AKC, CKC, Whats the difference? - Page 2 - YorkieTalk.com Forums

feminvstr · 03-04-2005, 07:54 AM

SexBrucelee:

AKC does have ILP program which allows non AKC animals to compete...

Indefinite Listing Privilege Program (ILP): The program that provides purebred dogs a second chance.
There are various reasons why a purebred dog might not be eligible for registration. The dog may the product of an unregistered litter, or have unregistered parents. The dog's papers may have been withheld by its breeder or lost by its owner. Sometimes, it is the dog itself that was "lost." There are many dogs enrolled in the ILP program after they have been surrendered or abandoned, then adopted by new owners from animal shelters or purebred rescue groups. The ILP program allows the dog and owner a second chance at discovering the rewards of participating in AKC events.

Yorkease · 03-04-2005, 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by feminvstr

AKC assures the consumer the breed is a purebred where as CKC and ACA doesnt monitor the past of their reg'd dogs.

The problem with buying a NON AKC dog is only assuring you that your dog is a purebred. The other reg'ing agencies will acccept a picture of a dog as gospel. That as a breeder is a scary prospect because there are so many dishonest breeders and just as many uneducated buyers that get taken advantage of. Its refreshing to see there are many people on this forum that are educated buyers because they are lovers of the breed but many buy on impulse and if someone calls it a yorkie its a yorkie

even if it is 3/4's yorkie and a 1/4 party mix (rover).

Buying AKC assures and protects the buyer "that puppy in the window" is a real Yorkie

where as the other reg'ing agencies hope that the reg'ing party submitting the documents are true.

Buying AKC in most cases is a more expensive venture but at least you know when your puppy purchase is all said and done ITS A YORKIE!

PLEASE, PLEASE, don't take this the wrong way, but I am confused by your first post. Are you saying if you were looking to buy a Yorkie, you would not buy from us that are CKC Registered because you feel we may not have pure bred Yorkshire Terriers? Again, Please don't get upset I don't mean offend you I just want someone to be brutally honest. My husband tells me and the rest of the free world like it is (in his belief) all the time, Hit or Miss. I respect that out of anyone.

Thanks

kindness_001 · 03-04-2005, 08:13 AM

Apr will not register a dog unless it has akc in the bloodline.
Akc keeps getting higher and stricker People don't like it but it keeps you from getting a yorkiepoo or some other mix.
Ckc is stricker in Canada than in the U S
Ukc is suppose to be right up there with AKC from what i've heard.
and some of the breeders that have gone to ckc have gotten into trouble with AKC and don't want to put up with them.Let's be honest.

sexcbrucelee · 03-04-2005, 08:14 AM

oh is that so??/ then I stand corrected.... thanks for the info.

sexcbrucelee · 03-04-2005, 08:18 AM

Is it true?? i read somewhere that with AKC.. if a stud sire 3 dam in one calender year.. he needs to have a DNA test done?? What if he sire 3 dam one each year for 3 years...does he need DNA test done also???

feminvstr · 03-04-2005, 08:20 AM

SexBrucelee.....

"I come to the conclusion that AKC is just one big monopoly. Everyone else will accept AKC registered pups but they won't accept anyone else.?? "

It comes down to Quality not Quantity....

To reg' a litter of puppies is not expensive I believe it cost me $34.00 also I did it online and received the papers in less than 7 days.

CKC has only be in business since 1996 - CONTINENTAL KENNEL CLUB
ACA for 20 years - American Canine Association
AKC since the 1800's

AKC insists on 3 generation pedigree from any agency that is eligible for dbl registration, where as the others DO NOT require any past pedigree! Others will accept a picture!

As a breeder there is comfort knowing when I bought my Yorkies I knew their past as well as I was able to contact some of the breeders to verify health of the lineage before breeding.

AKC will accept other registries....A dog whelped in the United States that is individually registered with one of the Domestic Registry Organizations listed may be eligible for registration. A three-generation certified Pedigree issued by the domestic registry organization must accompany the application for AKC registration.

Note: If the Sire and Dam of the dog, for which registration is sought are registered with the AKC, the dog is not eligible for registration in the AKC's Stud Book on the basis of its registration with another USA registry body. Standard AKC registration procedures must be followed.

