Glad she is doing so much better

That is great that Lacy is doing better!! Did she have a good night and eating better today?? I hope she is back playing again really soon!! When do you hear about the test results?? :hands:

She's been feeling fine since yesterday and has been acting like her normal rotten self LOL. She had a normal poop today too. Today would be the earliest results could be back, but it might be Monday or Tuesday next week

GREAT NEWS! Have a good week-end.

:p Darla

Still hoping and praying for good results...the waiting is very hard. Happy to hear Lacy is feeling more like herself...maybe that's a good sign!!!

Results
 

Apparently Lacy has Hepatic Lipidosis (Fatty Liver). This is a very common liver disease in cats, but it is not usually seen in adult dogs. But I did find an article that said that it is usually toy breed dogs that get it, esp yorkies, chihuahuas and fox terriers. Other than that I just can't find much info for dogs, and her vets didn't have much info about hepatic lipidosis in dogs either.

We also had a GI panel run on her blood to to check and she has diffuse small intestinal disease. Her Cobalamine and Folate levels were low. Cobalamine was 258 which was technically right on the low end of the normal reference range but they really want Cobalamine to be greater than 450. Her folate was 7.4 and normal is over 7.7. They said possiblities are Inflammatory bowel disease, parasites (although none were found on fecal float), allergies, food intolerance, or bacterial overgrowth. We could do an endoscopic intestinal biopsy to find out for sure...but I don't think we are going that route until we try some things first (and she gets sicker).

So I'm going to submit a fecal sample to the GI lab monday so they can run a PCR test for parasites in case any were missed. And she will be treated with Tylan for a month and also Phenbenazol (a dewormer) for any parasites or bacterial overgrowth. And for for both of her conditions we will be changing her diet to a homecooked, low-fat diet. I'm not clear on protein requirements..sent an email to her vet to get clarification. She also wanted her to try a novel protein, but Lacy has eaten almost everything! She's had fish, but some of the recipes suggested include fish, and there is one with bison, and one with crab.

The hepatic lipidosis just confuses me though! It's so uncommon in dogs and I just can't find much info. I found one short article on Hepatic Lipidosis in toy breed dogs. I just don't understand what caused it. She's not overweight and not diabetic. She has been eating Nature's Variety raw medallions for 2 1/2 years and they say MIN 6% fat (which would be MIN 18.75% fat on dry matter basis). The vet was concerned that the true fat content was much higher than their MIN level stated so I'm going to contact NV to ask for exact fat levels if they can give me that. But I have a hard time believing they are higher than any other commercial dog food :confused: Another concern I brought up to her was the Petzlife gel I've been using. It has grain alcohol in it, which the company claims is safe, and I only used small amounts each time I applied it...but alcoholism in humans can lead to fatty liver...so I wondered. I might contact Petzlife to ask as well. Her vet said it's unlikely that Petzlife is the cause but recommended we stop using the product.

So...basically that's what we know right now. I feel good about the results as things could have been much more serious, but I still also have a lot of questions and hope we can get her fatty liver and intestinal disease under control with treatment and diet so it doesn't progress.

Thankyou so much everyone for you concern and advice

she has been feeling good and acting like her normal self :)

I'm glad you know what is going on now. I've been checking back here every day.
I am hoping you find diet fit for Lacy. You are a wonderful yorkie owner, Lacy is very blessed to have you to care for her.
Hugs and snuggles for Lacy, we will be thinking of her!

Did they test Lacy's triglyclerides? One of the Maltese on SM had high triglyclerides and even got fat deposits behind his eyes and the culprit turned out to be the high fat content in Innova's Evo. With a switch in diet Quincy's triglyclerides can back down into the normal range.

She only had fasted bloodwork (both at her first vet visit and before surgery). Her vet suggested doing a cholesterol/trigylceride panel but didn't know if it would be accurate if we've already switched her diet. So I dont know :confused:

I'm sorry to hear Lacy isn't feeling too well and about her elevated BAT.
I'm offering prayers that she will feel better soon.

I'm glad you got some answers now, at least you have a direction to go in. I will be interested to hear what these pet product companies tell you.

