That would be awsome if this specialist would talk with us. It would lay a lot of problems to rest.

I will call them and ask if I can share their information.... they are busy so it may take a few days since their first priority is their patients, and i am not going to lie saying I need medical help for my dog.

I read that other thread that was linked here, and am going to see if I can find out where this person is located, who said you can breed a lg breed with a small breed, since apparently this lady is from my state. I guess I am a skeptic because anyone can say and be anyone they want to be on the net, but it is harder to hide who you are in person... there is no way a reproductive specialist can "pretend" they are anyone else, when they have their own vet office with certificates on the wall that you can see an feel.

I still beleive that genetics play a part, and so the statement that the pup will grow only to the space allowed, isn't a complete answer. In theory it sounds good, but what about scientifically? I don't have enough experience, or knowledge to know that answer... but from my nursing education- I do believe that there is so many factors that making a blanket statement like that isn't really an answer. (the statement made saying the pup will only grow to the size of the uterus)

Just posting the contact info would be helpful so we can actually do a phone conference and pay them for their time. Can you post the names and the telephone numbers? Thanks.

Just to set the record straight I don't think the reproductive specialist who I cited that made the statement that "the puppy will grow to fill the space" was necessarily advocating the breeding of tiny dogs...she was merely stating the scientific fact about all dogs' natural propensity to mate and the fact that it is POSSIBLE ( maybe not advisable or in the female's best interest) to have the pups of a larger breed dog.

It makes sense that reproductive specialists may disagree on this and some may think the "frame" (width, height and length rather than weight) of the dog is a truer test as YorkieRose has alluded to, rather than weight, but some may just arbitrarily set 5 lbs as their ethical limit and leave it at that.

The "frame" test makes more sense to me as a layperson. I would doubt that we will get 100% agreeement on the size or weight that each will say is the limit but we are sure learnign a lot and people can now make a more educated decision about breeding or about supporting a particular breeding program (or not) as a consumer.

It would be great to have a specialist actually join us so we can ask the specific questions we all have on this and other issues. :thumbup:

I called, and talked with the receptionist.... she said no to sharing the names and number on the internet- and didn't sound to hopeful that they would come here, but I did leave the name of the forum.. and then refered me to the university vet school here in mn.

I can understand that they are busy, they are the most recomended reproductive vet here- everyone I talked to refered me to them. I also understand why they don't want their information out on the forum (she said the last thing they need is a handful of people calling asking the same questions)

She said I would have better luck contacting the school here and seeing if they would do a question answer section on this forum.

My computer keeps going to a black screen and freezing up... ( I started this post 3 times already) so I am going to see if I can get it fixed and check out the u of m vet school.

Socal- it would be very helpful for you to have your vet/breeder of tinies to come here.... since they are a vet also, they would have more "knowledge" then we do.... if they strongly believe in breeding tinies, (and are doing it themselves) they may want to educate those of us who are against it.

I will keep looking here for someone, but I don't think I am going to have any luck with the reproductive vet.... so I will check out the vet schools here.

Is anyone good at writing letters? we can write up a letter to send to the school, so it sounds professional and maybe they will be willing to set up some time to give us an educated question/ answer session?

Kim would you please provide us the name of the reproductive specialist that you speak of. That way we could have a second oppion it the situation came up. It would also give us the names of two in differents parts of the county- which will benefit those close to these specialists. Thank you in advance for your cooperation.

I'll help in any way that I can.

Are they not listed in the phone book? She cannot stop you from sharing the info if someone wants to pay for their servcies. Where are you located and L will try to find them myslf or just PM the info then you haven't posted it publicly.

I don't where you got the idea that I have a vet who breeds tinies??? I do not. I did say that I knew of vets who breed 4 lb dogs but I do not know them and have not used their services. I clearly posted that one was my Ava's breeder's vet and I did talk to him twice before I bought Ava as I always check them as a reference when I purchase a dog, but I didn't keep the record of him. I have emailed the breeder but she has not returned my email yet. I have also stated that Ava's breeder does not breed tinies.

There are plenty of breeders who are already members here who breed tinies but we have been searching for a theriogenologist ever since I discovered their existence and posted about them a while back.