Yorkease · 03-04-2005, 08:26 AM

I think we would all agree that everyone that considers on buying a pup needs to do the research on the breed right? So if they buy a yorkipoo expecting a full blooded Yorkshire Terrier do they really need one. If they do the research they should know how to tell the difference.

I am sorry. I will shut up now. I don't want to make anyone mad. It is just that my dogs are CKC Registered and I don't have mutts - they are full blooded.

sexcbrucelee · 03-04-2005, 08:33 AM

with that in mind... femin and yorkease: can you tell me how many litters you haver per year??? i'm assuming both of you are experienced breeders...

feminvstr · 03-04-2005, 08:37 AM

Indications for a DNA Profile

Many breeders voluntarily submit samples of their sires, dams and offspring. This helps them give a guarantee to the buyer of the puppy and adds to their reputation. There are times, however, that the AKC requires DNA profiling in order to register a certain dog or puppies.

Sires that produce seven or more litters in a lifetime must be DNA certified.

Any dog that produces more than three litters in a calendar year must be DNA certified.

Since 1998, DNA certification is required for all stud dogs whose semen is collected for fresh, extended or frozen use. This includes semen imported from outside the United States.

In addition to reviewing litter and dog records and checking dog identification, inspectors also collect DNA samples from litters and their sires or dams. If any discrepancies are found such as puppies not actually being a product of the dam or sire of record, litter registration is canceled or corrected. The AKC disciplines kennels that have more than one litter excluded within 3 years. If repeated problems occur, the AKC privileges may be withdrawn.

sexcbrucelee · 03-04-2005, 08:38 AM

I know this guy from online who live on a farm and breeding yorkies is all he do. I think at one time he told me he sold over 100 yorkies that year and he made $100,000 tax free as he only sell for CASH... his wife had a real job and they can hide their income under her legal income. I have never heard of such an operation before until I chat with him... and looking at his pix.. he take good care of them.. so who am i to say it is right or wrong.. just different. He was driving in golf cart playing with them.... interesting life I told him.

Yorkease · 03-04-2005, 08:54 AM

I don't consider myself to be experienced. I learn new things everyday and I research like crazy. I have learned a lot from this site as well. I have 1 male and 2 females and so far I am only getting one litter per year. I let them figure out when is the best time for them to breed. I don't force them, I just watch the heat cycle and separate my maltese from my yorkies. I only have two maltese. When it gets close for them to deliver the moms will follow my husband around everywhere in the house and even to the bedroom. When they are ready to deliver they go to my husband's home office to be with him every second. I have the best husband in the world he is right there with us the whole time.

feminvstr · 03-04-2005, 09:00 AM

Yorkese- please dont be offended by my opinions

Would I buy a CKC and place him/her in my breeding program? no....

As a consumer buying a pet, would I buy CKC? that would depend on my impression of the bitch and dog (onsite) and of course the quality of the breeder, as I am sure there are respectable and trust worthy CKC breeders out there.

But I must admit I have never considering buying any animal without AKC.

To further explain my mother was a breeder of tea cup poodles and Boxers since the year I was born (All AKC) so perhaps some of my reasons are because that is what I trust and know. Nothing more nothing less its just my personal preference.

The tougher the registration process for a purebred animal IMHO the safer a consumer is and the standard of the breed is protected.

sexcbrucelee · 03-04-2005, 09:30 AM

so femin: how many litters do you have a year???

Yorkease · 03-04-2005, 09:33 AM

Feminvstr,

I'm not offended. I don't offend very easily. I really respect an honest opinion and one who is willing to stand by that and not reverse themselves without just cause.
I usually don't sell to breeders anyway unless I know them very well.
I know an AKC Breeder that said mixed breeds should be knocked in the head. CAN YOU IMAGINE!! I don't breed for deformaties but if it ever happened I darn sure wouldn't do that! I don't care if the baby had 7 toes on each foot I still wouldn't do that, let alone kill it just because it was a mixed breed. She said it shouldn't get out that AKC's had mixed breeds. I guess that is what left a bad taste in my mouth. You've got good ones and bad ones everywhere. I just don't want to be stereo-typed as a bad breeder because of the registry I choose. That's all.

waistfull · 03-04-2005, 09:46 AM

APR American Pet Registry is what some pet stores are using here in Maryland. A yorkie was $1500 at the store with a bald spot and did not look healthy. I asked about the health and the store says that the vet checked her and she's fine. I asked about her weight and they said 2 lbs and she's 12 weeks. She felt more like 4. I would have never bought her, but was just curious. I feel that that store should not be selling puppies and I told them as much. I told them they needed to clean out the cages and they had 2 puppies in a small cage. I asked about the health department they refused to talk. Is there a place a can make a complaint???

