and it helped with her doggy alzheimers too. If you have any questions I'd be happy to help. There is a good Cushing's forum but I don't know the website.
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Old 02-13-2010, 01:04 PM   #3
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I think the forum is in the yahoo groups. I think that would be your best bet, join and learn from others experiences. Good luck to you and your baby.
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Old 02-13-2010, 01:17 PM   #4
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I do not have any advice for you as I am not familiar with the disease, but I just wanted to say that I am sorry to hear about your baby.

I am hoping moderator Wylie's Mom will see this thread and comment.
I know her boy Wylie has Cushings.
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Old 02-13-2010, 01:36 PM   #5
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I do NOT want you alarmed - read all you can please !

My son lost his little Mikey (weenie dog) at only 6 years old to Cushings and my son is an excellent pet person - he really never had symptoms - Mikey had very regular vet checks etc and then one day - boom ....he went downhill fast.... IT was horrible - I'll never forget the haunted face of my son

It's POSSIBLE there were other things going on but all I can tell you is they had a healthy happy little dog then a very sick one

I hope this is something controlled by medication and you're ahead of things knowing now before later

Last edited by red98vett; 02-13-2010 at 01:37 PM.
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Old 02-13-2010, 02:18 PM   #6
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Join a Cushing's group today if you havent already! It will save your dogs life and what ever you do never ever let anyone talk you into Lysodrine. You will need to likely educate your vet on what you learn on these Cushing's forums and dont back down. When Trixie was diagnosed in 2004 Lysodrine was the US drug of choice any UK was using Anypril. I dont know what advances have happened since but Anypril was a much better option back then. It wasn't FDA approved but you could get a waiver and import the med here with a vets approval. I gave my vet all sorts of research as to why it was a better option. Lysodrine was like the equivalent of chemotherapy. I thought I had convinced my vet and last minute he said no - he wanted to stick with Lysidrine. After her second day on the meds she was dead. I still havent forgiven myself because my gut said not to put her on Lysodrine and I will never forgive that vet. As far as I am concerned he killed her.

Learn from my mistake. The people on those forums are dedicated to the illness and researching every journal the can find. In fact I joined a kidney disease forum when Roxy was stricken with it and I credit them for giving her 4 years of quality life my vet did not think she would have. The forums out there are amazing.
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Old 02-13-2010, 06:16 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orahurd View Post
my 10 1/2 y.o. yorkie just tested borderline positive for cushings. the vet says he is becoming a cushings dog. the vet is not anxious to start him on meds yet. anybody have any opinion on this?

my dog periodically pees in the house, though so far he only does this if i am away from home for a few hours. (is that cushings or separation anxiety?) his hair is thinning. no scratching or itchy skin yet. so far he drinks about 4 ounces of water within a 5 hour period.

i have read real horror stories about mitotane. what about anypril? im nervous about beginning med therapy because i dont want him to get worse symptoms. any ideas for me?
here is some info on cushings and wylie's mom is dealing with this so she should be able to help you

loss of hair on back is a sign of cushings and drinking alot of water and peeing alot is a sign as well and pot belly is another sign

was your dog ever on steroids?

Hyperadrenocorticism (Cushing's Syndrome) in Dogs
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Old 02-13-2010, 06:18 PM   #8
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join this group on yahoo they will know best meds etc and i think Ann is on there too

CanineCushings-AutoimmuneCare : Cushing's Syndrome | Autoimmune Disease
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Old 02-13-2010, 06:20 PM   #9
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Join a Cushing's group today if you havent already! It will save your dogs life and what ever you do never ever let anyone talk you into Lysodrine. You will need to likely educate your vet on what you learn on these Cushing's forums and dont back down. When Trixie was diagnosed in 2004 Lysodrine was the US drug of choice any UK was using Anypril. I dont know what advances have happened since but Anypril was a much better option back then. It wasn't FDA approved but you could get a waiver and import the med here with a vets approval. I gave my vet all sorts of research as to why it was a better option. Lysodrine was like the equivalent of chemotherapy. I thought I had convinced my vet and last minute he said no - he wanted to stick with Lysidrine. After her second day on the meds she was dead. I still havent forgiven myself because my gut said not to put her on Lysodrine and I will never forgive that vet. As far as I am concerned he killed her.