This Hepatic Lipidosis does sound confusing -- it also seems like one unusual thing for yorkies to get. I hope you can find more information on this. Is there any possibility that the vet will make a case study out of what Lacy is dealing with?

Glad she is back to herself. Hope the medicine even helps her to feel better.

Interesting diagnosis.
It isn't common in dogs but can happen obviously.
Her u/s results did make me wonder about it.

You may want to test triglycerides anyway. I know Ellie's internist thought it would be good idea too test hers and see if they were high despite being on a low fat diet.

That is actually a scary thought now that you bring it up. The NV is low fat at 18-19% but that is the minimum. So how do we "know" it isn't higher? The same goes for other companies as well. And what about the people who need low protein for their dogs...just because it is a 20% min. or whatever doesn't really mean much.:confused:

The low b12 could also mean PLE I think...hopefully not the case here though.

Did the vet give you a % of fat that you need to stay under?

Petzlife...I just don't know about the stuff. It is full of alcohol and whether it causes damage or not, I don't see no reason to take the chance.

Thanks for the update Michelle! I am so glad that Lacy is doing better. She is in good hands!! You are a great mommy! :hug:

Hmmmm...very interesting. At least you have an answer, but still, this is unusual.

Interestingly, last year a male (human :p) friend of ours suddenly was Dx w/ fatty liver - he was normal wt, not diabetic, and not a drinker. My sister is an internist, so I ran all of his tests by her and described what was going on. She indicated that fatty liver is often completely idiopathic, which seems so odd to me, but that's what she said. She also said that it can resolve very easily for some people within 6 months or so. Sure enough, my friend ate a lower fat diet, cut out all alcohol, exercised a little more than usual - and after about 6 mths or so, his liver tested totally normal. So, I know it's awful not to know a cause, but I guess this is common w/ fatty liver.

The Petzlife issue is concerning too...makes me wonder...

Michele - I'm happy to hear Lacy is feeling better. You've brought up several items that we've been concerned about as well.

Petzlife... I started using it a couple of years ago but found that the kids really didn't like it. It smelled so strong. I stopped using it but saw that there was an increase in tarter on their teeth. I did start using again but I diluted it. I only use it once a week - at bath time and I try to brush with a toothpaste a couple of times a week.

Raw diet... I know that some people are totally into this and I don't discourage anyone from doing it. We did try it on Mia when she was under a year old because we had such a hard time trying to get her to eat anything. Maybe we have OCD but just the fact that it was raw and the bacteria that could develop - scared us.

Mia had problems when we first got her and we have had to try many different foods to find one that would keep her stools firm and one that she would eat. I'm not crazy about the Science Diet that she's on - but it is doing the job.

Maybe we should post a poll on the Petzlife. I'm really curious about that now.

Thanks for the update.

I agree that Petzlife is a NO NO - there is no need to give our dogs something with grain alcohol in it. We use Maxi/Guard :thumbup:

Have you joined the Dog Liver Disease group on Yahoo yet? (Olga) does incredible research and I bet she could help guide you ;)

TJ was on Tylan for just under 1 year. His folate levels were sky high, they Vet said IBD (bacteria overgrowth). Tylan was the only thing that helped stop his episodes :)

-Nicole

This is all very much interesting. As it seems Lacy and Tanj are in the same boat. Just out of the blue Tanj started having liver issues too. And I too was feeding NV raw chicken but only for about 3 months before everything started. And I was using Petzlife 1-2 times a day for about 2-3 months. So I think it may be some kind of relation somewhere.

When I took Tanj to the vet 2 weeks ago the vet asked if she had gotten into anything that could have been poisonous and I racked my brain for about a week, and out of the blue Petzlife popped in my mind. So I too will be digging for answers.

It is strange...maybe there is something that predisposes certain people/dogs/cats to this :confused: Hopefully with a diet change, her liver will get back to normal too.

I had joined a Liver shunt/MVD support group. Can you give me a link to the liver group you are talking about? It would probably be better to be on one that includes all liver diseases.

