White Yorkie????

[koolbreeze]

every time i go to the site my computer locks up!

[YorkieShadow]

I think its so cute. Looks like its a Yorkie/Maltese mix .

[sashajade]

Originally Posted by FlDebra

I am not sure barkbytes can be construed as an official reference. It also says until the 1930's Yorkies usually weighed 30 pounds! I have some books with Champions through history and I think I would doubt that too. One little champion was less than 2 pounds in the early 1900's! They had over and under 5 pounds classes til 1960, and I read one from 1860's that had an over and under 9 pounds. Another topic, but it goes to credibility of the site you gave.

Your reference says Maltese were a possibility -- I guess anything is a possibility but since the Maltese is a spaniel, I am doubtful. I think I will go with the YTCA official position -- no white in the Yorkie history. For one thing the Maltese were dogs of culture and aristocracy -- I have a hard time imagining the weavers in the mills or the miners owning them. The Yorkie's were bred for ratting, after all.

You have to be careful about which references you use. It is officially recognized as a reference for the UKC or AKC? One of your references mentions Joan Gordon and Janet Bennett -- they wrote The Complete Yorkshire Terrier -- in which the history does not include Maltese. There is a quote that I like from that book, " some of our authorities have attempted to throw a great deal of mystery about the origin of the Yorkshire Terrier, where none really exists."

I have no doubt over the years people have sureptitiously bred maltese into the Yorkshire terrier lines. But I am of the belief, that was not done before it was first shown in England or accepted into the AKC. But who really knows -- only the ghosts of a few old millers and miners, I guess.

i think the mystery exits cos the people who first bred them prob could not write so no records were kept on the breeds used but people have guessed due to the breeds around at the time, i think they say maltease cos no ones sure where the silky coat comes from as i think the other breeds used did not have silky coats.
and maybe one of the mens terriers got friendly with one of the lords or ladys papered maltease lol
i think the 30 pound sized dogs where most likely the first few dogs bred together as the other terriers used were large terriers so would make sence and then over the years of breeding got smaller.
but like you said only the ghosts know for sure and they are prob laughing at the yorkies we see today with there papering, clothes and bows in there hair as i bet years ago the miners yorkies didnt have there own wardrobes lol

[sashajade]

Originally Posted by FlDebra

I feel like I am beating my head against a wall here.... of course the Broken-hair scotch terrier was a mix!!! -- isn't that what we are talking about?
You said, "they were first know as scotch terriers but then bred with other breeds to make up the yorkie." and I was trying to tell you the mix that wound up as the Yorkie and the mix that wound up the scotch terrier are one and the same!! They were being shown as broken hair Scotch Terriers and someone said, "Hey, let's rename them to Yorkshire Terriers" because they have really been improved in Yorkshire.

I think in another post here I quoted the whole passage from the AKC site which lists the breeds that went in to the Broken hair Scotch Terrier (AKA Yorkshire Terrier). Here it is again from the AKC site: "The Yorkshire Terrier traces to the Waterside Terrier, a small longish-coated dog, bluish-gray in color, weighing between 6 and 20 pounds (most commonly 10 pounds). The Waterside Terrier was a breed formed by the crossing of the old rough-coated Black-and-Tan English Terrier (common in the Manchester area) and the Paisley and Clydesdale Terriers. It was brought to Yorkshire by weavers who migrated from Scotland to England in the mid-19th century.

The Yorkshire Terrier made its first appearance at a bench show in England in 1861 as a "broken-haired Scotch Terrier". It became known as a Yorkshire Terrier in 1870 when, after the Westmoreland show, Angus Sutherland reported in The Field magazine that "they ought no longer be called Scotch Terriers, but Yorkshire Terriers for having been so improved there."
Maybe we are not debating -- maybe we are not being clear or understanding each other????????

its crossed wires i tried to edit on my reply but it wouldnt let me, i went to put i didnt mean to say scotch terriers were then bred with other breeds to make the yorkie, the scotch terrier was renamed the yorkie.

[Pinehaven]

I have a question ... I keep hearing people say that they believe Parti yorkies and Biewer yorkies, are the result of Maltese x Yorkie crosses?

Aren't Maltese dogs normally white? Are there Parti colored Maltese dogs?

I'm pretty familiar with the genetics of color in horses but just learning about color genetics in Dogs. I'm thinking that Maltese are a product of a gene like the dominant white gene (causing solid white colors) and not the Parti "spotting" white gene (which causes broken white and pigmented patches of color). I'd think if Maltese had the Parti gene, there'd be some spotted Maltese and not just all white Maltese?

If parti and biewer yorkies were a product of maltese x yorkie, wouldn't we be seeing solid white dogs and not spotted?

Any one know?

Thanks

Sue "WHITE" :-)

`

[Lorraine]

Originally Posted by Pinehaven

I have a question ... I keep hearing people say that they believe Parti yorkies and Biewer yorkies, are the result of Maltese x Yorkie crosses?

Aren't Maltese dogs normally white? Are there Parti colored Maltese dogs?

I'm pretty familiar with the genetics of color in horses but just learning about color genetics in Dogs. I'm thinking that Maltese are a product of a gene like the dominant white gene (causing solid white colors) and not the Parti "spotting" white gene (which causes broken white and pigmented patches of color). I'd think if Maltese had the Parti gene, there'd be some spotted Maltese and not just all white Maltese?

If parti and biewer yorkies were a product of maltese x yorkie, wouldn't we be seeing solid white dogs and not spotted?

Any one know?

Thanks

Sue "WHITE" :-)

`

I believe the parti/Biewer was from introduing the Shih Tzu. Maltese may have been a part of it but not the whole story.

[horse and hound]

I am going to open a can of worms here and probably get slammed. I bred yorkies. one of my AKC males has a pure white sire. AKC was done all of the DNA work on the white sire and gave him his papers. My male is the traditional yorkie colors. And since he has decided that he doesn't like girls, I will never know if he would throw white or not. I was always wanting to see.
I do like some of the Biewer yorkies, but not all of them.

[Pinehaven]

Originally Posted by horse and hound

I am going to open a can of worms here and probably get slammed. I bred yorkies. one of my AKC males has a pure white sire. AKC was done all of the DNA work on the white sire and gave him his papers. My male is the traditional yorkie colors. And since he has decided that he doesn't like girls, I will never know if he would throw white or not. I was always wanting to see.
I do like some of the Biewer yorkies, but not all of them.

Your male carries the Parti gene from his homozygous Parti sire but your boy won't produce the Parti (white) color unless he's bred to a female who also is a carrier. If you were to breed him to a parti carrier female, approximately 50% of his offspring would be traditional colored (not receiving the parti gene) 25% would be traditional colored parti carriers, they will normally display a large white patch on their chests/necks/chins and/or maybe some paw white (they are heterozygous for the gene) and 25% would be parti colored (homozygous for the gene).

Hope that helps.