My little girl wants to be a mom!

[DvlshAngel985]

Originally Posted by McheleM

http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/gen...-breeding.html

Here ya go.

Also, there are other stories out there that don't end in "happily ever after".

I got lucky- I have midwifery experience, I had a breeder on speed dial, as well as the other breeders and member who stepped in to help, and I am thankful for that. But given the option, I would prefer not to put my girl or any other dog through this.

I know you got lucky Michele and everything seems to be going great now, I really hope it continues. And yes, great reminder that while you had a happy ending to your difficult situation, not everyone gets that lucky. That's why I'm kinda glad I'm more drawn to Yorkie boys. No risks getting preggo there!! (And no getting others preggo either)

[McheleM]

Originally Posted by DvlshAngel985

I know you got lucky Michele and everything seems to be going great now, I really hope it continues. And yes, great reminder that while you had a happy ending to your difficult situation, not everyone gets that lucky. That's why I'm kinda glad I'm more drawn to Yorkie boys. No risks getting preggo there!! (And no getting others preggo either)

I still don't have happily ever after. I'm watching these pups and the mom constantly. She's still not out of the woods, and neither are they. She still needs her staples removed, we still have to worm and vaccinate the pups, she's going into her second week, which is when eclampsia is at a greater risk due to the demands of growing puppies and calcium levels in mom, and oh yeah.....2 years ago, Noah had parvo, and since the pups didn't get moms milk the first 40 hours, they also didn't get her antibodies. So we're at a higher risk for them for all sorts of things, because even though I cleaned and scrubbed, you just never know.

See even though things "worked out" there's no way of knowing what's to come. Please, please reconsider breeding your girl, OP.

(I see she hasn't responded and still just has the 1 post so I'll go out on a limb and call it like I see it-she will breed her girl, against all the advice given and she will be back here in 2-3 months asking for help).

[MauiGirl]

For starters read these 2 threads from the Yorkie Talk Library.

http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/bre...t-breeder.html

http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/bre...-answered.html

[DvlshAngel985]

Originally Posted by MauiGirl

For starters read these 2 threads from the Yorkie Talk Library.

http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/bre...t-breeder.html

http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/bre...-answered.html

Thank you for posting those links! I had no idea there was such a thing as a "mummy" puppy.

[Wylie's Mom]

Originally Posted by GigiRascal

If I were you, I'd do the research somewhere other than a public forum. Contact multiple vets and other reputable breeders. Unfortunately, in a pubic forum, you are going to get a ton of opinions and personal experiences that aren't generally what you are looking for. If this is something you want to do, just know that there are all of the same risks in having puppies as there are with having a baby yourself. (I'm sure you know that.) Sadly, as much as I want to love this forum because I am a yorkie lover and keep trying to find the good posts, I've not seen much "love" to new comers with different wants/views. Stick to the "fluff" posts about clothing and potty training.

Sorry to hear it's been so difficult and challenging for you here at YT. I don't know if something happened to you personally or not. But either way, if you truly take a good look around - there is *always* more positive than negative; it's just that when we see/experience something negative it tends to be what stands WAY out in our minds. The positive always outweighs the negative here.

This is a passionate board/forum/community and I think that's one of its strengths - and yes, it can sometimes be a weakness as well. When passion goes off track, it usually turns into anger and that gets us nowhere in sensitive threads, to be sure. We do encourage and allow all points of view, but it is true that there are some subjects on which most of the board is in agreement. One of those subjects is indiscriminate breeding - the majority of members here feel that indiscriminate breeding often results in less-than-standard yorkies, tragedy for the Mom/puppies/owners, dilutes the breed, hurts the breed, overpopulates the breed, and lends to the problem we currently have in shelters and rescues. So, there *are* legitimate and important reasons behind the passion regarding this particular subject.

Anyway, I do genuinely welcome you to YT and hope that you stick around and get to know some of us - there are some incredibly wonderful people here, and I'm sure you fit that description as well .

[Verbena]

Originally Posted by Wylie's Mom

Sorry to hear it's been so difficult and challenging for you here at YT. I don't know if something happened to you personally or not. But either way, if you truly take a good look around - there is *always* more positive than negative; it's just that when we see/experience something negative it tends to be what stands WAY out in our minds. The positive always outweighs the negative here.

