What are Chocolate Yorkies?

[crystalsmom]

If you have one, love it but don't breed it.

[veguroev]

Wow!! all this is very interesting. I had no clue that there were such a thing as Chocolate yorkies. I learned something new today.
Happy thanksgiving everyone!

[Pinehaven]

[quote=LucyNTuckersMom;1536440]

Originally Posted by YorkyDiva

What would you like to know LucyNTuckersMom?

I was really just interested in what causes the coloring, if they are an accepted color, or a fault, and how they got started. And do 2 chocolate yorkies always make more chocolate yorkies. And are they yorkie personalities in most other ways? Are they a separate breed? Are there any medical considerations to take into account especially? Are they shown competing with regular Yorkies? If the coloration is considered a flaw, are there special chocolate Yorkie shows?

They seem to have an underground following among Yorkie enthusiasts! (But I can see they might also be a little controversial, lol). I think they are a pretty alternative, but lean a little more toward the traditional colors myself. I would never want the standard colors to go away.

I was also interested in seeing photos of the adults, and your beautiful website shows many of these, thanks for posting the link.

T

Please see the previous post on how this color came to be.

Chocolate, parti, and golden yorkies have been in the breed and culled since the early days of the breed. They've been kept secret, given away, spayed and destroyed. Until a few years ago, they were not allowed to be registered with AKC but now they are .... this is a breed registry, not a coat color registry. Though the off colored (according to YTCA's standards) black and tan/black and gold/and blue and gold were until October 1, 2007, allowed to show and win championships in AKC classes, they are no longer allowed to show in conformation classes. Parti's, chocolates and golds have never been allowed to show in conformation and now black coated yorkies fall into the same "off color" category.

The off colored dogs can show in other AKC sponsored classes though.

Chocolates have the same personality as your traditional colored yorkies, they just have a double dose of the recessive chocolate gene. They have no more health issues than our traditional colored yorkies do.

Chocolate colored yorkies are homozygous for the gene and 100% of it's offspring will get 1 copy of the gene (they will be carriers). Chocolate bred to chocolate will produce all chocolate pups and chocolate bred to chocolate carrier will produce 50% chocolate and 50% carrier pups.

I don't know about "Underground following" but since this color is eligible for registration with AKC (finally) many people/breeders are choosing to NOT cull the off colors any more.

[Pinehaven]

Originally Posted by crystalsmom

If you have one, love it but don't breed it.

Other than the dog being off color according to the YTCA's show standards, why should the dog be culled for breeding?

If this dog came out of 2 AKC registered traditional colored yorkies, why should it be culled but it's entire line of previous and future descendants not be culled? The gene came from somewhere, and both mom and dad had to be carriers despite their blue and tan coat coloring.

Just because a yorkie is blue and tan, does not mean it's any more pure than a chocolate yorkie ... it just means that any unknown recessive genes haven't surfaced yet.

[crystalsmom]

Originally Posted by Pinehaven

Other than the dog being off color according to the YTCA's show standards, why should the dog be culled for breeding?

If this dog came out of 2 AKC registered traditional colored yorkies, why should it be culled but it's entire line of previous and future descendants not be culled? The gene came from somewhere, and both mom and dad had to be carriers despite their blue and tan coat coloring.

Just because a yorkie is blue and tan, does not mean it's any more pure than a chocolate yorkie ... it just means that any unknown recessive genes haven't surfaced yet.

Sue the akc is all about keeping records. If the choc. yorkie came from a breeding of two akc reg. dogs it can be registered. They consider it a fault and that is why it cannot be shown and does not mean it meets the standard and you will not find that color as a choice but will have to send a picture etc. to get registered as a record of that breeding, only. Pure bred dogs are exactly that and we should not want to change the standard but in more cases try to breed closer to it. JMHO Happy Thanksgiving

[Pinehaven]

Originally Posted by crystalsmom

Sue the akc is all about keeping records. If the choc. yorkie came from a breeding of two akc reg. dogs it can be registered. They consider it a fault and that is why it cannot be shown and does not mean it meets the standard and you will not find that color as a choice but will have to send a picture etc. to get registered as a record of that breeding, only. Pure bred dogs are exactly that and we should not want to change the standard but in more cases try to breed closer to it. JMHO Happy Thanksgiving

YTCA considers "off colors" as a fault, they are the ones who set the standards and considers anything but blue and tan as off colored. AKC lists YTCA's standard colors, in their written choices on the registration applications (black and tan and black and gold are listed as color choices for registering puppies - YTCA clearly states that these colors as adults is NOT the standard for adults). AKC abides by YTCA's standards for showing. Since this is a breed registry, AKC allows colors other than blue and tan to be registered as you noted.

Personally, I feel that in order for a "surprise off colored" pup to be registered from a line that is not known to produce color - I think in addition to photos, AKC should also require pup, mom and dad be DNA'd - just to keep everyone on the up and up.

Standards for size have changed over the years and I'm sure we'll see more changes in the future, according to the majorities preferences. :-)

[kelleykrack]

Chocolate yorkies come from the early ancestors of the yorkies back when they orginated in scotland and were called Broken Haired Scottish Terriers. YTCA did ban them from being shown as yorkshire terriers but only so they would have to be sent through the rare breed application in January as their own breed. The American Canine Registry already recgonizes them and they have a standard on there for them. They are NOT mutations, they are NOT a fluke, they ARE VERY healthy. They are slightly bigger than standards because they have not been bred down like the standards and will not be.
This is a very touchy subject on YT so be careful what you say on here.
I have sent you a PM.

