tails?

[roxies_mom]

Originally Posted by vickii-116

ohhh yess .... i dont think any dog deserves having their tails cut off... we wouldnt cut off anything on our human babies so why do it to dogs?

ahhh but they do...it's called circumcision. I chose not to do this to any of my sons. It's personal choice.

[roxies_mom]

I decided to google for reasons of tail docking. Here is a link with some information for anyone interested:

Tail Docking - The Case for Tail Docking

[MindieRose]

Originally Posted by roxies_mom

I decided to google for reasons of tail docking. Here is a link with some information for anyone interested:

Tail Docking - The Case for Tail Docking

That was very informative, thank you

[piptickle]

Originally Posted by yorkiekist

My Yorkies have absolutely no problem communicating and there tails are docked.

Originally Posted by MindieRose

So because your dog's have their tails, they fight less? My yorkies have never fought and they are docked. I would like to know how a dog with a tail can communicate better than one with a shorter tail, morse code? I am sorry, but I do not see the truth to that argument. My shih-tzus have tails and I see no difference in communication.
If someone want's a tail long or short, I don't really care, but I do not think that it is detrimental at all to shorten it.

Originally Posted by yorkieK9trainer

Ha ha ha ha!
As a family full of nubs and curly tails that are up and out of the way, I just laughed when I read some of these posts.
NUBBY tails are SO expressive! Perhaps even more exaggrated that a full tail! Sometimes the butt even gets in a sarcastic mood and helps further exaggerate their mood.

I also think it should be mentioned that you can, and I have, shown Yorkies WITH full tails. I simply prefer not to. Same with my BRTs.

I never said that dogs with docked tails are'nt cute, I think the little stumpy tails are adorable I just don't think there is any point unless its for medical/safety reasons. And I'm not saying that dogs with docked tails will fight more, its just that dogs DO use their tails to communicate both with us and each other and it must be a handicap to be without one. Their tails are just sooo versatile and they stand a much better chance of being understood if they have them and so less chance of being misinterprated!

I found this online but theres lots more info out there, and I do believe its just a matter of time before the practise is banned in the US. There were those who believed it would never be banned here either but common sense will prevail.

Tail

How high or low the tail is held, in relation to how the dog's breed naturally carries their tail, and how it is moved can signify the dog's mood. When the tail is held high, shows that the dog is alert; Tail between the legs means that the dog is afraid. If the fur on the tail is also bristled, the dog is saying they are willing to defend.

Small, slow wags of the tail says the dog is questioning things around them. Either they aren't sure if the target dog or person is friendly, or they aren't sure what is going on or what is expected of them.

Large, fast wags of the tail is a sign of a happy or excited dog. If the wags are large enough to pull the dog's hips with them, the message includes a bit of submission to someone they view as pack leader.

Dogs with docked tails, as some Dobermans may have, have some problems communicating with other dogs, since their tail movements are extremely difficult to detect. Dogs with docked tails will usually compensate for this by wagging their entire rear end.

Left-right asymmetry of the tail wags is likely to also convey information along the approach/avoidance axis.[1]

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by piptickle

I do believe its just a matter of time before the practise is banned in the US. There were those who believed it would never be banned here either but common sense will prevail.

Generally speaking, for the time being, it's allowed and it's the standard. Until something changes in one of the two areas, the majority of breeders will continue to dock. You can love it or hate it, but in the end, you can't do anything about it...except complain...at least until we barbarians here in the US 'catch up' and find our common sense. (Darn it, and all this time I never realized mine was missing...lol. )

[roxies_mom]

Originally Posted by MindieRose

That was very informative, thank you

Your welcome. I found it interesting as well. It really started out about the same as cirumcision and piercings did. I think it's all cultural and some things just stick over time. Funny after so many years of it that no one really remembers why it's done or how it started in the first place they just follow it as common practice. Circumcision was also done for cleanliness purposes way back when men roamed the desert and had a hard time keeping it clean. It's not necessary now due to soap and water not being a problem. Anything that your uncomfortable doing you should just discuss it with your vet in this case and ask questions.

[beemidiwfe]

It would be an interesting turn of events if tail and ear docking of dogs was outlawed as cruel and it remained legalfor human baby boys to be strapped down while a part of their penis was amputated.

Both are unnecessary cosmetic surgeries

[hugz4all4]

Originally Posted by MollysMum54

as its a discussion forum, i think i have as much right to call it barbaric as you do to call it ok. We are never going to agree on it i guess...but i still dont think its right!
..please dont dock my tail..i like to wag it when im pleased to see you.

your right it is a public forum so call it what you like and no we will never agree on this topic because I think yorkies with tails look out of place but that is my opioion and because this is a public forum I have the right to say that... oh and I LOVE IT WHEN MY PUP WAGS HIS LITTLE NUB WHEN HE IS HAPPY TO SEE ME!!

[QuickSilver]

I've already said where I stand on ear & tail docking, but I did want to add some random stuff about circumcision:

- Adult men who have it done for various reasons say it is excrutiatingly painful, and I believe it probably is for baby boys as well.