03-04-2005, 07:54 AM	#16
feminvstr Donating YT 4000 Club Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Portland Oregon Posts: 4,405	AKC-ILP program SexBrucelee: AKC does have ILP program which allows non AKC animals to compete... Indefinite Listing Privilege Program (ILP): The program that provides purebred dogs a second chance. There are various reasons why a purebred dog might not be eligible for registration. The dog may the product of an unregistered litter, or have unregistered parents. The dog's papers may have been withheld by its breeder or lost by its owner. Sometimes, it is the dog itself that was "lost." There are many dogs enrolled in the ILP program after they have been surrendered or abandoned, then adopted by new owners from animal shelters or purebred rescue groups. The ILP program allows the dog and owner a second chance at discovering the rewards of participating in AKC events. __________________ Kimberly

03-04-2005, 08:13 AM	#18
kindness_001 Yorkies LUV never grows old Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Owensville,In.47665 Posts: 889	Apr will not register a dog unless it has akc in the bloodline. Akc keeps getting higher and stricker People don't like it but it keeps you from getting a yorkiepoo or some other mix. Ckc is stricker in Canada than in the U S Ukc is suppose to be right up there with AKC from what i've heard. and some of the breeders that have gone to ckc have gotten into trouble with AKC and don't want to put up with them.Let's be honest. __________________ Megan, Killer, Cocoa Latte, and Ebony Lousie

03-04-2005, 08:20 AM	#21
feminvstr Donating YT 4000 Club Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Portland Oregon Posts: 4,405	SexBrucelee..... "I come to the conclusion that AKC is just one big monopoly. Everyone else will accept AKC registered pups but they won't accept anyone else.?? " It comes down to Quality not Quantity.... To reg' a litter of puppies is not expensive I believe it cost me $34.00 also I did it online and received the papers in less than 7 days. CKC has only be in business since 1996 - CONTINENTAL KENNEL CLUB ACA for 20 years - American Canine Association AKC since the 1800's AKC insists on 3 generation pedigree from any agency that is eligible for dbl registration, where as the others DO NOT require any past pedigree! Others will accept a picture! As a breeder there is comfort knowing when I bought my Yorkies I knew their past as well as I was able to contact some of the breeders to verify health of the lineage before breeding. AKC will accept other registries....A dog whelped in the United States that is individually registered with one of the Domestic Registry Organizations listed may be eligible for registration. A three-generation certified Pedigree issued by the domestic registry organization must accompany the application for AKC registration. Note: If the Sire and Dam of the dog, for which registration is sought are registered with the AKC, the dog is not eligible for registration in the AKC's Stud Book on the basis of its registration with another USA registry body. Standard AKC registration procedures must be followed. __________________ Kimberly

03-04-2005, 08:26 AM	#22
Yorkease YT Addict Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Sardis TN Posts: 358	I think we would all agree that everyone that considers on buying a pup needs to do the research on the breed right? So if they buy a yorkipoo expecting a full blooded Yorkshire Terrier do they really need one. If they do the research they should know how to tell the difference. I am sorry. I will shut up now. I don't want to make anyone mad. It is just that my dogs are CKC Registered and I don't have mutts - they are full blooded. __________________ Yorkease

03-04-2005, 08:37 AM	#24
feminvstr Donating YT 4000 Club Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Portland Oregon Posts: 4,405	Dna Indications for a DNA Profile Many breeders voluntarily submit samples of their sires, dams and offspring. This helps them give a guarantee to the buyer of the puppy and adds to their reputation. There are times, however, that the AKC requires DNA profiling in order to register a certain dog or puppies. Sires that produce seven or more litters in a lifetime must be DNA certified. Any dog that produces more than three litters in a calendar year must be DNA certified. Since 1998, DNA certification is required for all stud dogs whose semen is collected for fresh, extended or frozen use. This includes semen imported from outside the United States. In addition to reviewing litter and dog records and checking dog identification, inspectors also collect DNA samples from litters and their sires or dams. If any discrepancies are found such as puppies not actually being a product of the dam or sire of record, litter registration is canceled or corrected. The AKC disciplines kennels that have more than one litter excluded within 3 years. If repeated problems occur, the AKC privileges may be withdrawn. __________________ Kimberly

03-04-2005, 08:14 AM	#19
sexcbrucelee Yorkie Yakker Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 68	oh is that so??/ then I stand corrected.... thanks for the info.

