So if there was a litter that happened to have one parti and one with traditional color, should they both be spayed/neutered....even if the tradtional appeared to have potential of "show quality"?

I can understand and even respect your opinion when you say, "I wouldn't be opposed though to the Partis becoming their own breed like the Biewers or even becoming American-bred Biewers or something. I just hate to see the Yorkshire Terrier deviate from the traditional colors. I think those that are passionate about the alternate colors should work to make them their own breed if they want them recognized.".

I personally do not feel that we should have to do this. They are a Yorkshire Terrier by genetics, so why should we make up some new breed name and call them something that they are not? :confused: Even if you don't like their tri-color, that doesn't make them any less Yorkie.

Are you a show Breeder? or a breeder at all?:)

not fit to breed
 

I dont think anyone said you were unfit to breed, but until you can show a little respect to the exhibitors, you will probabley never get on a list for a show prospect. I think you need to win the trust of exhibitors so they know exactly what your intentions are in wanting a show prospect. If you were truely interested in showing/breeding to the standard I doubt if their would be a problem getting a show/breeding prospect. Most likely, there would be a lenghty contract and it couldnt be bred to just any dog, but it would be a start. And most exhibitors would not tolerate the purposeful breeding of designer colors. Going to shows, finding a mentor and learning as much as you can is a great start to becoming a great exhibitor/breeder. Sometimes this just takes more effort than some people are willing to give. Lynn

There are other breeds with disqualified colors too, such as the German Shepherd. There are white german shepherds but they are a disqualification. It takes a recessive gene to breed for them as well. I'm sure from time to time they just show up in a litter too, but the breeder doesn't keep intentionally breeding for them.

Partis have happened over the years but the breeders spay and neuter them because they don't meet the standard. This kept the appearance of partis to a minimum. But now, there are breeders who are intentionally breeding them so they are becoming more common because of course when you breed a parti and another parti together, you get more partis. But just because they are becoming more common now, why should the standard start allowing them? Yes, they happen, but the standard says that when it happens it is a disqualification

No, but I may be interested in showing one day. I am however passionate about the yorkie breed

The part about being between a rock and a hard place is also about the fact that even if you try your best to get good quality dogs and you happen to get lucky and get one with awesome bloodlines, then you are still looked down on for owning the dog because you didnt put the blood sweat and tears into producing those champs and getting the dog "through the back door", so either way you lose. Everyone wants you to have top quality dogs to use in your breeding programs, but if you do and you dont show, you arent worthy of owning them anyway so maybe that is why I feel like I am between a rock and a hard place being a breeder and trying to do your best to do what is right. I agree that showing is the best way to do it and as soon as I can find someone to help me with it, I will be doing that too. I have come so far and learnt so much on YT and that helps so much also. All you can do it continue to strive to better yourself.

Breeding parti to parti is not the only way to get the tri color. That is why I asked you what you thought about spaying/neutering all of the litter that has a parti in it. You also said that the partis have been happening over the years but the breeders spay/neutered them because they did not meet the standard. Are you talking about show breeders? Because I have never heard of a show breeder admitting that they have ever had a parti in any of their litters.

I know breeding parti to parti isn't the only way to get a resulting parti puppy. I meant that you are sure to get parti puppies if you do breed two partis together. I can't tell you for certain whether or not partis have shown up in show breeders litters before because I don't know. I don't know all the history behind partis because I have never taken the time to research them much. From what I have read and heard though, they have happened sporatically through the years, but they were spayed/neutered or culled from the litter...what I can't tell you if these sporatic partis showed up in show-breeders litter or only hobby breeders' litters...I just know they've happened. It wasn't until pretty recently that several hobby breeders started to intentionally breed them so that they are becoming more common.

I think it is pretty safe to say we are all passionate about the yorkie breed. We wouldnt be spending so much time here talking about them if we werent.:)

Very true :) And that is what I LOVE about YT! Of course all of us aren't always going to agree on everything because every person is so different with their own opinion. But We all love the breed, love our babies, and care about each others babies. That's what makes this place so great

designer colors
 

I think everyone interested in Yorkshire Terriers should read the articles about color genetics at Goldenray Yorkies. It is a very good, educational read that should be read by all yorkie breeders, including the designer color breedes and purchasers. Lynn

to each his/her own:)

I agree, Just because you dont show dont mean you CAN'T!

I have been asked BY A SHOW BREEDER if I would be interested in Studding Bruizer because he has qualitys that she is looking for in a male, but I have no interest in breeding at this time, and Bruizer is CKC reg, it would take a little bit of effort to get his AKC papers (his litter wasn't reg, but could have been).

She is neither. She is a 22 year old vet "tech student" that is a lot like I was when I was in R.N. school and even after I got out. i thought I knew it all when I really found out I knew nothing at all.