This is a passionate board/forum/community and I think that's one of its strengths - and yes, it can sometimes be a weakness as well. When passion goes off track, it usually turns into anger and that gets us nowhere in sensitive threads, to be sure. We do encourage and allow all points of view, but it is true that there are some subjects on which most of the board is in agreement. One of those subjects is indiscriminate breeding - the majority of members here feel that indiscriminate breeding often results in less-than-standard yorkies, tragedy for the Mom/puppies/owners, dilutes the breed, hurts the breed, overpopulates the breed, and lends to the problem we currently have in shelters and rescues. So, there *are* legitimate and important reasons behind the passion regarding this particular subject.

Anyway, I do genuinely welcome you to YT and hope that you stick around and get to know some of us - there are some incredibly wonderful people here, and I'm sure you fit that description as well .

Beautifully said

[Yorkiemom1]

The ONLY question you should be asking yourself prior to breeding your "precious" little female...."Do I want a litter of puppies from this female so desperately I am willing to sacrifice her life to get it." Her life is on the chopping block everytime you choose to breed a female. Unless you have a wonderful example of what a Yorkie is supposed to be, a fine example of the breed standard, unless you are COMPETENT in ALL aspects of breeding and whelping and emergent care of orphaned puppies, unless you will be at the very least, maintaining the breed standard with producing this litter, unlessw you have done the genetic testing of both dam and sire and are confident thru testing each dog is free from genetic diseases that you would be responsible for inflicting on a litter of puppies (plus the massive heartache and expense you will be passing along to eager, unsuspecting, unprepared new owners), unless you are confident in your thorough knowledge of both dog's pedigrees going back at least 12 generations......you don't need to even be considering doing this. Breeding is a crap shoot under all circumstances and should never be entered into without extensive knowledge in order to get it right....that is the very least you can do for the babies produced, the female that has NO voice in the breeding and depends entirely on YOU to keep her and her babies safe, and the people that buy these babies from you.

[Yorkiemom1]

Originally Posted by GigiRascal

If I were you, I'd do the research somewhere other than a public forum. Contact multiple vets and other reputable breeders. Unfortunately, in a pubic forum, you are going to get a ton of opinions and personal experiences that aren't generally what you are looking for. If this is something you want to do, just know that there are all of the same risks in having puppies as there are with having a baby yourself. (I'm sure you know that.) Sadly, as much as I want to love this forum because I am a yorkie lover and keep trying to find the good posts, I've not seen much "love" to new comers with different wants/views. Stick to the "fluff" posts about clothing and potty training.

Hopefully, you will NOT put such limitations on your learning opportunities that are limitless on this forum. Please know there are experienced, knowledgable BREEDERS on this forum that actually do know what they are doing and take their time,not to deliberately show a lack of [I] "love" to new comers with different wants/views",[/I] but to speak the unglossed, often brutal truth about the pain and heartbreak and expenses associated with doing something you are not prepared for. Please do NOT become so shallow that you bury your head into only the things you WANT to hear, pleasentries that do nothing to educate you, but only lovingly support your own uninformd approach or view. If that is your method of broadening your learning base, you will find yourself up to your neck in alligators and surrounded with people that know no more than you do, and can offer only sympathy and condolences. Breeding is not "fluff" and should not be approached all warm and fuzzy. Go to dog shows...talk with professionals about breeding. Dont go get advice on breeding from brokers or back yard breeders. Take the bad and ugly along with opinions you want to hear. Become soundly educated and well informed, not just supported by fluff, while you possibly make an unfortunate, expensive mistake. You should NEVER find yourself alone, in the middle of a whelp, in trouble, clueless, with you precious female looking up at you for help and answers you are not prepared to give.

[Lovetodream88]

Originally Posted by GigiRascal

If I were you, I'd do the research somewhere other than a public forum. Contact multiple vets and other reputable breeders. Unfortunately, in a pubic forum, you are going to get a ton of opinions and personal experiences that aren't generally what you are looking for. If this is something you want to do, just know that there are all of the same risks in having puppies as there are with having a baby yourself. (I'm sure you know that.) Sadly, as much as I want to love this forum because I am a yorkie lover and keep trying to find the good posts, I've not seen much "love" to new comers with different wants/views. Stick to the "fluff" posts about clothing and potty training.

Breeding is something that is very serious and no one was not nice.