[Pinehaven]

Originally Posted by kelleykrack

Chocolate yorkies come from the early ancestors of the yorkies back when they orginated in scotland and were called Broken Haired Scottish Terriers. YTCA did ban them from being shown as yorkshire terriers but only so they would have to be sent through the rare breed application in January as their own breed. The American Canine Registry already recgonizes them and they have a standard on there for them. They are NOT mutations, they are NOT a fluke, they ARE VERY healthy. They are slightly bigger than standards because they have not been bred down like the standards and will not be.
This is a very touchy subject on YT so be careful what you say on here.
I have sent you a PM.

I have a friend who has a chocolate male he's 3 3/4 lbs as an adult, so I guess there are certain lines that are larger and some that are smaller?

[kelleykrack]

Originally Posted by Pinehaven

I have a friend who has a chocolate male he's 3 3/4 lbs as an adult, so I guess there are certain lines that are larger and some that are smaller?

Just like with any breed there can be some smaller ones. Plus you have some people who are breeding them down to be the size of the standards. If you look at the ACR website, the standards for chocolates says that they cannot be smaller than 4 pounds and up to 12 pounds.

[crystalsmom]

Originally Posted by Pinehaven

YTCA considers "off colors" as a fault, they are the ones who set the standards and considers anything but blue and tan as off colored. AKC lists YTCA's standard colors, in their written choices on the registration applications (black and tan and black and gold are listed as color choices for registering puppies - YTCA clearly states that these colors as adults is NOT the standard for adults). AKC abides by YTCA's standards for showing. Since this is a breed registry, AKC allows colors other than blue and tan to be registered as you noted.

Personally, I feel that in order for a "surprise off colored" pup to be registered from a line that is not known to produce color - I think in addition to photos, AKC should also require pup, mom and dad be DNA'd - just to keep everyone on the up and up.

Standards for size have changed over the years and I'm sure we'll see more changes in the future, according to the majorities preferences. :-)

Thanks when I said 'they' I did mean ytca. I'm sure it's helpful to everyone to know when this happens in a line. DNA might not be a bad idea. The yorkie is a dog that is born black and then at different stages of it's life changes to a combination of colors at the exact same parts of the body each time and to want to throw in a solid ?? Also the pigment being brown/liver on the nose and around the eyes changes the entire look. We do have to be careful. There was quite a heated discussion on here once and I stayed out of it but I love this breed so much I just had to say my piece. That's it for me.

[Diego]

Here's a picture of Markhus . He belong to one of my friends . The mom had just one .

[YorkyDiva]

Originally Posted by Pinehaven

I have a friend who has a chocolate male he's 3 3/4 lbs as an adult, so I guess there are certain lines that are larger and some that are smaller?

My male is 3/3/4lbs and female 5-1/2lbs, and these CHOCOLATE puppies usually range from 3-6lbs when grown. If someone has a dog that is double the normal weight standard for Yorkshire Terrier then they do have more than one issue with the YTCA Yorkshire Terrier standards and probably price their larger puppies less accordingly.
Whats this about AKC and YTCA wanting the Chocolates and Parti Yorkies to get their own rare breed classification? Can you show me on either one of their websites where this is stated by either? I am not aware of it.
As far as pictures, It is already required with AKC if you register a chocolate or liver you have to send in 2 pictures with the Puppy Application.

ACR Who ever heard of them? Guess there are a lot of new registries out there. LOL........ maybe someone who raises chocolates will think up some registry they want to name their Chocolates with and put whatever weight their dog reaches whether it be 15 or 50lbs as the weight standard. LOL
Oh wait, LOL, lets all start our own new name registry of what we want to call our dogs.LMAO
My CHOCOLATE YORKSHIRE TERRIERS are AKC registered and I intend for them to stay that way. It is just a variation of color, nothing more.

[diva pup]

Originally Posted by kelleykrack

Chocolate yorkies come from the early ancestors of the yorkies back when they orginated in scotland and were called Broken Haired Scottish Terriers. YTCA did ban them from being shown as yorkshire terriers but only so they would have to be sent through the rare breed application in January as their own breed. The American Canine Registry already recgonizes them and they have a standard on there for them. They are NOT mutations, they are NOT a fluke, they ARE VERY healthy. They are slightly bigger than standards because they have not been bred down like the standards and will not be.
This is a very touchy subject on YT so be careful what you say on here.
I have sent you a PM.

Could you please post this Standard for the chocolates on here?
Thanks.

[Pinehaven]

Originally Posted by YorkyDiva

My CHOCOLATE YORKSHIRE TERRIERS are AKC registered and I intend for them to stay that way. It is just a variation of color, nothing more.

I agree with you 100%!

Maybe kelleykrack can direct us to the ACR website and tell us a bit more about the rare breed application that was sent in jan? Was it sent to ACR or AKC?

[kelleykrack]

Originally Posted by Pinehaven

I agree with you 100%!

Maybe kelleykrack can direct us to the ACR website and tell us a bit more about the rare breed application that was sent in jan? Was it sent to ACR or AKC?

ACR is the canine registry that UKC and AKC states has to approve any new breed and set standards for before they will consider any rare breed application. We are sending it in to the UKC in January hopefully. If you look up the American Canine Registry, they are acctually way more strict than the AKC ever thought about being. All dogs have to be microchiped and DNA'd before being allowed to show. All dogs showing have to have their microchip scanned at every show to prove that they are that dog. Along with many other rules you can read on the website.