There is always the option of getting a quality show dog through the front door but that will also mean putting in the work to win the trust of a show breeder and be willing to put in the work to agree to contract terms and not just buy to breed puppies and to be willing to take a male to start with to prove yourself if that is what is offered.
As I have explained many times, as a show breeder myself, right now I am in a three day dog show. I paid the entries to show my dog, don't know if I will win or not. Some shows ends up with no other YOrkies in and I wasted my money. Plus over these three days, I am not working, I have to put off any mobile pet grooming clients until next week. I pay for gas to get to the show, show supplies, grooming products, over $100 in bows, etc.
the dog I am showing is not my own breeding I bought him from an excellent reputable show breeder. Once he finishes his championship and indeed any of my own breeding that finishes their championship, has my line as well as the kennel names of the show breeders behind them in the pedigree. The show breeders who have trusted me with their lines are going through the same drill as I am to produce some very nice Yorkies. That also puts a huge responsibility on me to be sure their kennel names don't end up with someone who is just breeding and selling puppies with 'champion lines.'
Now why in the world would we be willing to sell a puppy or dog to someone who doesn't want to show, doesn't want to learn, doesn't respect the show world but will breed and sell puppies with 'champion lines'?
Nobody looks down on me for showing my dog I bought. But then it also is known I have put my own blood sweat and tears into showing and learning right from the start. Right from the beginning I signed contracts and have always upheld those contracts.

You said it all !!! What A Great Post Everyone seems to want short-cuts today, my Dad used to say to people who wanted to learn his business" If you want short cuts go to a barber"
Thanks again for the post.

<<Everyone seems to want short-cuts today, my Dad used to say to people who wanted to learn his business" If you want short cuts go to a barber" >>

that is too funny!! I will have to remember that one. LOL

I am not a "tech student". I am a VET STUDENT. And being a vet student has nothing to do with knowing about a certain breed of dog and beliefs in what a reputable breeder is and isn't. I have my opinions on what a reputable breeder is and if you don't like it, I'm sorry. I'm not going to change my opinion to make you feel better about yourself. But just because you don't agree with me, don't you act like you know who I am or what I do and don't know. And being a nurse is the equivalent of being a vet tech. Being a Vet is the equivalent of being a doctor so there is a difference there. I do know quite a bit, and as you can see, show breeders that do show and breed have come on this thread and said the same things I've said. But I guess you can take that information or leave it.

doesn't matter. You are still a student. i'm done.

What does being a student, a vet, or an elementary teacher for that matter have to do with this thread? This thread is about opinions on reputable and unreputable breeders and whether or not you should breed non-show quality dogs. It doesn't matter how old you are or what your profession is - that doesn't have anything to do with this. I'll be the first to tell you I don't know everything vet-related because I am still learning. But in this case, I have a strong opinion about breeding and I'm going to state it. I don't get why you don't understand that? What you believe is just an opinion too

I have been out of town and just saw this thread. Whew!!! I think it's wonderful that you are a vet student and at one of the best universities for veterinary medicine in the country (and that's hard to say with 3 kids in Tech). I think you have made very valid points and I completely understand where you are coming from. No where did you claim to know everything, you are only offering you opinion and picking up a lot of valuable information from the dedicated show breeders on here. I am just getting back into showing and possible breeding on down the road to produce my own "bred by" winner again. The reasons for breeding have not changed through the years and it is as it has always been, to better the breed and try to produce as close to perfect as possible. It takes a lot more than just reading about the standard to understand it. Good luck to you and remember that although with age comes wisdom, there's another saying...there's no fool like an old fool. Hopefully, show breeder/exhibitors like Mary and there are several on YT, can help educate and although they can't get through to all, maybe the newbies, will learn the reputable, responsible way to breed.

I don't understand why you being 22 years of age and a vet tech student had anything to do with your knowledge or maturity.

There alot of people your age that are wise beyond their years. Learn to soak up what everknowledge that is passed onto them and keep their mouths shut when they encounter people with more knowledge on a subject then they have (a sign of maturity and a good practice no matter what age).

I was a RN in my past life too. Believe me assisting in the Delivery room is very different that whelping a puppy. There are those wonderful monitors to help you with determining wheter things are right or wrong. Mother's can scream and tell you what is wrong. With whelping puppies, dams are at our mercy and we must be prepared for any emergency, whether it will happen or not.

As you said vets and vet tech's do not know the standard of every breed, they went to school to learn how to save lives and repair problems.

I admire you for your maturity and conviction.

Mary

I don't know about everyone else but I think this sort of thing is best handled in pm's (personal messages). There might be someone else who has a question about showing. JMO

Mary we both posted at the same time, I hadn't read your post.

Well, it doesn't matter that I've posted earlier on that defensive and combative attitudes contribute nothing to the education of any thread.

A couple of other phrases I use often is "Thou Protests Too Loudly"
"Keep On Digging And You're Gonna Dig Yourself Into Your Own Grave"
"Open Mouth Insert Foot"

Mary

LOL...my husband said that one to me on our very first date...

...of HIS mouth, that is, not mine! :p

(I hadn't heard that one since!)

student
 

I applaud the "student"!!! Isnt is great that she doesnt have a closed mind and is open to learning as much as possible~!!!!! The way sugarmom(I think) said student, you would think it ment a student was the worst thing on earth to be. Well, I think most of us are students and will be for the rest of our lives. Sugarmom, let me know when you know everything there is to know about everything!!! Then maybe, just maybe, you will have earned the right to degrade the word student. Lynn, the Pharmacy student

Well said!

I think the "Student will be getting a swelled head".....

But you're right, if we stop learning we might as well curl up and die.

Something I really admired about the breeders/ exhibitors at the Specialty in Dallas. All these greats sharing and still learning from each other. It was wonderful to see and be a part of.