[Maximo]

Originally Posted by GigiRascal

If I were you, I'd do the research somewhere other than a public forum. Contact multiple vets and other reputable breeders. Unfortunately, in a pubic forum, you are going to get a ton of opinions and personal experiences that aren't generally what you are looking for. If this is something you want to do, just know that there are all of the same risks in having puppies as there are with having a baby yourself. (I'm sure you know that.) Sadly, as much as I want to love this forum because I am a yorkie lover and keep trying to find the good posts, I've not seen much "love" to new comers with different wants/views. Stick to the "fluff" posts about clothing and potty training.

The point many of us are trying to make in this thread is that the risks are much higher for the dog than they are for most humans.

In addition, the majority of humans in the US have costly professional medical care during delivery and for the baby/babies.

Sorry if this is not what the original poster is looking for, but it would be irresponsible and untrue to tell her that breeding Yorkies is a lovely experience. Almost every single breeder/exhibitor who has posted in this forum in the years that I have been reading has written that whelping is their least favorite thing to do.

[GigiRascal]

My point was that not a single person actually answered her questions. She didn't ask if everyone thought she should do it. She asked for specific things: "how to pursue a good stud, reasonable fees, correct protocols and care?".

I also never said that "breeding is fluff". I simply pointed out that if someone truly wanted the questions answered that she asked, she'd get more answers asking vets rather than on a public forum because everyone just jumps in with "don't do it" (as many posted above). I said to "Stick to the "fluff" posts about clothing and potty training." because THOSE are fluff, not breeding.

I've read tons and tons of these posts where someone asks a question about breeding and everyone jumps on them. I didn't say everyone was rude, just that no one is actually going to answer the questions. They never do. She IS doing her research. She came to a place where, it is assumed, that people who *are* knowledgeable about the breed would be able to help point newcomers in the right direction.

We all know that if someone wants to breed their dog, they are going to do it regardless of what anyone says. So wouldn't it be a lot more beneficial for everyone if the "DON'T DO IT" posts were not so judgmental?

Offer the actual answers to the questions. Sure, don't withhold the very real possibility of a bad outcome, just like ANY pregnancy/birth. 24hrs later and not a single person, who would actually know the answers (or an estimate) has given it.

I've been a member here for a while and made it a priority to read as much as I could before posting (everything my "newbie" membership allows). Not jumping in naive to the community or asking things that have been asked a million times, and the very real trend, is that if you want to breed, do not mention it here. Newbies in the field are clearly not wanted. It is assumed that anyone who hasn't been doing it for years is incapable of doing so. "You" claim that the breed standards are ruined and too many in shelters, yet the very real help that could be given to avoid those things is not given. There is a deep line in the sand when it comes to breeding and it's really a shame. People come here for the "community" but there isn't a warm and fuzzy atmosphere. It's very sad.

[gemy]

Interesting point - views that are different to the apparent general consensus here. And then the advice to go speak with different vets and other breeders with-in your area.

It is a good point to talk with vets; if you make sure those self-same vets are either breeders themselves and or a reproduction specialist.
Other breeders - well again preferably experienced reputable breeders and more so those with toy dog experience.

There are very good reasons for NOt breeding your family pet. Did you know that according to the APPA which does a huge nation wide survey every two years that 40% or so of the dogs owned by the American public come from folks that just want to breed their family pet? And of that figure a very large % end up in shelters either as a puppy and or within their first two years.

Breeding dogs is not for the faint of heart, or for one without a deep pocketbook.

And like Judy said; repeat this over and over to yourself; I am literally risking my dogs life...is my desire to have puppies worth the risk the very real risk of losing her?

I have no idea how many litters over the 88 years your friend has had, or if indeed she is even experienced and or healthy enough to help and support you in this venture. But certainly she is one person, you need to be talking with. For example where did she get her stud dog(s) from? What is the health lineage of her lines? Does she actually want this female bred?

In summary I do not encourage pet owners to breed their dogs. Keep them your pet.

`

[Lovetodream88]

Originally Posted by GigiRascal

My point was that not a single person actually answered her questions. She didn't ask if everyone thought she should do it. She asked for specific things: "how to pursue a good stud, reasonable fees, correct protocols and care?".