03-04-2005, 08:18 AM	#20
sexcbrucelee Yorkie Yakker Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 68	Is it true?? i read somewhere that with AKC.. if a stud sire 3 dam in one calender year.. he needs to have a DNA test done?? What if he sire 3 dam one each year for 3 years...does he need DNA test done also???

03-04-2005, 08:33 AM	#23
sexcbrucelee Yorkie Yakker Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 68	with that in mind... femin and yorkease: can you tell me how many litters you haver per year??? i'm assuming both of you are experienced breeders...

03-04-2005, 08:38 AM	#25
sexcbrucelee Yorkie Yakker Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 68	I know this guy from online who live on a farm and breeding yorkies is all he do. I think at one time he told me he sold over 100 yorkies that year and he made $100,000 tax free as he only sell for CASH... his wife had a real job and they can hide their income under her legal income. I have never heard of such an operation before until I chat with him... and looking at his pix.. he take good care of them.. so who am i to say it is right or wrong.. just different. He was driving in golf cart playing with them.... interesting life I told him.

03-04-2005, 08:54 AM	#26
Yorkease YT Addict Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Sardis TN Posts: 358	I don't consider myself to be experienced. I learn new things everyday and I research like crazy. I have learned a lot from this site as well. I have 1 male and 2 females and so far I am only getting one litter per year. I let them figure out when is the best time for them to breed. I don't force them, I just watch the heat cycle and separate my maltese from my yorkies. I only have two maltese. When it gets close for them to deliver the moms will follow my husband around everywhere in the house and even to the bedroom. When they are ready to deliver they go to my husband's home office to be with him every second. I have the best husband in the world he is right there with us the whole time. __________________ Yorkease

03-04-2005, 09:00 AM	#27
feminvstr Donating YT 4000 Club Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Portland Oregon Posts: 4,405	Yorkese- please dont be offended by my opinions Would I buy a CKC and place him/her in my breeding program? no.... As a consumer buying a pet, would I buy CKC? that would depend on my impression of the bitch and dog (onsite) and of course the quality of the breeder, as I am sure there are respectable and trust worthy CKC breeders out there. But I must admit I have never considering buying any animal without AKC. To further explain my mother was a breeder of tea cup poodles and Boxers since the year I was born (All AKC) so perhaps some of my reasons are because that is what I trust and know. Nothing more nothing less its just my personal preference. The tougher the registration process for a purebred animal IMHO the safer a consumer is and the standard of the breed is protected. __________________ Kimberly

03-04-2005, 09:30 AM	#28
sexcbrucelee Yorkie Yakker Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 68	so femin: how many litters do you have a year???

03-04-2005, 09:33 AM	#29
Yorkease YT Addict Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Sardis TN Posts: 358	Feminvstr, I'm not offended. I don't offend very easily. I really respect an honest opinion and one who is willing to stand by that and not reverse themselves without just cause. I usually don't sell to breeders anyway unless I know them very well. I know an AKC Breeder that said mixed breeds should be knocked in the head. CAN YOU IMAGINE!! I don't breed for deformaties but if it ever happened I darn sure wouldn't do that! I don't care if the baby had 7 toes on each foot I still wouldn't do that, let alone kill it just because it was a mixed breed. She said it shouldn't get out that AKC's had mixed breeds. I guess that is what left a bad taste in my mouth. You've got good ones and bad ones everywhere. I just don't want to be stereo-typed as a bad breeder because of the registry I choose. That's all. __________________ Yorkease

03-04-2005, 09:46 AM	#30
waistfull Donating Senior Yorkie Talker Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Maryland Posts: 1,861	APR American Pet Registry is what some pet stores are using here in Maryland. A yorkie was $1500 at the store with a bald spot and did not look healthy. I asked about the health and the store says that the vet checked her and she's fine. I asked about her weight and they said 2 lbs and she's 12 weeks. She felt more like 4. I would have never bought her, but was just curious. I feel that that store should not be selling puppies and I told them as much. I told them they needed to clean out the cages and they had 2 puppies in a small cage. I asked about the health department they refused to talk. Is there a place a can make a complaint???