- There have been various reasons for circumcision, some timely, some not. Cleanliness is one reason cited. It caught on in Europe way back when because it was thought to discourage masturbation. Doctors often recommend it in areas with high incidence of HIV, since circumcision reduces the risk of STIs.

- One of my friends is a nurse and she is HIGHLY in favor of it. Her reason? She's had to give eighty-year-old men sponge baths!

[MindieRose]

Originally Posted by QuickSilver

I've already said where I stand on ear & tail docking, but I did want to add some random stuff about circumcision:

- Adult men who have it done for various reasons say it is excrutiatingly painful, and I believe it probably is for baby boys as well.

- There have been various reasons for circumcision, some timely, some not. Cleanliness is one reason cited. It caught on in Europe way back when because it was thought to discourage masturbation. Doctors often recommend it in areas with high incidence of HIV, since circumcision reduces the risk of STIs.

- One of my friends is a nurse and she is HIGHLY in favor of it. Her reason? She's had to give eighty-year-old men sponge baths!

Much like tail docking, people have the right to chose on this one . I circ'd my boys, and if I have more, will continue to. I am not ignorant on the subject, and if there is one thing that irritates me about this, is that those that think that they are so enlightened about it, believe that those of us that believe in it are ignorant about it. I firmly stand by a parent's right to chose circing for their son's. Not that this has anything to do with tail docking

[MindieRose]

Originally Posted by beemidiwfe

Both are unnecessary cosmetic surgeries

In your opinion

[jencar98]

Originally Posted by QuickSilver

I've already said where I stand on ear & tail docking, but I did want to add some random stuff about circumcision:

- Adult men who have it done for various reasons say it is excrutiatingly painful, and I believe it probably is for baby boys as well.

- There have been various reasons for circumcision, some timely, some not. Cleanliness is one reason cited. It caught on in Europe way back when because it was thought to discourage masturbation. Doctors often recommend it in areas with high incidence of HIV, since circumcision reduces the risk of STIs.

- One of my friends is a nurse and she is HIGHLY in favor of it. Her reason? She's had to give eighty-year-old men sponge baths!

Circumcision is also done for religious reasons.

[Koran]

Both of my yorkies are docked. When I lost my mixed breed dachsund/s**tzu (sp?) mix after 17 years I thought long and hard about getting another dog. I CHOSE the yorkie breed. The reason I liked them was how they looked and their small size. The standard stated tails are docked. I wanted what I saw. One of my pups dock is tiny, the other a bit longer but in general, that little nub can tuck in fear and wag in excitement just the same. As far as the pain, reputable breeders that are good at what they do, handle the details of their breeding offspring in a manner, at least in this country, that meets the standard. With this comes AKC registration and continuance of the selective qualities of the breed. When done early AS INTENDED, it can be compared to cutting the umbilical cord on a human, most of the pups are more scared than reacting to pain, they are reacting to their surroundings being changed. As far as the mounds of videos out there, if you look hard enough you can find a video making anything look barbaric. With this, part of selecting your breeder is finding one that handles details such as this properly. The problem, and might I add, most of what you find in video, are people performing this task with less than adequate training. Yes, its a choice, but I wouldnt have it any other way.
If you do not want a docked pup you will need to find a breeder that is willing to work with you for your wishes. It is not a choice for me, my dogs are and all future ones will be. I choose to own a pure bred yorkie and will only consider yorkies that meet the standard. That doesnt make me barbaric or less humane than those who choose not to dock, it makes me an owner proud in what the breed has become and an owner willing to honor that standard.

[yorkieK9trainer]

WELCOME TO YT Koran!

[yorkiekist]

Originally Posted by Koran

Both of my yorkies are docked. When I lost my mixed breed dachsund/s**tzu (sp?) mix after 17 years I thought long and hard about getting another dog. I CHOSE the yorkie breed. The reason I liked them was how they looked and their small size. The standard stated tails are docked. I wanted what I saw. One of my pups dock is tiny, the other a bit longer but in general, that little nub can tuck in fear and wag in excitement just the same. As far as the pain, reputable breeders that are good at what they do, handle the details of their breeding offspring in a manner, at least in this country, that meets the standard. With this comes AKC registration and continuance of the selective qualities of the breed. When done early AS INTENDED, it can be compared to cutting the umbilical cord on a human, most of the pups are more scared than reacting to pain, they are reacting to their surroundings being changed. As far as the mounds of videos out there, if you look hard enough you can find a video making anything look barbaric. With this, part of selecting your breeder is finding one that handles details such as this properly. The problem, and might I add, most of what you find in video, are people performing this task with less than adequate training. Yes, its a choice, but I wouldnt have it any other way.
If you do not want a docked pup you will need to find a breeder that is willing to work with you for your wishes. It is not a choice for me, my dogs are and all future ones will be. I choose to own a pure bred yorkie and will only consider yorkies that meet the standard. That doesnt make me barbaric or less humane than those who choose not to dock, it makes me an owner proud in what the breed has become and an owner willing to honor that standard.

Very well stated!!!to YT!!!