That is interesting... I e-mailed Petzlife with my concerns and Lacy's diagnosis. Did you get an exact diagnosis for Tanj? Maybe you should e-mail Petzlife as well.

Yeah, I might go ahead and test her triglycerides anyway. I also e-mailed NV to ask about exact fat content but haven't heard back from them yet. HOpefully they can give me a good answer. Her vet used balanceit.com to formulate a few diets and e-mailed them to me and they range from 16-19% fat.

Lacy does not need to be on a protein-restricted diet...just a lower fat diet with novel proteins... I'm going to make the Dr. Dodd's liver diet today just so she'll have something low fat and with fish to eat for a few days until I get other supplements I would need for other diets. But she can't be on that for long because it's way too low in protein.

I saw a link to a nutritionist..Dr. Susan Davis I think..in another thread. I'm just wondering if I ought to consult a nutritionist. Or do any of you have holistic nutritionists that do phone consults?

Here are something interesting I found about Petzlife (I'm still searching):

Amazon.com: Customer Reviews: Petzlife Oral Care Gel and Spray Read "beware, has grain alcohol


No MyFairLady I have not gotten an exact diagnosis for Tanj. My vet is pretty much treating it as a poisoning case. I will be contacting Petzlife after I do a little bit more digging.

I have a Nutritionist from Cornell Univ.
We communicate through emails. The diet cost $140 - it will be created with human ingredients and human supplements/vitamins. He is highly recommended. Let me know if you want his contact info.

Here is the Yahoo Group:
DogLiverDisease : Dog Liver Disease

I am so glad you did not have to go the weekend waiting on the results and you can now rest knowing you have a plan and can move forward.

I am very glad you posted about the PETZLIFE it never even dawned on me and just this week I was going to start using it. I will think twice now;)

Continued Prayers for you and your babies.

HUGS
Vicki

I have three diets formulated by a nutritionist. They were created for Ellie but should work here. They are all 24% protein and 18% fat. One is standard chicken or turkey with grain or sweet potato and veggies, one is whitefish, sweet potato and oatmeal and one is egg and sweet potato. Two of them contain fish oil. They all use Balance IT K ( the Balance IT type recommended for liver compromised dogs which does not contain the controversial menadione that the regular Balance IT contains). Balance IT can also give you a list of human supplements that you can use instead. The calcium/phos. they use is something that contains SLS which I was kind of uneasy about. Let me know if you are interested in any of the diets we have here.

And since you can add about 10% unbalanced food to most dog diets without needing to readjust cal/phos ratio, etc., you could probably add a couple extra bites of protein a day if you wanted to.

I tried doing a search and couldn't get any complaints to come up. That's really interesting to hear...I just really wonder if the alcohol is too much for some dogs. If this product is causing some liver problems in some dogs, the company needs to be aware of it. I just don't know how they'd be able to know for sure.

Even though the vet recommended the discontinuing of Petzlife, it doesn't' mean the Petzlife caused the problem. The vet even said" it's "unlikely that Petzlife caused the problem", he just thinks it's safer not to give it to a dog with liver problems, which is common sense. I just hope everyone doesn't over generalize. Only you know how much of the product you used, but tartar is such a problem with yorkies, and I hate to see a good product vilified, if there is indeed no problem. I think it's great that you told the company, but I hope people are careful about what they pass as facts. I have long thought that raw was not the best choice for small breed dogs, and I believe that this should be looked at more closely, but I don't think anyone can generalize much from this. Best of luck with Lacy.

I tend to agree. I bet Lacy's diet is the culprit rather than Petzlife. As I said, we have a little Maltese on another forum who had high triglycerides and fat deposits behind the eyes from Innova Evo. We have a vet tech who is also a member and she said they had seen several cases of high triglycerides in dogs on the high fat, high protein diets like Evo.

It will be interesting to see if the low fat homemade diet makes a difference. It did with the little Maltese, Quincy. All his bloodwork was completely normal after a change in diet.

BTW, Quincy's mom was and still is using Petzlife.

There is a great deal of information on how athletes process fats and cholesterol differently then couch potatoes. I see Yorkies more like a couch potato and I see the wolf as an extreme athlete. The good news is that: