Ann has the patience of a saint! I think that's why we all love her so much. :p

i read that post. i thought it was well-written and contained valid points.

that said, i see no reason for anyone to "attack" another in a public setting at all. heated disagreements between two individuals ought to be carried out via pm, in my opinion.

in regard to new members...i agree with the points she made. still, when a new member posts of a concern or fear or is in a crisis, it's like a triage situation. they need immediate help and support. period. the questions can come, if ever, after the crisis has past. the notion that they are willingly opening themselves up to criticism and hurtful words simply because they haven't "earned" their place, or because someone else feels they're due an explanation is mind-boggling to me.

just as we care about how the animal kingdom is treated, we must care about each other.

I understand what you are saying and agree......But, reiterating what has already been pointed out. Not everyone is going to read the written and interpret it the same way. Some will read negative into it and others will read valid advice.

This topic has been touched on time and time again, there is no right or wrong......Not everyone's personality is the same......some are just a bit more straightforward in their responses (which may be considered rude by others) and others sugar coat (just because that is their personality).

This is an open forum.....not subject to a code of ethics or conduct.....we are all free to read, respond or walk away from a topic......

:thumbup:I agree two people could read the same thing and interpret it different ways. Good points!

You and I know that there on members on here that are here to help and then there are those that come on just to stir up trouble. Yep! We've seen it, the come on drop a bombshell just to get things started, get things in an uproar....never to be heard from again.....

You address what the YT agenda is:
1. Educate
2. Promote healthy relationships among yorkie owners and/or those desiring to be owners
3. Find homes for yorkies
4. Support each other


Well, I'd like to address the education part. In #2 you are complaining when members tell other members that they got their pup too young. Isn't that educating? Many times posts are made here regarding health problems and nine times out of ten the pup they are posting about is very young. Being sold younger then reccomended. YT policy in itself if that a pup cannot be even listed for sale until 10 weeks of age. By bringing to the op's attention that the pup was sold too young will hopefully prevent the op and others from making that mistake.

In #5 you speak about USDA Breeders. Well, USDA Breeders are commercial breeders. They breed in mass production and there is NO GOOD in anyone who is a USDA Breeder. If you have proof to prove otherwise then please, I'd like to see it.

In # 6 you address websites. Members posts sites they find while looking and they ask for insight on the site. There are red flags to look for such as the breeding of many different breeds, mixed breeding, terms used as teacups, micro, mini. etc. It's educating when other members bring these red flags to attention of the person asking as well as those reading.

In #7 You address puppymills and rescuing. You cannot compare buying a dog from a mill or petstore as a rescue. Too many people make the mistake of thinking this. It's nice to think but in reality what you are doing is opening up that cage for another pup to fill. It's a vicious cycle. You buy a pup from a bad place, thinking your saving THAT pups life, but then what happens when the breeder or petstore realizes that he can sell that dog and then replaces it with another. It just goes round and round. And, many members on here have walked in others shoes. They've bought from bad places because they did not have a place like YT to learn from. I was one of those people. My first Yorkie came from a small mill. Had there been a forum like this I would have known better not to buy.

I am very happy for YT and for the mods who volunteer their time here. yes, occassionally some posts fall through the cracks, but not for long. The mods do a great job. I think that you should think about what you've written and reread some of the answers given on these posts. Maybe, you'll see that the complaints you have made were for people simply doing what YT is here for and that is education.

And, I can't tell you how many times I've seen YT members support each other. Cookie who is missing her dog, many members here are donating their time looking on the internet for dogs found and sending them to her, donating money for flyers to help etc. An older man whose dog died and a breeder and members donated a puppy to him, YT train that has brought many rescues to new homes, myself when my Yorkie passed and two wonderful YT members sent me a card with a beautiful picture and poem hand painted of my Newman. This is just a few. I've seen more support here then negativity and I think we are all lucky to have this site and the many good members we have here.

And quite honestly no offense but I think you should stick around YT because some of the things you said in your posts show why sites like this is needed.

Elaine

:thumbup:

Yes, it certainly seems to be...on all sides.

:thumbup: I like that. That's where I come from too:) E.

Elaine, I'm giving you my second standing ovation of this thread. Wonderfully written - thank you!!

In a perfect world, all would visit this site LONG before purchasing a new yorkie! This would solve alot of the issues you have with this site! We all know that is not going to happen! This site then has to educate people after the fact. Although you bring up great issues, not much can be done when dealing with with uneducated people, but to try to educate. After all, when we stop listening, we stop learning!

I agree, I think that you touched on alot of really good points thankyou:thumbup:

The more I think abot it, the more I feel like the whole thing is a bit redundant, don't you think? A thread lecturing people who lecture others, not liking the 'control' (for lack of better phrase) that some have but then trying to contol the direction and comments of the topic itself, and complaining about people complaining... The thread itself originated with a post that was basically one big complaint about one what person dislikes about YT. It's all just a bit silly, if you ask me.

it might help to go back and read the original post for those who believe this is a thread about people complaining about people complaining.

in truth, it had absolutely nothing to do with that and there were several folks who recognized as much from the start.

someone mentioned earlier that people cannot learn if they do not listen. this is true for everyone and there isn't a person on this forum, or in this world frankly, who couldn't learn a thing or two if they put a little practice into the "listen" part of that equation.

sometimes it seems to me we put more thought and care into the behavior of our yorkies than into our own.

