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Old 07-27-2007, 03:03 PM   #1
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Default I don't think I believe this!

Okay all you reputable breeders. I sold a pet quality pup at a good pet price with limited registration and now the new owner has decided that she wants to breed her to supply pups to her family and she wants me to reverse the registration. While trying to convince me she wrote this.

"I talked today the American Kennel Club's registering
department and they advised me most people DO NOT
blacken the box about not being able to breed her.
She went on to say that the ONLY REASON people do this
is because they are afraid of people hurting their
business of selling puppies. The health of the dog and
your reputation as a breeder was not in any way a
figure in the equation."
I was under the impression that AKC wanted us to be responsible in our breeding practises and I really doubt that AKC said this. What do you think?
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Old 07-27-2007, 03:26 PM   #2
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She lied to you. AKC would never tell a person that in the first place. She is just trying to rattle your chain. second, AKC DOES promote spay/neuter and responsible breeding.
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Old 07-27-2007, 03:29 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ladyhawk View Post
Okay all you reputable breeders. I sold a pet quality pup at a good pet price with limited registration and now the new owner has decided that she wants to breed her to supply pups to her family and she wants me to reverse the registration. While trying to convince me she wrote this.

"I talked today the American Kennel Club's registering
department and they advised me most people DO NOT
blacken the box about not being able to breed her.
She went on to say that the ONLY REASON people do this
is because they are afraid of people hurting their
business of selling puppies. The health of the dog and
your reputation as a breeder was not in any way a
figure in the equation."
I was under the impression that AKC wanted us to be responsible in our breeding practises and I really doubt that AKC said this. What do you think?

Who is this person trying to kid. We all blacken the box. Send her to me, I'll give her what to for. AKC does not promote breeding and would never tell anyone what she allegedly says they told her. AKC promotes responsibility pet ownership. I'd contact AKC and find out what the registration office is promoting and inform them to what has transpired.

Have you told this lady that selling puppies to the public is not your purpose. You are breeding for your next show dog and not to populate the world with breeding dogs.

Would I reverse a registration, no. If it were me I'd return her money and pick up the pup. Time to Spay/Nueter before letting them go out the door.
It appears she's about to violate the contract anyway.

Grrrrrrrrr.....can you tell I'm angry.....some people are just so ignorant............get a puppy and breed, make money?????

Tami, I know you on a personal level....you are one tough cookie....go after her Annie Oakley
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Last edited by Mardelin; 07-27-2007 at 03:31 PM.
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Old 07-27-2007, 03:58 PM   #4
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Thanks gals, she made me so mad she got me to shaking! Her whole thing is, I just want to breed her once before I spay her. How many times has a breeder heard that! I've told her to return the pup to me and I will gladly refund her money. So now she's trying to make it sound like I only care about making money. If that was the case I'd tell her I'd reverse the registration for $700. more or something like that. Why should I give her permission to put the pups life in danger so that she can give her family members a pup? She doesn't know a thing about yorkies or about breeding. I think your right, I'm going to have to start spaying/neutering them before they leave my home. I can tell your angry Mary, your grammar is never that bad!
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Old 07-27-2007, 04:05 PM   #5
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The lady knew the terms, conditions and restrictions that applied before she bought the pup. Secondly, your reputation and the health of the pup is a major part of the equation because that is your breed and you are not familiar with the dog she is wanting to breed it with (I assume.) So there is no telling what type of pups she will end up with not to mention what your dog could catch in the process if the proper procedure is not followed. You could tell her, as a reputable breeder you breed to perfect the breed and you know this pup is pet quality otherwise it would have been sold as Show Quality and you are not going to change your process now.
I hate that you are having to deal with this.

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Old 07-27-2007, 04:08 PM   #6
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Wow...that would REALLY tick me off too! What is really sad is, she could easily breed it anyway and not register them. What would it matter? If it's just for her family, would they really care if the pups were papered? That is a very tough situation and I would be angry as well.
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Old 07-27-2007, 04:09 PM   #7
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When you speak to an AKC rep, you will get the rules and regs..and sometimes you get personal opinions. I have had many interesting conversations with these people. It usually goes like this.."these are the rules and regs regarding this situation..but in order to make the pet buyer happy, may I suggest blah, blah, blah!!!

I support AKC, the best IMO..but they can talk two sides of their mouth. Why do they allow a breeder to produce litters without limits? There is no regulation to prevent me from producing a 100 litters a year if I wanted to so..just so I DNA the studs and keep good records.
I can sell to a broker and pet shops, AKC will not stop me..Yorkie clubs would, but not AKC. IS this in the best interest of dogs? There should not be one AKC dog in any puppymill in the country..and there are thousands upon thousands...
I find they can talk one way to a breeder and another to the pet owner.

Did the AKC actually tell her what she said..perhaps, perhaps not...I do know I have run up against this exact problem. I complained to AKC, looking for backing and support..the response I got was...and I quote.."we support responsible dog breeding, this can be done by the pet breeder as well as the show breeder."

So, I tell the pet buyer..I do not care what AKC says, until they pass a regulation preventing me from limiting regs..these are the rules!

AND..one last thing...it took years and lots of input from show breeders to get AKC to give in to limited regs..it did not exist for many, many years...is anyone naive enough to think it was a 21st century idea to do this...?

SORRY..really the last thing...this is being kept on the down low, but AKC is courting USDA breeders by sending reps to USDA conventions to lure back the ones who have left to go to APRI...AKC revenues are taking a huge hit losing these breeders...and this is common knowledge among breeders.