Kathy~

I have posted her name many times but I will do it again....Dr. Margaret V. Root Kustritz, University of Minnesota small animal theriogenologist

txshopper- I am going to search their site (u of m vet.) and get their email... then we can create a letter, asking one of their reproductive vets to come here for a question, answer thing or just a post on their views- which I don't know their views.... if you can write a letter, I will find a place to send it.

Socal- I am going to honor their request- it isn't very professional of me to go against their wishes at this point- I did state what they had told me when I called them regarding my yorkie having babies, at that time breeding tinies wasn't an issue, so there was no reason for me to make it up what they said. You can chose to believe me or not to believe me, it really doesn't matter.... I did what everyone here does is share the information that they have learned. You are more than welcome to open a phone book and start calling all over the states if you want to.

The receptionist stated the vets would not appreciate calls regarding the same thing, they have patients to take care of. The information they shared with me is because I called them with a pregnant female, they wanted to know her size, and a conversation occured from there.... I shared it with you all.

I said I would try and see if they would let me share their information... they said no, it would not be appreciated.... she didn't sound hopeful that they would come and write here... but did tell me the website to go to for answers.

I am not going to push the issue with her/them- I dont want them to think I am wanting to breed tinies, I have a good reputation with the vets here that I have seen and don't want to ruin that- not that I am going to breed again, but they are more willing to help me after hrs without extra charge, and phone consults because of the reputation I earned with them, I am not going to ruin it to satisify your curiosity... which I am sure many people here would not be willing to do... especially breeders who need and depend on vets more than the average person.

You can do some leg work also, open the phone book and start calling....

I am going to do what I can, txshopper posted that she would help with a letter- hopefully together we can have a reproductive vet answer some questions.... most of us though seem satisified with the answers we already have though.

socal- I remember another converstation with you, regarding breeding tinies, where you said a vet you knew bred tinies, therefore you felt it wasn't a bad thing if a vet was willing to do it, and they had been doing it for years.

txshopper- I will post the email addy for the vet school when I find it... it may take a bit since my computer keeps freezing.... uggg.

Southern Cal- thank you for provding the information of the name and location. This will be of great help to those who live near this part of the country.

What you posted is something that you found on the internet. Am I safe to asume that you've never spoken to this person directly? :confused:

http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/sho...light=Kustritz

You've quoted the same thing time and time again from this same person. Are you taking what this person says as what ALL specialty vets condone?

well.... here is a copy of what I found for the u of m vet school... for questions
___________________

Veterinary Medical Center appointments/phone consultations. Call 612-625-1919. Please note: Due to the volume of requests, the College and its veterinarians cannot respond to email questions regarding individual animal health and behavior issues.
______________________

seems they won't take email questions. This is the same location of the vet that socal copied the question/answer about breeding a lg dog with a small dog... I am assuming that the phone number above will be able to direct anyone to her.

I have a weeks worth of work to catch up on.... and a computer to fix... I will get back here tonight or tomorrow.

I wanted to add I did a search for the above mentioned vet by socal, on the u of m site and wasn't able to locate her... her is the link (hopefully it works)

http://www.umn.edu/lookup?SET_INSTIT...pus=a&role=any

maybe someone else will have better luck.

nevermind, I found her searching a different area....

http://www.tc.umn.edu/~rootk001/

now I really need to get my work done... lol.

Yuppers....that's the site I found, too. Already sent and e-mail so maybe we'll get a response...but maybe not. :(

I think just because a thing is possible to do doesn't mean at all that it should be done.
There are many things in this world that are possible but unwise.

Please don't confuse the frame, weight issue. In a decade I have never, ever personally seen a 4 pound Yorkie (in a proper weight for its structure) with a wide enough frame for ease of whelping. That doesn't take into account the after whelp issues. The 5 pound rule is a good basic description without getting into details. Of course anyone who chooses to breed a Toy breed should have studied all the fine details first.


Its my job as the care giver and the person responsible for choosing to breed, to minimize all risks involved for my breeding dogs. Yorkies are not an endangered species. Larger (5-7 pounds) Yorkies do have tinies in their litters. There isn't IMO one valid reason to increase the risk to a female by breeding her when she is so small.

Everyone lives by their own code of Ethics and these are mine. I really don't need a specialist to tell me this.