:thumbup:I couldnt agree more, I see this happening a lot when new yorkie owners get on and I think I am even guilty of it too, so I stopped posting those kinds of messages because I realize you guys don't know and your here to be educated.

Very well said!!

YT is a learning tool, not everyone will agree with everything said but with the large number of members that YT has for the most part their is NO problems. Sometimes if you keep you mouth shut (or your fingers at rest) and just read the posts, you will learn a lot. With shelters overflowing I don't think you can say to many times all the bad that puppy mills or BYB do. If one person learns something today it's a good day.

LOL...so in otherwords, me, since that was my statment. :p Thanks for the suggestion, but I have read the original post, several times and it's pretty self explanatory. The OPs brought up issues--or complaints, they are interchangable words--with some things she has observed on YT that she does not like.

The points that the OP brought up, although they may be her personal opinions which she has a right to, all gravitate back to an issue with 'controlling'--either situations, mannerisms or threads themselves. Which I don't believe any one member here has the right or power to do.

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

LULUMOM... you are smart cookie! ;)

I have started to respond in this thread, several times, and stopped myself, not wanting to get tied up in drama... :eek:

I have seen many posts, that the questions have made me cringe! However, OFTEN the answer the poster gets makes me cringe more! Not because of inaccuracy, to the contrary, but sometimes delivered with such "sting" that the Op of those thread (sometimes) get defensive, or perhaps don't post when they have other questions. I also cringe when a newbie, pre-faces a post with, "don't get mad but..."

This post is... my opinion! :)

Oh my gosh, I'm not sure how to reply exactly. :)
I love this site, I have gained an education on Yorkies that is priceless!

Having said that, it's a message forum meant to share thoughts, opinions, education, etc.. The thing about opinions, we all have them and we don't always agree.
I think you have to look at the comments from two ways:
1. Someone already has a Yorkie & is looking for info
2. Someone is looking to get a Yorkie and is looking for info

So when people post about age, BYB, puppymills, etc.., NO nothing can be done if you have purchased your puppy already, but it will hopefully help someone who is doing their research before getting their baby!
It's hard to not get passionate about something you feel so strongly about and it's hard when people ignore what people perceive as correct, facts and right.

I think when you come onto a message forum and ask for advice, you should expect and be prepared for the advice, whether it's what you want to hear or not! Are people harsh at times, probably, but it usually comes from a good place. I think it's hardest to bite your tongue when advice could prevent someone from making a bad mistake and it's ignored, I know it frustrates me to see people make bad decisions once they have been educated.
A lot of people here have had bad experiences and they speak from knowledge. It's not that they are all perfect and only bought their babies from the best breeders and have done everything 100 % right, that's why they do have the advice and opinions to share.
I hope I'm not offending anyone with this, JMO.

You thought Carol's tone was a bit much; and honestly I am sitting her questioning myself about your tone....and your motive.

You almost seem to continue to pat yourself on the back as if you are the one who has kept the thread going in a "light and airy" direction as you call it.

Honestly, I think people have been beyond accomodating and polite to you while you are being somewhat condescending. You honestly are not well informed about quite a few items you mentioned in your original post ... IMO. Mind you, I am sure you think you are well informed .. again another "opinion".

May I ask who the Ultimate YTers are? Since you seem to think there is a difference in people, and seem to hold yourself higher than the Ultimates as you call them.....you clearly have been gossiping either to yourself or others...yet you say you are not????? I am extremely confused.

hahaha I got suspended once for a PM I sent to someone....so now if I say something it is PUBLIC....
I had WISHED that I had made that one public SO many times. I told the woman what she needed to hear and she ran crying to the admin. At least if you are going to get suspended, make it worthwhile.:p:D

Not sure which thread you are referring to, but I must say that when people come here saying their dog is dying while they are sitting on their computers typing I really question the whole thing. I find it so disturbing.

If I had a dog dying, I would be running OUT of my house AWAY FROM my computer to try to save the dog. Matter of fact, that is how my Christmas eve morning was spent....out the door with a dog dying in my arms...in my pajamas. Straight to a vet! No thinking to it...no asking what to do...take the dog for HELP.

I honestly do not understand someone just sitting and letting a dog die. Sorry...but there are places to take them to get help. And, if you cannot afford it, sign them over if you can. Do something...don't just sit on your computer and type. Not only is the poster upset, but the animal lovers reading it are also upset...maybe even MORE so since they cannot do anything!

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup: I agree very much

:grin2::grin2::grin2: Hook, line and sinker!!!

BamaFan121s "controlling" was the correct word.

BamaFan121s & ladyjane - I'm in total agreement with you and thought the same thing way back with the first post.

Chachi - I don't "do" PM's like that either. :thumbup::thumbup: My PM's are reserved for my private/personal information - NOT to discuss forum subject matter. If it can't be said in a thread then you know it's time to move on.

WyliesMom - I could be wrong but... shouldn't this be in OFF TOPIC not General Discussion? :D

I think she's busy counting her gray hairs, or maybe having a drink...;)

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

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Well I lost count, so I had a few drinks - and after this many pages, this thread is definitely ready to now be moved to Off Topic :p!