Learn from my mistake. The people on those forums are dedicated to the illness and researching every journal the can find. In fact I joined a kidney disease forum when Roxy was stricken with it and I credit them for giving her 4 years of quality life my vet did not think she would have. The forums out there are amazing.
i agree i always join one of those groups when my dog has something and they are amazing much more knowledgeable than most vets as they do a ton of research and educate themselves thoroughly about the disease and they live with it daily
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Old 02-13-2010, 06:22 PM   #10
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there is a new drug for this not sure but wanted you to know about it

FDA Approves New Drug to Treat Cushing?s Disease in Dogs
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Old 02-13-2010, 06:24 PM   #11
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also you may want to have ann move this to sick and injured so others may jump in to help
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Old 02-13-2010, 06:47 PM   #12
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there is a new drug for this not sure but wanted you to know about it

FDA Approves New Drug to Treat Cushing?s Disease in Dogs
Thats the drug! Not Anapril, I remembered wrong - it was trilostane that is the standard in UK that I tried unsuccessfully to talk my vet into. Im so happy to read this...hmm, I wonder if that vet thought of me when this approval came through and felt at least a little badly. Wow - I havent thought about this since 2004. Damn the FDA for taking this long.
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Old 02-13-2010, 06:53 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orahurd View Post
my 10 1/2 y.o. yorkie just tested borderline positive for cushings. the vet says he is becoming a cushings dog. the vet is not anxious to start him on meds yet. anybody have any opinion on this?

my dog periodically pees in the house, though so far he only does this if i am away from home for a few hours. (is that cushings or separation anxiety?) his hair is thinning. no scratching or itchy skin yet. so far he drinks about 4 ounces of water within a 5 hour period.

i have read real horror stories about mitotane. what about anypril? im nervous about beginning med therapy because i dont want him to get worse symptoms. any ideas for me?
I was reading up on this disease and found out there are a lot of tests that should be given before a correct diagnoses can be given. Here is the article:
Increased Drinking and Urinating
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Old 02-13-2010, 06:57 PM   #14
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Orahurd - oh gosh - so sorry you're going through this - Cushing's and Atypical Cushing's are extremely complicated...and I want to caution you that many vets don't deal w/ this often, and don't understand it completely - so *sometimes* you really do need to either see an Internist to get a handle on things (get direction) and...this truly is one disease (in my opinion) where the owner has to take a *lot* of ownership in the pet's health care.

So, I'm not going to bombard you w/ a ton of info right off the bat -- but here's a start:

1) Was this "borderline" diagnosed thru a cortisol-creatinine ratio urine test?
2) If yes, if that indeed produced the borderline diagnosis, then the next step would be an ACTH stim test....and then usually you also get an ultrasound of the adrenal glands (but if you want, you can wait until after results from the stim) (if ACTH ends up also being inconclusive, then blood has to be sent to U of Tenn., where they test for Atypical Cushings, by Dr. Jack Oliver's team)
3) Was your kiddo's thyroid tested, and also was he tested for diabetes...both of these would be important...
4) How bad is the frequent urination (which, btw, also would mean, by default, that he is drinking more - these are called polyuria/polysdipsia or PU/PD)? Other symptoms? (see the Cushing's page below I'm linking you to...)

From there...there are a whoooole bunch of steps...but all of that depends on whether the diagnosis is Cushing's or Atypical Cushing's (result of ACTH Stim is first step). Even more confusing (bear with me!) is that...Cushing's can be caused by either a tumor in the adrenal glands OR by a tumor in the pituitary gland OR it can be due to previous use of steroids (was your baby on steroids?). OR, if it is Atypical Cushing's (like my Wylie), then it is caused by abnormal intermediate "sex" hormone regulation (in Wylie's case, progesterone - but several other hormones can cause AT Cushings).

So, see what I mean? OY! And that's just the beginning of it...but don't freak bc I'm here for you and I've been there and am still there (Wy was only diagnosed May 09)!

Here is my favorite Cushing's overview.

And the yahoo Cushing's group that's already been mentioned contains the best info/archives on the web about this disease, imo. Also, Dr. Jack Oliver (of U of Tenn.) responds to this yahoo group . (btw, also on this Yahoo Group - people list Vet Internists by State who they've personally used, and who have experience with Cushing's diagnosing)

As far as treatment, depends on so many things (symptoms, age, results of testing, current state of health...etc...ect) - so I won't bombard you with that now....okay?
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Old 02-13-2010, 07:05 PM   #15
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Also, Orahurd, please let me know when you see these replies....I want to move this to the "Sick" Forum.

Btw, Wylie was on Lysodren (mitotane) - hardly a side effect at all..we kept increasing his dose, but couldn't get his levels down to where we needed (did ACTH Stims every 4-6 wks since May). We just stopped Lyso and started him on a low dose of Ketoconazole...and I don't think it's doing much - we Stim next Thur, so we'll see (again, hardly any side effects).

Nutshell is this: I wouldn't recommend starting Lysodren until you know specifically what your kiddo has (Is it Cushing's for sure? If yes, Adrenal or Pituitary?) (Is it Atypical Cushing's? If yes, which hormone is causing it? Bc every intermediate hormone has a specific regimen.)

So sorry if I'm overwhelming you!
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