I also never said that "breeding is fluff". I simply pointed out that if someone truly wanted the questions answered that she asked, she'd get more answers asking vets rather than on a public forum because everyone just jumps in with "don't do it" (as many posted above). I said to "Stick to the "fluff" posts about clothing and potty training." because THOSE are fluff, not breeding.

I've read tons and tons of these posts where someone asks a question about breeding and everyone jumps on them. I didn't say everyone was rude, just that no one is actually going to answer the questions. They never do. She IS doing her research. She came to a place where, it is assumed, that people who *are* knowledgeable about the breed would be able to help point newcomers in the right direction.

We all know that if someone wants to breed their dog, they are going to do it regardless of what anyone says. So wouldn't it be a lot more beneficial for everyone if the "DON'T DO IT" posts were not so judgmental?

Offer the actual answers to the questions. Sure, don't withhold the very real possibility of a bad outcome, just like ANY pregnancy/birth. 24hrs later and not a single person, who would actually know the answers (or an estimate) has given it.

I've been a member here for a while and made it a priority to read as much as I could before posting (everything my "newbie" membership allows). Not jumping in naive to the community or asking things that have been asked a million times, and the very real trend, is that if you want to breed, do not mention it here. Newbies in the field are clearly not wanted. It is assumed that anyone who hasn't been doing it for years is incapable of doing so. "You" claim that the breed standards are ruined and too many in shelters, yet the very real help that could be given to avoid those things is not given. There is a deep line in the sand when it comes to breeding and it's really a shame. People come here for the "community" but there isn't a warm and fuzzy atmosphere. It's very sad.

No one was judgmental. In fact a reputable breeder will not just stud there dogs out to any one so the answer is not easy to answer also most regular vets really don't know that much about breeding. You would be surprised how many people read these threads and go wow I didn't think about that or oh I didn't know that and then decided not to breed. I don't mind people breeding IF there doing it right but just coming on and asking about a stud is not research. I think maybe you might not understand how bad dog over population is and how bad genetic illness are in yorkies because of bad breeders not checking for them, simply not caring or just not knowing there dogs lines. I personally have one of the those dogs that the breeder didn't care about the dogs they bred and she has Luxating Patella, Collapsing trachea, horrible allergy's, Hypothyroidism, is much bigger then the standard and so on yes I love her to death and would never trade her for the world but she is the reason I feel the need to step up and talk about bad breeders and stop bad breeding because the puppies are the ones who have to suffer and the humans who love them suffer to having to watch there defenseless pup be sick or there dog fighting to live because of a breeder who didn't care. It isn't simply about humans and there feelings and what they want to do. These puppies and dogs deserve rights as well.

[Maximo]

I disagree with your assessment of Yorkie Talk (see Wylie's Mom's post).

Breeding living beings that are under our care is not a warm and fuzzy topic. That is the point many people are trying to make.

It isn't a matter of thinking only a privileged few should be allowed to do it.

Originally Posted by GigiRascal

My point was that not a single person actually answered her questions. She didn't ask if everyone thought she should do it. She asked for specific things: "how to pursue a good stud, reasonable fees, correct protocols and care?".

The answer to the question is to find a mentor. The mentor(s) teach all of this. Mentors can be found through dog shows or social networking. Yes, it is difficult, and yes, most people will be discouraged. It's like any undertaking in life.

The moderators can correct me if I am wrong, but I don't think Yorkie Talk allows advertising for stud services or offers a "how to" guide to breeding. People offer help, but this help should not be considered all that is needed to mitigate the risk of breeding.

[DvlshAngel985]

You're right. You can't get thorough stud answers on an online forum. There are tons of follow up that need to be done by a real live person. Best person to answer these questions is a reputable breeder. OP check the mother club breeder referral page.

However, as Ann already stated, breeding is a topic we take very seriously. I can guarantee that a lot of the people who posted have at one point or another considered breeding. I know I have. Knowing the full background tests needed for both bitch and stud, which I believe have been mentioned in this thread, is a great way to start your research. BUT, reading about the heart brake, and living through the issues I've had with a dog that has a bad temperament, I changed my mind. (Extreme shyness is inheritable, I didn't know that prior to having my pup) It was the stories, the personal testimonials, that helped me decide. If we coldly answer the questions, then we aren't being good friends and are not providing the OP with the whole picture. And yes, I consider most people here to be friends because they're all very supporting and share so much of their life with us day in and day out.