I still support AKC...I wish their goal was to step in a stop AKC dogs in mills. All it would take is a limit on the numbers of litters you could breed per year. Is there a need for anyone to produce more then 10 or 12 litters of one breed per year?? Maybe I am missing a point and need to be enlightened.
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Old 07-27-2007, 04:17 PM   #8
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Pat , I agree in that it does seem that AKC major concern of late is money. They'll even give you a discount on your next litter registration if you have an other litter fast enough. The message seems to be pump those pups out fast enough and we'll give you a deal. This lady was so picky about finding a reputable breeder and now she is trying to demand that I lower my principles for her. She seems to want to ignore my invitation to return my dog. Sometimes no matter how hard you try to discern a persons character you can still be fooled. I'm still in the red for my breeding program and since I don't plan to quit showing it looks like I'll remain that way. Don't try to tell me I'm just in it for the money! People can be so ignorant!
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Old 07-27-2007, 04:27 PM   #9
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Do you require a spay/neuter in your contract? If not, you might consider doing so. The breeder where I bought my Maltese has it in her contract that if I do not abide by the terms, the dog goes back to her at no charge. I didn't & don't have a problem with that because I did not intend to breed or sell my puppy but I think it might help weed out some unscrupulous buyers.
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Old 07-27-2007, 04:29 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ladyhawk View Post
Thanks gals, she made me so mad she got me to shaking! Her whole thing is, I just want to breed her once before I spay her. How many times has a breeder heard that! I've told her to return the pup to me and I will gladly refund her money. So now she's trying to make it sound like I only care about making money. If that was the case I'd tell her I'd reverse the registration for $700. more or something like that. Why should I give her permission to put the pups life in danger so that she can give her family members a pup? She doesn't know a thing about yorkies or about breeding. I think your right, I'm going to have to start spaying/neutering them before they leave my home. I can tell your angry Mary, your grammar is never that bad!

Tami,

I'd go pick up the pup. $700.00 How about another 1,500 for full breeding rights. Pretty much the same as a show dog.

It doesn't matter what she's making you feel like, I know that your first priority is for the pup. So, just go get it and be done with the woman.
Your pup will be much better off.

Mary
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Old 07-27-2007, 04:36 PM   #11
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Mary, You're right! I don't know why I'm even allowing her to discuss this!
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Old 07-27-2007, 04:39 PM   #12
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Do you require a spay/neuter in your contract? If not, you might consider doing so. The breeder where I bought my Maltese has it in her contract that if I do not abide by the terms, the dog goes back to her at no charge. I didn't & don't have a problem with that because I did not intend to breed or sell my puppy but I think it might help weed out some unscrupulous buyers.
You are a responsible pet owner.....and a contract is only as good as the 2 people signing it.

Most of us have that in our contract, I even have a specified age. I've yet had to enforce it, since my families usually have appointments set up before they walk out the door. Oh! I don't release registration papers until I have proof of spay/nueter from the performing vet. But, because of what Tami has come up against, is why so many breeder/exhibitors are spay/nuetering before a pup goes out the door.
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Old 07-27-2007, 04:48 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ladyhawk View Post
Okay all you reputable breeders. I sold a pet quality pup at a good pet price with limited registration and now the new owner has decided that she wants to breed her to supply pups to her family and she wants me to reverse the registration. While trying to convince me she wrote this.

"I talked today the American Kennel Club's registering
department and they advised me most people DO NOT
blacken the box about not being able to breed her.
She went on to say that the ONLY REASON people do this
is because they are afraid of people hurting their
business of selling puppies. The health of the dog and
your reputation as a breeder was not in any way a
figure in the equation."
I was under the impression that AKC wanted us to be responsible in our breeding practises and I really doubt that AKC said this. What do you think?
I'm not a breeder, but I don't believe it. And if she only wanted to supply her family, why would she need registration anyway. Nope. I think she's full of it.
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Old 07-27-2007, 04:59 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doortego View Post
Do you require a spay/neuter in your contract? If not, you might consider doing so. The breeder where I bought my Maltese has it in her contract that if I do not abide by the terms, the dog goes back to her at no charge. I didn't & don't have a problem with that because I did not intend to breed or sell my puppy but I think it might help weed out some unscrupulous buyers.
I have that in my contract too along with if there are any breedings I seize my dog back and puppies as well with no remuneration to the pet buyer. I also have a $5,000 fine in the contract should it be used for breeding purposes.
Yes it is true contracts are only as good as the person you enter into it with but I don't ship, deal locally, check out buyers thoroughly and for those that have ulterior motives when they hear terms of contract which I tell them over the phone before it goes any further, they decide I am far too much trouble, they can get one elsewhere where the breeder isn't going to be as much trouble.
FOr the most part, however, my pups are not sold until over 6 months of age and are spay/neutered first.
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Old 07-27-2007, 05:04 PM   #15
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I have that in my contract too along with if there are any breedings I seize my dog back and puppies as well with no remuneration to the pet buyer. I also have a $5,000 fine in the contract should it be used for breeding purposes.
Yes it is true contracts are only as good as the person you enter into it with but I don't ship, deal locally, check out buyers thoroughly and for those that have ulterior motives when they hear terms of contract which I tell them over the phone before it goes any further, they decide I am far too much trouble, they can get one elsewhere where the breeder isn't going to be as much trouble.
FOr the most part, however, my pups are not sold until over 6 months of age and are spay/neutered first.
So, many of us are beginning to tighten up our contracts, because of what Tami is encountering. But, even with these tough contracts we can still run into difficulties. I have yet to have a problem, but who knows. I too only sell locally, don't ship, and know my buyers on a personal level.
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